The Chauvin verdict is in…
…but it hasn’t been announced yet. I will update when it has been, which should be within the hour.
[UPDATE 7PM: I wasn’t home and at my computer when the verdict was announced. I commented on it briefly in this thread, but now I’m home and am starting to write a separate post about it.]
[UPDATE 8:23 PM: My new post on the verdict is here.]
But of course this means no hung jury. My guess is that there will be a conviction on the manslaughter charges, but it could be worse than that.
I very much doubt an acquittal, which I believe would be the right verdict. But I never thought there was much chance of that, even before the trial began.
The Reign of Terror starts tonight. Big time.
I predict that even if Chauvin is found guilty of the murder charge there will still be rioting. The mob won’t be denied their excuse to riot. We’ll see…
The only bright point is that this “show trial” is nearly over, nor can there be much doubt that the jurors were emotionally manipulated and terrified of opposing the will not only of the mob, but also of the entire colossus of “woke supremacy” which now reigns supreme all across the land. What is still unclear is how much burning, looting and murdering (the specialties of BLM) will occur tonight and in the days to follow. The gloating of leftists and of “woke” pundits will certainly be insufferable.
I mostly agree with you, Neo. Conviction on manslaughter, but not on anything higher. I also agree acquittal is the right verdict, but it is highly, highly unlikely.
And, I agree with Chris… regardless of what the verdict in, there will be rioting. It’s just about the scope and intensity. Conviction on second degree felony murder…riots and looting will likely be small and localized, more akin to when a sports team wins a national championship. Acquittal on all charges…expect the nationwide mayhem of last May and June x 10.
As somebody else remarked, “The question is not if the verdict will be guilty, but if it will be guilty enough.”
They will riot all the same even if he gets sent away for 20 years on second-degree murder (which I expect) because he didn’t get convicted of “1st degree murder” as Maxine Waters screamed that he should be. Anything less than 1st degree murder and the death penalty will thus be a travesty of justice and evidence of white supremacy and thus cause for riot.
Of course, this assumes that the rioters are unaware that he wasn’t even charged and thus not even eligible to be guilty of first degree murder and that Minnesota doesn’t have the death penalty.
Chauvin reportedly guilty on all counts. What a travesty.
Dear Minneapolis Police officers: Resign now, while you still can.
Chavin is a dead man walking
My heart greaves for him and his family.
It’s a social justice ruling, nothing about real justice to it.
Hope the jury and prosecution gets their wish and everything is quite and peaceful tonight.
The behavior of Maxine Waters and Joe Biden has been disgraceful. And they are just the most recent examples of disgraceful behavior around this case. The verdict, and the prosecution that preceded it, constitute an outright assault on the rule of law.
According to Andrew Branca at Legal Insurrection, there were no jury queries about anything. This is just an emotional verdict without regard to evidence. Disgraceful. I hope the various trial errors can be successfully appealed.
I am not at my computer right now, and so I’ll update the post later. I’m on my phone.
But the jury found him guilty on all counts.
Two of those counts were absurd on the face of it. And yet here we are. Mob rule plus video and MSM “justice.”
I can’t imagine how any police officer in a blue state or city can apprehend resistant criminals any more. The risks are way too high.
I predict that Minneapolis will become even more of a danger zone than it already is.
I respect the jury system. The jury saw and heard all admissible evidence.
But what was the point of the riots from last summer? Nineteen people died and millions of dollars of property was destroyed. Will the dead get their lives back? Will the destroyed property be made whole? Will the stolen personal property be returned? Of course not.
Chauvin guilty on all 3 counts
According to Thom Nickels, Philadelphia is bracing for riots too: “It now seems likely that if Chauvin receives anything less than the maximum ‘life sentence without the possibility of parole,’ Philadelphia will experience a replay of the looting and disorder that gripped the city last June after the death of George Floyd, and again in October after the shooting of Walter Wallace Jr. . . . At the city’s request, Pennsylvania governor Tom Wolf signed a Proclamation of Disaster Emergency, activating the National Guard.”
https://www.city-journal.org/philadelphia-residents-and-business-owners-brace-for-chauvin-verdict
My shuttle bus was passing by a fire station in my city when the verdict was announced. The firefighters (who were all white) were all whooping and high-fiving each other, screaming “f- that f-er!” in celebration. They knew that they were going to be out of danger tonight.
Chauvin put his life on the line every day for those citizens. Now they can’t wait to throw him to the wolves. Shameful. No wisdom. No courage.
“I respect the jury system. The jury saw and heard all admissible evidence. ”
-Cornhead
I agree with the system also. But the point of the riots is to partially have an effect upon the jury. Some people simply do not have to will to resist a mob. Especially when they are screaming outside the courthouse waiting for them to leave. This is basically 1930’s style justice in Alabama. With the races reversed.
I think thats what the organizers of the mobs completely intended. And they paid it off like leftists always do. With other peoples blood and treasure
I literally know nothing about the law, so can someone please explain to me why there are 3 separate murder/manslaughter charges for the death of one man? Shouldn’t he be guilty (or not) of just whichever one is most accurate?
The judge runs a proceeding that just begs for an appeal. The prosecution commits all manner of errors that set up an appeal. The jury finds him guilty so that there won’t be any angry riots (maybe celebratory ones?). And many months from now a mistrial and acquittal are announced, quietly. Justice is served.
The judge, in allowing this travesty of ‘justice’ and the jury’s understandable but nevertheless moral cowardice in convicting Chauvin of all charges bears a remarkable similarity to Churchill’s observation of Chamberlain’s British administration and France’s when confronted by Hitler’s insistence that the Sudetenland be surrendered to Germany;
In 1938, “Britain and France had to choose between war and dishonour. They chose dishonour. They will have war.” Winston Churchill
The majority of Minneapolis citizens, indeed in every major city… have voted to appease the beast, which will result in lawlessness and a quiescent police force. The citizenry of those cities are going to get it “good and hard”. The riots to come will be merely the ‘frosting on the cake’ they’ve baked. Every day, just leaving the house will be fraught with the potential for becoming a victim. Nor will even their homes be a safe refuge.
A new Reign of Terror will indeed start tonight.
Several people have commented about the effect this verdict will have on police officers, but it’s clear that the trial and its surrounding issues are part of a broader pattern.
As most people here know, the Justice Department has published statistics on inter-racial crime. There’s been a long-term trend in high violent crime rates by blacks against other races. For example, the ratio of black rapes of Asians to Asian rapes of blacks is close to infinite. Obviously, George Floyd didn’t attack Derek Chauvin, but Floyd was a violent criminal and a drug addict. The trial makes it clear that black criminals will always be supported by the power of the state, the media, and the mob. Consequently, black violent crime rates are going to rise dramatically.
If I lived in an area with a significant black population, I’d avoid them. If I had young children, I’d talk to them about the very real danger of violent crime by black people. I’d show them the statistics. That’s not racism; it’s reality. Say good-bye to the rule of law. It’s back to blood.
And as usual, Pelosi can’t keep her piehole shut: “@SpeakerPelosi speaking at presser with CBC: “Thank you George Floyd for sacrificing your life for justice…Because of you and because of thousands, millions of people around the world who came out for justice, your name will always be synonymous for justice.”
https://twitter.com/AlexNBCNews/status/1384619869119918083?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5Etweetembed%7Ctwterm%5E1384619869119918083%7Ctwgr%5E%7Ctwcon%5Es1_&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Flegalinsurrection.com%2F2021%2F04%2Fchauvin-reactions-twitter-lights-up-as-jury-finds-chauvin-guilty-on-all-three-counts%2F
Nothing surprising to me. I knew they would convict him of something, and likely one of the murder charges, but I did think the jury would at least try to make it look like they took it seriously even if they weren’t ever going to.
Courage is in short supply these days. Cravenness all around.
Not wishing ill on anyone, I hope that BLM and their ilk riot and loot as much as they did last summer.
Of course the jurors were frightened about what would happen, to themselves and to their community, if they acquitted Chauvin. If there is no rioting or looting, they will feel like they were justified in throwing an innocent man to a ravenous mob. But appeasement only invites aggression. Having “won,” Maxine and her mob will go after more quivering targets.
Maybe, just maybe, if all hell breaks loose again, we might realize that we have to fight.
It’s better to die on your feet than to live on your knees.
I followed the trial from Germany. Now I’m somehow scared seeing that emotions are more weighted than facts. (Johan Huizinga’s description of the Medieval Age came to my mind as well as the fact that Germans often follow the American trends). IMHO, seems that this man has to be the pawn sacrifice for others who failed.
Neo,
Don’t see your update yet, so here’s a “pre-question” based on the reports on Redstate etc. How can he be guilty of three charges: 2-deg murder, 3-deg murder, 2-deg manslaughter? There was only one death. Isn’t the jury supposed to go for the highest proven charge only? The others are “lesser included offenses”. Or is Minnesota different? Or, is the triple verdict possibly illegal? Probably not. It sounds like a CYA move by the jury; they evidently didn’t fill out the verdict form correctly. Presumably the judge has to strike the two lower verdicts and enter the highest/worst verdict only. What a mess. Unless, again, somehow Minn. is different.
It’s so difficult to consider that it’s not a joke that I live in Bizarro World. Collectively more than half the country seem out of their gourd; insisting on hyper-subjective viewpoints that are implacable and non-negotiable. Seems best, more and more to move away from The Madding Crowd; most social justice warriors are mentally ill fueled by (the now) mercilessly corrupt media. My thoughts go out to Mr. Chauvin through his awful fate and misfortune. Accepting these challenging times for what they are- I’ve for years taken comfort in this blog site from the like-minded host and posters. My personal opinion is that many people have fallen prey to a deep irredeemable unconsciousness…I’ve chosen a more reasonable path that sadly many old friends couldn’t appreciate if many subjects were even broached. Awful moment watching verdict. Awful.
This is a man who plainly died of an overdose of fentanyl, and this police officer is convicted on charges more severe than those meted out to a police officer who fatally shot a middle-aged woman in a pink bathrobe who presented no threat to him at all. The Minneapolis court system is not worth a pitcher of warm spit.
Steve Walsh . If you are the stevew at Althouse and know Pants, check out the invite email at misplacedpants at protonmail dot com
The jurors were put into an impossible position by the refusal of the authorities to protect their lives and property.
The verdicts are not surprising at all, meaning they were what I expected. With the CRT wokeness sweeping the land in what seems to me all types/strata with the possible exception of the deplorable white working class, how can one expect otherwise??
I’m past ‘surprised’ at what my country has sunk to. I’m saddened and disgusted, actually, and have been for a while now.
Copperdawg says, “My thoughts go out to Mr. Chauvin through his awful fate and misfortune.” True– and I’m concerned for the safety of the defense attorney (and family) too. His was a thankless task, but he did his best.
In regard to Biden and Pelosi, those two good Catholics: I’m reminded of a certain Roman procurator who gave into the demands of a mob rather than sticking to the principles of Roman law.
Copperdawg: Yes even though all evidence points to the contrary, part of me still thinks that somehow this crazy world will somehow go back to normal. Intellectually I can see that this is not happening but emotionally it’s hard to reconcile that the world I grew up in no longer exists. My children will have to live in a world where they have to watch what they say in public or have their lives destroyed. I hope one day new institutions can be built to replace the rotten ones that now exist but who knows how long that will take. I suppose from an objective historical point of view, it is interesting to have witnessed the peak of Western Civilization and to now witness its decline, but that is cold comfort indeed.
I think all white and Asian police and fire officials in Democrat-controlled cities with substantial black populations should begin looking for jobs in neighboring counties, out of the reach of biased and punitive juries in the cities.
I was disappointed in the guilty verdict X3, but I’d like to know if Chauvin is a closet bad apple. It seemed to me that he didn’t HAVE to kneel on Floyd’s shoulder (NOT the neck, as alleged by the prosecution) all that time. Of course this doesn’t address the actions of the other police who were on the scene.
Well, whether he’s a bad apple or not, it’s probably good for Minneapolis that he is no longer on the force. I guess I’d like to see his conviction overturned on appeal, especially if that could happen a year from now when the liberal half of America isn’t all sitting on the edge of crazy, just getting ready to jump in.
BTW, was anyone listening to NPR? They make me sick. And they get part of their funding from US taxpayers. Listening to NPR for me is kind of like at picking at a scab. It isn’t good for me, but I can’t resist.
So much, BTW, for not sequestering the jury or moving the trial. I feel like the judge bent over backwards at every single decision point. Nowadays you’re not being “fair” if you don’t concede all contentious issues to the progressives in advance of the event.
Chauvin is not important to me, but I feel like America lost a little something today.
Very surprised no questions from jury at all, even on causation, suggests didn’t really consider the legal merits.
https://legalinsurrection.com/2021/04/chauvin-trial-verdict-watch/#more-351148
Considering the jury pool is drawn from Minneapolis woke mob “defund the police” voter rolls, not so surprising.
Guilty on all counts, mob scared the crap out of the jury, jury voted for their selves over anything else…
If i was a police officer, i would let everyone go who resisted at all… period… and maybe even wave bye bye to them…
if anyone tried to say anything, they would have complete cover in not wanting to cause a problem in case the perp had a health problem or was on drugs or anything…
maybe next time the perp will just give up…
The anti-OJ verdict.
This is not the first time Chauvin has gotten into trouble for being a bit too aggressive. Chauvin had 18 complaints on his official record, two of which ended in discipline, including official letters of reprimand. Police Union rules in Minneapolis make it nearly impossible to get rid of a turbulent cop.
Human sacrifice is ugly. This is clearly a case of blacks lynching a white man.
If I lived in an area with a significant black population, I’d avoid them. If I had young children, I’d talk to them about the very real danger of violent crime by black people.
I assume you know about Derbyshire’s essay, “The Talk; non black version”
Derb’s kids are Eurasian but he was fired by National Review for writing the article.
This is not the first time Chauvin has gotten into trouble for being a bit too aggressive. Chauvin had 18 complaints on his official record, two of which ended in discipline,
He’s on the force for 17 years. That’s one complaint a year. He’s a police officer, not a hairdresser. He deals with aggressive and dishonest people every day. Why do you fancy no action was taken on 15 of those complaints?
This is not the first time Chauvin has gotten into trouble for being a bit too aggressive. Chauvin had 18 complaints on his official record, two of which ended in discipline,
Maybe but I assume you know that filing complaints about “police brutality” is a small industry in cities with large black populations.
Derb’s kids are Eurasian but he was fired by National Review for writing the article.
Nothing troublesome about that article bar the blather about ‘Intelligent Well Socialized Blacks”.
Note, in 2006, Derbyshire placed a vitriolic piece in the New English Review denouncing a book by one of National Review‘s staff editors. (The book was a critique of the abortion regime). He wasn’t disciplined at all for that. In the Lowry-Steorts editorial regime, social conservatives are expendable even when they’re on the payroll. Be mildly disrespectful of one of the Democratic Party’s client groups, and you’re out. A couple of years later, Steorts got his nose out of joint about a column by Mark Steyn, the publication’s most talented writer (Steyn had quoted an old Dean Martin joke Steorts didn’t like). Steyn was also removed from their roll of contributors, and Lowry sat on his hands. When you think about it, National Review‘s editorial posturing over the last six years is much less surprising that it seemed on first impression in 2016. The magazine’s institutional mission is to provide paid employment for its staff and contributors, nothing more, nothing less. No one not living in their households should care about that. Let it die.
F:
I stopped listening to NPR in 2001 or 2003; I couldn’t put up with the execrable Daniel Schorr opining about foreign policy and “Nixon had me on an enemies list ,,,” Morning Sedition, All Things Misconstrued, Weekend Perdition – all propaganda for progressives, indoctrination in right think.
Noah Adams, Susan Stamberg, Cokie Roberts, Linda Werthimer, Nina Totenberg, Terri Gross. What a parcel of rouges in this nation.
Exactly my point. Chauvin was a tough cop, not a social worker. It got him into trouble.
@ Watt
https://www.revisor.mn.gov/statutes/cite/609
Scroll down to “homicide” section. You can see how each offense is written in the statute.
The Mayor of DC requested and received her request that National Guard troops not be armed with firearms tonight while they protect citizens. As a former National Guardsman I just threw a fit after I read that. No wonder I am struggling with what appears to be high blood sugar levels. Got to get that checked out. Probably a lot more fit inducing things coming down the pipe….
Cue the celebratory riots (mostly peaceful). Ululation from Ilhan Omar and Rashida Tlaib, with supporting vocals by Keith Ellison.
Maybe the Capitol Police can be unarmed too, Mz Bowzer? I can rest easy knowing the mostly peaceful celebrants won’t be armed or confrontational towards LEOs or fellow citizens. It’s all fine. Be a shame if DC burned to the ground (Georgetown and NW neighborhoods, first please) before it could become a state. How flammable is that swamp anyway?
Ok the mob got the verdict they demanded. They have absolutely no reason the riot now.
Now if they riot burn cars businesses etc ect the mob should be put down like rabid dogs.
But Jack, the officer wasn’t summarily executed or “necklaced.” Get with the program.
It’s hard to satisfy or satiate a mob.
The procedure for a lawful lynching has been completed. The riots previously scheduled for ‘Not Guilty’ findings will be re-purposed for ‘Guilty’ findings so as not to inconvenience the participants. Citizens are advised to shelter in place at their option, or alternatively to participate in the riot of their choosing. Please dress appropriately.
It’s amazing to me how quickly the news organizations, even the supposedly conservative ones like NewsMax and Fox, are coming out in celebration of ‘due process’ and ‘justice’. A victory for our Brave Society.
It seems clear that Chauvin is a bit of a ‘bad apple’ when his tax evasion and other legal problems are brought into consideration. Robert Barnes has said he’s going to jail no matter what the outcome of this circus is. He’ll probably win on appeal, assuming that the courts system is still capable of rendering justice.
Leave the cities; Stay away from crowds.
@Cornhead:
Back to Blood for Whites with their wits about them. Plenty of Whites refuse to see or try to grasp it even now. For the other races, it’s always been about Blood. As it needs must be. Multi-racial Constitutional Republics and Parliamentary Democracies are unworkable abominations in the sight of Gnon.
Mass transit and urban areas are not recommended for whites, asians, or those in any uniform (LEO, EMT, Fire Fighter, National Guard).
Will an app be out to alert or predict areas of mostly peaceful protest and celebrations? Sort of like those used for traffic disruptions?
It will all be fine.
MLB strikes out yet again: Statement posted by the Pohlad family (owners of the Minnesota Twins) on the team’s website:
The events of this past year have shown just how toxic and prevalent systemic and individual racism are to our community. We understand more deeply than ever the need to listen, learn and empathize in order to find ways to move forward together to build a more just community for all.
The eyes of the world have been on the Derek Chauvin trial and now on the tragic death of Daunte Wright. We are horrified and ashamed that this keeps happening to Black people in our community and many other cities across our country.
As we await a verdict, we hope and pray our criminal justice system provides the justice George Floyd and his family deserve, though nothing can restore Mr. Floyd’s life or ease the pain of his murder. We also know that whatever the jury decides, there will still be much work to do.
Needed change cannot come quickly enough. Fixing this is on all of us. We reaffirm our pledge to be a meaningful part of that work. In June, we committed $25 million toward racial justice. We have supported local BIPOC businesses and nonprofits to help rebuild areas affected by the uprising last summer and are currently working with BIPOC communities on solutions that improve their public safety and wellbeing.
We are humbled by the scope of what needs to be accomplished and remain steadfast in our commitment to support the work of ending racial injustice in our community.
In the days and weeks ahead, please listen and treat each other with compassion and respect as we work through this together. Take care of yourselves and one another.
https://www.mlb.com/twins/news/a-message-from-the-pohlad-family
Sickening, isn’t it? Meanwhile, the Twins themselves are out of harm’s way, playing a doubleheader tonight against the A’s in Oakland.
Drug Floyd is a hero to certain segments of the population, just remember that and judge accordingly.
They won’t be safe in Oakland either. Too many crocodiles, and every one hungry.
@shadow. Thanks for the statutory reference.
I’m reading 609.035.subd. 1, last sentence, and 609.04 to mean that the state can charge you with all supportable variations of a crime category (e.g., homicide), and you can be found guilty by jury of all of them, but ultimately you are convicted of only one of them, presumably the highest/worst. By contrast, in Florida, for example, you are formally charged with only the highest/worst variation that the state thinks is supported by the evidence, and the lesser offenses are shown as options on the verdict form in descending order, but the jury can convict of only one, not “this one and everything listed below it.” (Hence my surprise at the announcement of convictions for all three variations on homicide.)
If judgment for all three offenses IS actually entered against Chauvin (i.e., my interpretation of the statutes is faulty), that would seem like a serious double jeopardy issue. Presumably, all this has been worked out in the caselaw.
https://redstate.com/bonchie/2021/04/20/breaking-police-shoot-and-kill-teenage-girl-in-ohio-angry-crowds-already-gathering-n365533
Something about two youths fighting and the deceased pulling a knife on the other. Sounds like a reason to protest mostly peacefully. Could there be something about a violent subculture at work here?
Not-My-President Joe Biden committed ANOTHER impeachable act today. He made a statement on a trial that was in process.
I hope that if we R’s take back the House in 2022 there will be a bill of impeachment to follow sometime in 2023.
The BLM/ANTIFA mob is now in control. And the POTUS is on their side. The DOJ will do nothing. The FBI doesn’t care. Police will be loathe to try to arrest any POC who resists physically. As G.B. says, the blue cities and states are going to get it, good and hard.
CRT and BLM are Marxists using race, rather than class, as the struggle between the oppressed and oppressor. Most Americans have not figured this out. The MSM, who are co-conspirators, are purposely hiding the fact that they are Marxists who want the end of private property, no more of individual rights, no more equality under the law, no more federalism, and no free speech. If and when ordinary Americans understand what is afoot, I hope massive resistance will begin. We have to call them what they are – Communists. And we have to understand what they intend.
The threat of violence over the Chauvin trial is typical of what we can expect going forward. It is a fight for the soul of the nation.
Sounds as if he’s up for more time than Noor (aka “who?”),the MPD cop who murdered Damond (aka “who?”).
Any idea why that might be?
My new post on the verdict is here.
Richard Aubrey:
Well Noor killed Christine Damond in Minneapolis and did get convicted. The Capitol Policeman who executed Ashli Babbitt (RIP) isn’t to be named or tried. Another profound mystery, woke justice in action,
It is true that the local newspaper gave out a lot of info about the jurors, including enough so that people could figure out who they were w/o too much trouble. The paper put this info online and even waived the online fee so everyone could read it.
Gregory Harper:
I feel the same way, except for one thing: I don’t think America is coming back from this. The left has gained too much control over too many institutions – the most important being the press and the educational system.
I hope I’m wrong, but I think we reached critical mass in the last year. Maybe earlier.
No, no, no. None of this “we” shit. Not until the last of the church ladies has been chased through the streets screaming in terror, run down, and kicked to death by a mob.
After that, the term “we” may have some residual significance.
But then, just my moral judgment. Those who wish to go to the mat for the emotionalist morons who have brought this all about, are of course free to do so.
Some people get off on that kind of thing.
re: JJ above . . .”We have to call them what they are – Communists.”
Absolute TRUTH!
MLB strikes out yet again: Statement posted by the Pohlad family (owners of the Minnesota Twins) on the team’s website:
If justice is done, they go under. Gradually, then suddenly.
It seems clear that Chauvin is a bit of a ‘bad apple’ when his tax evasion and other legal problems are brought into consideration.
I don’t think you’d make a better juror than the clowns responsible for this horror.
OM
Regarding NPR: I too stopped listening around 2001. Then just recently I tuned in because my east-coast daughter was in town. I have continued to listen after she returned home, mostly (as I said) because it is like picking a scab.
But I find myself listening less and less. It seems pointless to listen to committed Marxists parroting their catechism. And they all come across as SO unctuous! But I tune in occasionally to rekindle my ire over the fact that my taxes support this biased programming. A lot of NPR stations are programmed out of universities. How did our universities get to be so self-congratulatory and leftist?