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Home » And then there’s the reaction to al-Baghdadi’s death

And then there’s the reaction to al-Baghdadi’s death

The New Neo Posted on by

Lindsey Graham says “This is a moment where President Trump’s worst critics should say, ‘Well done, Mr. President.'”

That Lindsey Graham, always making with the jokes.

Because obviously that’s not going to happen. And as proof, we have: Trump went into “irresponsible” detail when he described the raid, Pelosi’s complaint that Trump told the Russians but not her and her Congressional band of leakers and carpers, Richard Engel saying the Kurds are still pissed, criticism of the situation room photo, and my own (and perhaps everyone’s) personal favorite:

There are many ways to describe a terror leader in a headline. But the Washington Post is getting ripped this morning for referring to ISIS leader Abu Bakr al-Baghdadi in a headline as an “austere religious scholar.”

This headline was no accident, nor was it rushed. In fact, the original WaPo headline was “Islamic State’s terrorist-in-chief” and they changed to “austere religious scholar.” That shows a certain amount of contemplation. They got so much flak for the “religious scholar” designation that now they’ve settled on “extremist leader of Islamic State,” a still-tepid description for a man so vile and sadistic.

It makes one wonder what the present-day editors of the WaPo would make of Hitler’s death if they had to report it all over again:

“Animal-loving vegetarian with ambitious plans dies tragically”

Or Stalin’s:

“Former seminary student who became leader of a great nation is deeply mourned”

ADDENDUM:

I wasn’t far off from what was the actual NY Times headline for Stalin’s obit, which read, “Stalin Rose From Czarist Oppression to Transform Russia Into Mighty Socialist State.” [Hat tip: Ed Driscoll at Instapundit.]

Wow. That seems to be a real Times headline and not a parody site.

Comments

And then there’s the reaction to al-Baghdadi’s death — 88 Comments

  2. Andy:

    Yes.

    Fortunately Pelosi doesn’t control any vital airspace, because she probably wouldn’t have given Trump permission.

  4. I chose a WaPo obituary from biblical times:

    “Haman, chief minister of King Ahasuerus and committed Persian nationalist, dies along with his 10 sons during a Jewish revolt in Shushan.”

  5. Is WaPo headline correct … “austere religious scholar.” I’d say yes. Now what does this say about Islam in general? Islam is what it is and al-Baghdadi is a perfect example of what Islam represents.

  6. Hitler’s death if they had to report it all over again:

    “Animal-loving vegetarian with ambitious plans dies tragically”

    LOL

    Non-smoker, enthusiastic proponent of health and fitness, attended by wildly adoring crowds, often expressing a paternal fondness for children and animals, rescued his population from political chaos and the depths of a capitalism triggered international economic crisis, brought his nation to its greatest influence and geographical extent by recovering lost territories and uniting with … however a not unmixed record generally admitted to have been marred by a serious overreach of ambitions and a sometimes utilitarian stance toward the civil good of those not part of the majority …. blah blah …

    And then there’s Lucifer … “Who has risen to prominence by resisting the ultimate patriarch and by insisting on the actual exercise and integration of the freedom promised to him and implicit in his nature, and who by force of personality drew a third of the population along with him ….

  8. Consolidated comment from the previous topic:
    _________________________________________
    “Austere religious scholar.”

    That’s a new, utterly shameless low, even for WaPo.

    Baghdadi didn’t just have sex slaves, he had a young American sex slave, Kayla Mueller, whom he personally raped and tortured. Nonetheless, by all accounts she was brave and offered comfort to others. Mueller survived 18 months.

    The Baghdadi mission was named for Kayla Mueller.

    https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2015/02/15/kayla-mueller-final-months-detailed/23455047/

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kayla_Mueller

    That Muslims routinely consider psychopathic monsters like Bin Laden and Baghdadi to be respected religious leaders is something I hold against Islam, Islamophobe that I am.

  9. From one of Trump’s worst critics — @MittRomney:

    Al Baghdadi spread ‘fire and brimstone’ on earth; now he feels it for himself in hell. To all who arranged his change of venue—the intel officers, the President, the warriors—thank you.

  10. Ann:

    I find it rather odd that you characterize Romney as “one of Trump’s worst critics.” I don’t think he’s even remotely in that league.

    First of all, he’s sometimes praised things Trump has done. Secondly, he’s never entered the territory of Trump’s worst critics in terms of invective; not even close. Thirdly, he’s a Republican and retains basic adherence to many of the major goals of the GOP, unlike the vast majority of Trump’s worst critics (and I include in that group some Never-Trumpers who used to be on the right and who prefer that Hillary had won).

    It doesn’t surprise me in the least that Romney praised Trump for this.

  11. I agree with what you say, Neo. But I do think some others here have complained of Romney’s being one of the very worst. I should have put that “worst critics” in quotes.

  12. Ann:

    I believe that you are incorrect. I cannot remember any commenter here saying Romney was one of the very worst.

    And just now I skimmed the many comments to two recent posts of mine about Romney and I could see nothing of the sort.

  13. Surfing the web, I ran across another crazy obit from the other Paper of Record:

    March 6, 1953
    Stalin Rose From Czarist Oppression to Transform Russia Into Mighty Socialist State
    By THE NEW YORK TIMES

    Joseph Stalin became the most important figure in the political direction of one-third of the people of the world. He was one of a group of hard revolutionaries that established the first important Marxist state and, as its dictator, he carried forward its socialization and industrialization with vigor and ruthlessness.

    http://movies2.nytimes.com/learning/general/onthisday/bday/1221.html
    ____________________________________________________

    Good of the NYT to mention “ruthlessness” and later, “purges” but one searches in vain for mention of “gulag” or “camp” or “terror famine” or actual numbers of Stalin’s victims.

  15. Then there’s Trump’s needless “whimpering, crying, and screaming all the way” comment that could have been left unsaid. My concern is that American soldiers are attacked somewhere ending with missing soldiers, followed a week later with some particularly ugly and heart-rending videos. Thats the part of the 3D playing genius Im opposed to. Thank the soldiers for their excellent execution of their raid in public. Save the “whimpering, crying, and screaming all the way” for the private party afterwards.

  17. Harry. If you’ve been paying attention, the jihadis love that footage. They don’t need Trump to do it to US troops.

  18. Harry, what else are you concerned about? That al Baghbadis didn’t get a proper Islamic burial?

    Go pound sand.

  19. Then there’s Trump’s needless “whimpering, crying, and screaming all the way” comment that could have been left unsaid.

    Harry: Maybe needless for you, but exposing these monsters as monsters works for me.

    The monsters already hate our soldiers and are working to kill them. As far as I’m concerned it’s concern trolls like you who are endangering Americans by demanding we be more delicate when it comes to jihadist feelings.

    When jihadists get the message that Americans are resolute in opposition and jihadists will take 10x or 100x casualties in response, our soldiers will be safer.
    _________________________________

    When people see a strong horse and a weak horse, by nature they will like the strong horse.

    –Osama Bin Laden

  20. Interesting. Not a single “Yeah, he could have left that bit out’. No, suddenly I’m super woke.
    In fact “om”, I think al Baghbadis self burial, ala explosive vest, was appropriate.

    Huxley: Trump had said the evil monster thing about al Baghbadi, and I have absolutely no problem with that. My problem was exactly what I said I had a problem with.

  21. I liked the “whimpering, crying, and screaming all the way” comment. Showed what a scum coward he was.

  23. Harry:

    The “whimpering, crying” bit was for the honor/shame culture denizens because it devalues Baghdadi as a heroic martyr to follow. I think it was an excellent addition and see no way that it increases the risk for US forces. The haters already hate quite maximally anyway.

  25. Thats a great point to consider Neo, with that particular culture. I took it as more needless boasting. Thanks for the reply.

  26. “Then there’s Trump’s needless “whimpering, crying, and screaming all the way” comment that could have been left unsaid.” Harry

    Most every politician would have left that accurate characterization unsaid. Which BTW is why we’re still fighting jihadists.

    Fortunately, Trump understands how to deal with homicidal fanatics. Kill jihadists and the Imams and Mullahs who recruit jihadists in an ‘unclean’ manner, ‘salt’ the ground with pig’s blood (no paradise for them…) and then piss on their open graves.

    Put the proverbial fear of ‘allah’ into those who would pursue jihad.

    You gain leverage over a mortal enemy by connecting to their actions, what for them is intolerable consequence.

  28. Thats a great point to consider Neo, with that particular culture. I took it as more needless boasting. Thanks for the reply.

    Harry: You more often might consider the possibility that Trump isn’t just spouting off and those of us who support him aren’t just being stupid or partisan.

    Your notion that you offer robust arguments while we make foolish, unsupported, partisan claims comes under the heading of a “Russell Conjugation”:

    I am firm, you are obstinate, he is a pig-headed fool.

    I am righteously indignant, you are annoyed, he is making a fuss over nothing.

    –https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Emotive_conjugation

  29. Harry:

    I have found that quite a bit of what appears to be needless boasting by Trump is actually strategic.

    Although some needless boasting remains.

    But the minute I heard him say the phrase you mention, I saw it as a smart move given the honor/shame culture.

  30. One of my hates about Trump Derangement Syndrome, is where his opponents rage about something that Trump does that are exactly what Obama did in the same situation.

    KROFT: You didn’t tell anybody in the Pakistani government or the military…or their intelligence community?

    OBAMA: No.

    KROFT: Because you didn’t trust them?

    OBAMA: As I said, I didn’t tell most people here in the White House. I didn’t tell my own family. It was that important for us to maintain operational security.

  31. Hey, Nancy and Schiff had no idea the air space was controlled by Russia! They have heard of Russia, collusion, impeach, and get rich from Ukraine corruption. Neither should never be allowed anywhere near the Situation Room. Ever.

  32. Thats the part its hard for me to distinguish neo, the needless from the necessary boasting from this guy, and thats from a guy who’s fairly committed to voting for him again, much less people that might still be on the fence.

    Huxley: “Your notion that you offer robust arguments while we make foolish, unsupported, partisan claims comes under the heading of a “Russell Conjugation”

    That might be so, if I had made any claims in this thread. In fact I hadnt. I did note that both yourself , “om” and others came to an immediate defense of Trump with less than “robust” arguments. Maybe you could use that website you offred.

  33. Trump is correct about his statements regarding this insect of a being. He was a coward, loser and an terrible creature. Remember this;

    https://www.azcentral.com/story/news/local/arizona/2019/10/27/dead-isis-leader-abu-bakr-al-baghdadi-held-arizona-kayla-mueller-hostage/2478713001/

    And remember this;

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Genocide_of_Yazidis_by_ISIL

    I think it was a great idea not to inform Pelosi, because it would have been leaked. His non scholarly studies were twisted into the most monstrous ideology that lacked any compassion or true faith. Bravo to Trump! No new wars and this. It is good news.

  34. “…incorrect…”

    Indeed; but since it’s entirely possible that Ann is referring to the mittological Pierre (alter ego extraordinaire)…
    …then both of you are right!!!

    Amazingly.

  35. Then there’s Trump’s needless “whimpering, crying, and screaming all the way” comment that could have been left unsaid.

    Harry: if you don’t think that’s a claim, you are mistaken.

    And if we come to an immediate defense of Trump, that doesn’t necessarily mean we haven’t thought things through by our lights.

    If you disagree, fine. Make your claims, show your work and we’ll debate it out. But this constant condescension, that you are the thoughtful person and we aren’t, really grates.

  36. Then there’s that poignant obit for Pol Pot, who having fundamentally transformed Cambodia died—tragically—at the relatively young age of 73….
    “He made his mark on his native land and had so much more to contribute….”

  37. John Hinderacker: MUSSOLINI CANCELS THE TIMES AND THE POST

    On Tuesday, the White House announced that it is terminating its subscriptions to the New York Times and the Washington Post. Why not? The Times and the Post are disreputable partisan rags. They have no stature, no standing, and there is no reason why taxpayers should have to support their partisan journalism.

    Trump’s action provoked the usual hyperventilation from his critics. This tweet by retired liberal General Barry McCaffrey, via The Hill, is a classic:

    “Barry R McCaffrey? @mccaffreyr3

    The White House Trump statement telling the entire Federal Government to terminate subscriptions to the NYT and Wash Post is a watershed moment in national history. No room for HUMOROUS media coverage. This is deadly serious. This is Mussolini.”

  38. Huxley, what “constant condescension”? You take this way too personal. This is why you come to Trumps immediate aid, its because you take this to be an attack on your person. Try to seperate yourself from Trump from time to time. It will be less stressful for you.

  39. Try to seperate yourself from Trump from time to time. It will be less stressful for you.

    Harry: If you don’t understand that as “condescension,” you are mistaken.

  40. Harry’s just standing up for the truth behind the observed Dunning-Kruger effect huxley.

  42. It appears that Harry wants a “statesman” in the WH. Trump is no “statesman.” He’s more of a street thug when it comes to the jihadists (and other things). Maybe that’s what’s needed to defeat those people. It’s also one reason Trump got elected. The public was tired of the politicians tip toeing around these jihadist.

  43. Huxley,

    Regarding Harry, you nailed it. You’re just nicer about it than the rest of us.

    That he doesn’t see how condescending he is displays a colossal lack of self-awareness. That he whines about it when people call him on it just makes it more pathetic.

    He reminds me of this little rat kid from my neighborhood growing up that whined and tattled and talked down to all the kids. And he could never figure out why they didn’t want to include him in games. And why some just punched him in the face.

    Some would say he was bullied. But if you were there, you would have seen that he was always the kid who stuck himself where he wasn’t wanted, and when he did, couldn’t just talk baseball cards and Star Wars and BB guns. He always had to lecture and condescend. The “bullies” just wanted to do their thing but that rat kid just couldn’t go his own way.

  44. Harry is now concerned that we cannot separate our personal image and identity from President Trump who Harry might consider voting for if something disconcerting doesn’t arise. So many things to be concerned about Harry; stepped on any rakes lately?

  45. huxley to harry:
    But this constant condescension, that you are the thoughtful person and we aren’t, really grates.

    Condescend: that’s what progs/lefties/libs/Demos do. It’s been part of their playbook for decades. And I mean DECADES. Recall the old line attributed to Adlai Stevenson II: Politician Quotes: Adlai Stevenson Quotes.

    Known for his good nature, Stevenson was once approached by a young woman supporter, the first time that he decided to run for the president’s post. She said, “Governor, every thinking person would be voting for you”. He retorted, “Madam, that is not enough. I need a majority.”

    It becomes particularly grating when the progs/lefties/libs/Demo doing the condescending is actually rather poorly informed. Consider Bernie Sanders pontificating on Latin America, which he usually prefaces by informing us that as the proles are so ignorant about Latin America, he needs to enlighten them.

    I would add that this condescending combined with ignorance is a one of the leading reasons why I left the left.

  50. I won’t pile on “Harry.” Neo has already explained it to him. Trump’s line about Baghdadi’s humiliating death, chased by dogs, no less, was aimed at making him look like a useless loser rather than a heroic martyr. His continued existence was a recruiting tool. His ignominious death is the reverse.

  52. “Try to seperate yourself from Trump from time to time.”

    You know a good way to create some space between Trump and the public?

    STOP ATTACKING HIM ALL THE FREAKIN’ TIME FOR EVERY FREAKIN’ THING HE DOES.

    This is one of the most amazing things about the Trump era. He’s a New York City Democrat with a long and checkered personal and professional history who pretty clearly doesn’t believe a lot of the things conservatives believe. Driving a wedge between Trump and GOP/right wing voters should have been child’s play.

    But not only have his critics attacked his supporters almost as much as they attack Trump, they continually attack Trump in ways that virtually force his supporters to BE MORE SUPPORTIVE OF TRUMP.

    Harry’s remark, besides being ignorant, is dripping in condescension and snobbery. “Oh, that Trump! He’s just so gauche!” It’s a form of virtue-signalling that practically forces Trump’s supporters to rally to his side.

    Mike

  53. “…virtually force…”

    Maybe, but they don’t virtually force me.

    I view such attacks as virtue-dripping, virtuosic, NON SEQUITURS.

    State-of-the-art meaninglessness (given the much larger picture).

    What forces me to “BE MORE SUPPORTIVE OF TRUMP” is the unhinged, utterly dishonest, criminal mafia that the Democratic Party has unfortunately become.

    (But maybe it’s just me….)

  54. If only Comrade Bezos knew of the shenanigans at WaPoop! He would briskly suppress the counter-revolutionary elements at the organ who are trying wreck its franchise, and after a full investigation (with confessions from the accused) he would liquidate all the counter-revolutionary looters and wreckers that have ruined the reputation of the American Pravda.

    It has been said that there is no truth in Wapoop and no news in the NYT. Comrade Bezos and Comrades Sulzberger and Slim denounce such defamers of the Party’s organs of communication as lackeys and lickspittles of capitalist exploiters and propagandists such as Ru[pert Murdoch.

  55. MBunge
    You know a good way to create some space between Trump and the public?
    STOP ATTACKING HIM ALL THE FREAKIN’ TIME FOR EVERY FREAKIN’ THING HE DOES.

    Trump was not my first choice for the 2016 Republican nomination. I warned to Trump when 1) I observed that those attacking him from the left were my political opponents and that they attacked him for ANYTHING, and 2) Contrary to previous Republicans subjected to similar attacks, Trump fought back.

    As Munge points out, attacks on Trump often include attacks on his supporters. Unfortunately, shaming doesn’t work anymore. Not exactly the way to win friends and influence people.

    I figured that if they hate Trump, he must be OK, and so much the the better that Trump fought back.

  56. That link Ed Driscoll provides for the NY Times obit on Stalin goes to the NY Times on the Web Learning Network for students and teachers — “Teach and Learn With The Times: Resources for Bringing the World Into Your Classroom”. Egads.

  58. I read that the founder of ISIS had been killed, and then learned that Obama was still alive!

    And I read this obit elsewhere:
    “Osama bin Laden, some guy who did something, dead at 54. “

  59. Then there’s the Siraj Hashmi tweet I just saw: “Katie Hill is resigning from Congress to spend more time with her staffers.”

    Stop, please, it hurts.

  60. The sun sets on planned terrorism in the Middle East. Baghdadi will no longer have the choice to decapitate and dismember lives he deems unworthy of life. And the rest of the parties, they can persist in their wicked solutions, or reconcile their differences and give peace a chance. WaPo et al lament the loss of his life and opportunity.

  61. “Katie Hill is resigning from Congress to spend more time with her staffers.”

    They were for #MeToo before they were against it.

  62. neo on October 27, 2019 at 5:55 pm said:

    Harry:

    I have found that quite a bit of what appears to be needless boasting by Trump is actually strategic.

    Although some needless boasting remains.

    But the minute I heard him say the phrase you mention, I saw it as a smart move given the honor/shame culture.

    Neo: I think James Rickards has the best take on Trump’s boasting and why he does it here:

    https://youtu.be/LgyzFJP4DsY?t=86

  63. “Harry’s remark, besides being ignorant, is dripping in condescension and snobbery. “Oh, that Trump! He’s just so gauche!” It’s a form of virtue-signalling that practically forces Trump’s supporters to rally to his side.”

    Spot on, alas. I remember being appalled that I found Trump the best Republican candidate despite my complete indifference to his tabloid-based fame. I kept waiting for one of the other 16 or so wannabes to send him back to TV-land but it never happened.

    What helped turn me into a fan was the numb inability of the deranged nevertrumping GOP establishment to actually come up with any winning argument against him and his terribly cunning plan of actually noticing reality and proposing policies based upon it.

    Instead, I watched a rather tedious campaign attacking him for nonsense reasons and complaining about his bad taste. For example, I used to listen to a podcast- supposedly about pop culture- that spent a good amount of time one episode attacking Trump because his New York apartment had gold-plated faucets, or some such. I distinctly remember thinking that I had absolutely no concern about Trump’s taste in interior decor, and if this was the best nevertrumpers could do then they had no hope at all against him. Subsequently, two of the three members of that podcast have become infamous as Trump haters, and I can’t recall who the third person was- or is, as I have no idea if that podcast is still being produced- nor do I care.

    That said, I suspect snobbery is one of the best arguments these folks could make, because in actual practice their beloved policies have led to disaster after disaster.

    That just doesn’t sell, politically, no matter how much they try.

  65. Harry,

    It wasn’t “needless”. Americans were not the audience for that part. That was intended for Muslim consumption. The idea is to erase from their heads the idea that Baghdadi is some sort of heroic martyr.

    He also said that, “…he died like a dog.” That is a particularly Muslim insult. This was a carefully crafted statement. Trump did not simply make this up as he went along. Everything in that speech had a purpose.

  69. Muhammad famously said that “War is deception” i.e. it is essentially psychological in nature, and a current day Pakistani General, in writing a book about the “Muslim way of war,” said that it was basically a war of the spirit, of knowledge, of ideas, of belief, of morale.

    This is why Muslims and their partisans and allies like CAIR have made such strenuous efforts to use Political Correctness to try to control the terms, language, facts, and concepts our military and others are allowed to employ and explore in trying to describe, understand, and to combat Muslim ideology and Muslim terrorism.

    Thus, for instance, the WaPOO eulogy writers trying to establish a certain image of Al-Baghdadi.

    Knowing this, President Trump deliberately describing a cowardly gibbering Baghdadi—afraid of death—is also a form of warfare.

  72. As Neo said, Trump’s phrasing here was strategic. There is a claim that some of his boasting is not strategic, but this thread hasn’t been one of them. I’ve seen most of Trump’s tweets in the last year (with some time off in July – was busy on vacation), and there are a few things he said, boasts or insults, which were very strongly NOT my (sophisticated? snobby?) style. (Snobby wannabee?)

    But I actually can’t be sure that any of them aren’t strategic in some way. They might be aimed at a strategic goal I disagree with, like insulting Islam (a goal I DO agree with), or getting the Fed to have lower interest rates (ditto).

    It would help Trump critics to copy a full tweet, or link to a speech (or transcript) of what he actually said, rather than paraphrase a Dem spun twisted version.

    Here’s an insult from Trump:
    Badly failing presidential candidate @KamalaHarris
    will not go to a very wonderful largely African American event today because yesterday I recieved a major award, at the same event, for being able to produce & sign into law major Criminal Justice Reform legislation, which will.. [be good for black communities…]

    “Badly failing”. Not my style, even a little icky. But “very wonderful”, not just “very” or “wonderful”, again more effusive than my style. He “recieved” [sic] a major award, but bad spelling.

    Thanks North101 for a quick note on Trump, the news puppies, and the red ball. The ball Trump throws which the news puppies chase. Like maybe the insulting “badly failing”, yet it also is true. Plus it becomes a bit self-fulfilling, with the extra attention. So the press will chase the red ball around a bit.

    Not mentioned in the YouTube analogy is that once the puppies start chasing it, it’s out of Trump’s hands — but he can gain some additional influence, if not control, by throwing another ball, maybe red but maybe blue or purple, somewhere else.

    In the meantime, Trump is doing lots of policies the Dems should really not be wanting, but they’re kind of boring. Federal judges, Federal Reserve, Tax Cuts so lots of people spend thousands more, rather than a few politicians spending billions on a “newsworthy” event. Bo – ring. Let’s talk about what the bouncing ball just hit, or show some chasing puppy videos!

    In 2011, Trump was congratulating Obama on getting Bin Laden.

    https://www.breitbart.com/politics/2019/10/27/flashback-trump-congratulated-president-obama-personally-on-osama-bin-laden-raid/

    Those who talk about civility should be shamed by the uncivil Dems. But won’t be, because they know it’s incivility BullShit.
    Trump is more civil, and more honest, than Obama (who was terrible).
    Faint Praise with lots of objective facts for those who disagree.

    Manju; Mac & Harry – and all Trump critics. Please show us Trump words in context or policies that you are critiquing.
    Mostly you just feel that he’s icky.

  73. “Trump’s line about Baghdadi’s humiliating death, chased by dogs, no less, was aimed at making him look like a useless loser rather than a heroic martyr. His continued existence was a recruiting tool. His ignominious death is the reverse.” Kate

    Devout fundamentalist Muslims accept Allah’s declaration in the Qur’an that in fighting and dying to advance Islam’s expansion, Baghdadi ensured his entry into paradise.

    “The sun sets on planned terrorism in the Middle East.” n.n.

    Yes temporarily… Baghdadi was simply one of Islam’s agents. You can bet your last dollar that as long as what jihadist’s consider intolerable consequence has NOT been attached to jihad… another Baghdadi will arise.

    “It wasn’t “needless”. Americans were not the audience for that part. That was intended for Muslim consumption. The idea is to erase from their heads the idea that Baghdadi is some sort of heroic martyr.

    He also said that, “…he died like a dog.” That is a particularly Muslim insult. This was a carefully crafted statement.” Roy N.

    That was a particularly offensive insult for Muslims supportive of Baghdadi’s aims but as Trump could not truthfully offer a persuasive argument for WHY Baghdadi wasn’t going to paradise, jihadist’s will still believe that he is currently enjoying his 72 virgins.

  74. Trump’s comments about Baghdadi’s inglorious end were not aimed at the already-jihadis. They were aimed at discouraging people who might be inspired to become jihadis.

  75. Sure, there’s plenty to chuckle at and all, but what this really says to me is that there is NOTHING that Trump can do to mollify, even for only a day, those who hate him, and this is a fight to the death. Those who think Trump is intemperate and that he should tone it down (people like me, often) need to think hard on that.

    They will offer no quarter, no compromise. Think on that, because it is not how we products of American democracy and give-and-take politics tend to view things and we need to recognize reality for what it is–like it or not..

  76. “Devout fundamentalist Muslims accept Allah’s declaration in the Qur’an that in fighting and dying to advance Islam’s expansion, Baghdadi ensured his entry into paradise.”

    Well, he was fleeing, pursued by a dog, and then blew himself up killing no one but his own children. Some Muslims may think of that as a martyr’s death, but …

  77. “Manju; Mac & Harry – and all Trump critics. Please show us Trump words in context or policies that you are critiquing. Mostly you just feel that he’s icky.”

    Leave me out of this round. I am not doing any “critiquing” of Trump now or probably ever in Neo’s comments.

    The point I was trying to make in the comment that set off that round a week or two ago was extremely narrow, not intended to be a “critique” of Trump. It was meant to be about some of Trump’s critics more than Trump himself. I clearly did not get that across to most of the people who reacted to it. Ok fine whatever, feel free to blame me for not communicating that clearly. But for truth’s sake don’t put me in a box labeled “Trump critic.” It could just as justifiably be “Trump supporter,” because my opinion of him is mixed. And don’t tell me what I think or feel.

  78. By the way, Huxley, thank you for identifying “Russell Conjugation” for me. I knew there was a name for that syndrome and have been trying to remember it. I think it has a lot to do with something that has driven me crazy for a long time: the inability of some leftists I know, genuinely nice people in other respects, to grasp that the face they present to their political opponents looks crazed with fury.

  79. “Adolph Eichman, noted logistician, railroad buff, and auto worker, died today of a neck injury . . .”

  80. https://www.breitbart.com/clips/2019/10/28/susan-rice-huffs-trump-didnt-extend-common-courtesy-of-telling-obama-about-al-baghdadi-mission/

    MARGARET BRENNAN: Was President Obama informed of the death of al-Baghdadi by the administration? Did you know before the news today?

    RICE: No, there’s no reason why I should know. There is a tradition of common courtesy of presidents informing their predecessors of things of significance like this. Since the White House seemingly didn’t feel it necessary to inform the leadership of the intelligence committees on a bipartisan basis, I’m quite confident that they didn’t do the normal protocol with respect to predecessors either.

    Well, Obama always told us that he only learned about important events in his own administration from the news; why should Trump upset him by changing the procedure?

  82. https://www.lifesitenews.com/opinion/wapos-obituary-for-mass-murdering-isis-leader-calls-him-conservative-academic

    October 28, 2019 (NewsBusters) — Twitter blew up for a minute yesterday over The Washington Post using this headline for an obituary of the founder of ISIS: “Abu Bakr Al-Baghdadi, austere religious scholar at helm of Islamic State, dies at 48.” It inspired a satirical hashtag called #WaPoDeathNotices, including this 9/11 gibe by NB editor Curtis Houck: “Mohamed Atta, skilled aviator and leader of men, dies at 33. ”

  83. mhjhnsn on October 28, 2019 at 12:47 pm said:
    Sure, there’s plenty to chuckle at and all, but what this really says to me is that there is NOTHING that Trump can do to mollify, even for only a day, those who hate him, and this is a fight to the death. Those who think Trump is intemperate and that he should tone it down (people like me, often) need to think hard on that.

    They will offer no quarter, no compromise. Think on that, because it is not how we products of American democracy and give-and-take politics tend to view things and we need to recognize reality for what it is–like it or not..
    * * *
    As I was scrolling back through Neo’s posts that I missed while off the grid for a week, I had occasion to reference this article on David Horowitz, which cited his opinion of the difference in viewpoint of the Left and Right.

    DH is kind of a one-man-band for the Left-Right contest. The article also shows that many of the political and social events of current interest are NOT NEW.

    https://www.nationalreview.com/2015/11/david-horowitz-journey-left-right/

    The Life and Work of David Horowitz
    By JAMIE GLAZOV
    November 10, 2015 5:00 PM

    Conservatives generally, and Republicans in particular, either fail to understand that there is a political war taking place, or disapprove of the fact that there is. Conservatives approach politics as a series of management issues, and hope to impose limits on what government may do. Their paradigm is based on individualism, compromise, and partial solutions. This puts conservatives at a distinct disadvantage in political combat with the Left, whose paradigm of oppression and liberation inspires missionary zeal and is perfectly suited to aggressive tactics and no-holds-barred combat. Horowitz’s political strategy is to turn the tables on the Left, framing “liberals” and “progressives” as the actual oppressors of minorities and the poor.
    …
    In 2014, Horowitz resumed his strategic lessons for Republicans and conservatives in Take No Prisoners: The Battle Plan for Defeating the Left, which is a summary statement of his 20 years of thinking about political warfare. According to Horowitz, conservatives fail to employ a political language that speaks to voters’ emotions, and fail to highlight the moral imperative of opposing policies that are destructive to the poor and the vulnerable, and ultimately to all Americans. Progressives view themselves as social redeemers, as missionaries seeking to transform the world, which inspires their will to win. Conservatives are pragmatists whose goals are specific, practical, and modest by comparison. But it is only by embracing an inspiring mission as defenders of freedom and champions of the victims of progressive policies that conservatives can confront the fire of the Left with a fire of their own.

    RTWT.
    Contains what looks like a full bibliography & ample biographical details.

  84. Amadeus 48 on October 27, 2019 at 8:23 pm said:

    Meanwhile, Smithsonian Magazine is running a fan letter to Che Guevara. Go figure.

    ******

    “Roaring Through Cuba With Che Guevara’s Son”

    https://www.smithsonianmag.com/travel/roaring-through-cuba-with-che-guevara-son-180973314/

    <blockquote SMITHSONIAN MAGAZINE | November 2019

    For several days, Ernesto Guevara, Che’s son, had been leading a group of eight on a motorcycle tour around Cuba. The escapade was filled with the island’s usual mild chaos and misadventures, which Ernesto had tackled with dry humor. “Some of the potholes out here have names,” he said of the decaying country roads. “They’ve been here for so long people are fond of them. They’re like pets.” But he grew quiet as we began to explore Santa Clara, the provincial city that encapsulates Che’s short, operatic life and helped turn him into one of the most recognizable—and yet, little-known—figures of the modern era.

    [Snip]

    Not a short article. Photos. Haven’t read it. Is it truthful? If so, is it interesting? Dunno. But thanks, Amadeus, for the reference.

    . . .

    Aesop, the cartoon is priceless! Thanks!

    Just a note — it’s not in the Breitbart article. Click on the Tweet halfway through the article to see the funny. NOT to be missed! 😆

  85. And then there’s Lucifer … “Who has risen to prominence by resisting the ultimate patriarch and by insisting on the actual exercise and integration of the freedom promised to him and implicit in his nature, and who by force of personality drew a third of the population along with him ….

    Lucifer was a Roman bishop. If you mean the entity isaiah was talking about, he/they prefer the name Heyl-El, in the original Hebrew, meaning Howling Star (not Morning Star).

    The angels and archangels of god are referred to with the post attachment -El.

    A lot of the bifurcation and division by 3s did happen, although it was more than just one entity involved.

  86. Julie near Chicago, I read the Smithsonian article on visiting Che’s descendants in Cuba. It was truthful as far as it went. Yes, Che is revered in Cuba. Yes, his descendants revere him, as most of us revere our parents and grandparents. Not all of Che’s descendants revered the Cuban system currently in place, such as Che’s grandson Canek. The Smithsonian article doesn’t mention Canek. Sanchez Guevara, Canek: Che’s anarchist grandson, 1974-2015. As the article talked with Che’s descendants living in Cuba, and Canek was deceased and had left Cuba in 1996,he wasn’t there to be interviewed.

    Canek Sanchez Guevara was the eldest grandson of Ernesto Che Guevara. Hildita Guevara was his mother and his father was Alberto Sanchez, a Mexican leftist. He was born in Havana on the 22nd May 1974. Canek means Black Snake in Yucatec Maya.

    As a child he lived with his parents in Milan and Barcelona, attending a Spanish-Catalan school in the latter city. He then lived in Mexico, returning to Cuba in 1986. He quickly became disgusted with the Castro regime and the way it persecuted writers, artists and others. He rejected the role that the regime were preparing for him as a high ranking military officer. He started dressing like a punk. He helped form a heavy metal band called Metalizer. One evening the secret police broke up a forbidden gig of the band, lobbing tear gas grenades into the crowd and subjecting him to a humiliating body search.

    He began to offer vocal criticisms of the regime which obliged him to leave Cuba at the age of 22 in 1996. He returned to Mexico where several members of his family lived.

    The article is a puff piece. It doesn’t pretend to make an analysis of Che’s life- such as Che the Executioner. Go to Humberto Fontova, Jorge Castañeda, or Jon Lee Anderson for that.

    In Exposing the Real, Che Guevara, Fontova quotes Che from the London Daily Worker in 1962:

    “We will march the path of victory even if it costs millions of atomic victims. . . . We must keep our hatred alive and fan it to paroxysm.”

    Interesting that neither Anderson nor Castañeda have that quote.

  87. Neo,
    I question that NY Times Stalin obit link. I found another link which is much harsher in words about Stalin and has no headline. Remember the NY Times was hardly a left leaning paper back in the 1950’s. They didn’t really begin to turn left until the 80’s. But the link I found look similar but reads differently.
    Some of what is written in the other link:
    – At his doorstep must be laid the millions of victims claimed by the collectivization campaign and the famine which accompanied it in the early Nineteen Thirties.
    – . On his conscience, if he had any, lay the burden of shame for the enslavement of millions in the forced labor camps, and for the semi-enslavement of the millions of workers chained to the factories by legislative fiat.
    – By his order the steps were taken which catastrophically reduced the standard of living of his people after 1928 so that he might have a giant industry which could build the sinews of war.
    – He wore the mantle of the high priest of utopian communism, but his rule produced a reality most reminiscent of George Orwell’s vision of hell on earth.

  88. Pingback:Hump Day: The Four Faces of “All Hallows’ Eve” Eve | The Universal Spectator

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