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Ukraine deal: on or off? — 8 Comments

  1. Photo-opportunities are trivial things when set beside the grinding evils of trench warfare, no? Easily dispensed with one would think. I believe the genuine object remains ending the war, its death and destruction. And that is what is meant to be served by the mineral deal and its ancillary conditions. So, as before, this business was over before it began.

  2. Sad situation is that none of the parties can be trusted long term.
    Trump gone in four years so next dem president can undo the agreement
    Putin or Zelinsky become un-happy and start fighting again.

    Ironically, Trump is the most trustworthy involved and legitimately wants to stop the death and destruction

  3. I don’t see how Ukraine has a choice. Europe isn’t going to give them what they need to avoid defeat.

    Either Zelenskyy signs or someone else does.

    I believe Trump still wants the deal, though he might ding Zelenskyy for the FAFO.

  4. @Fullmoon:Sad situation is that none of the parties can be trusted long term.

    In a representative democracy, if you want consistent long-term foreign policy, you’d have to let it be up to Sir Humphrey Appleby and all the unelected foreign service people. And we’ve already seen with USAID what they get up to without supervision from the elected leadership.

    Bernard Woolley: What if the Prime Minister insists we help them?
    Sir Humphrey Appleby: Then we follow the four-stage strategy.
    Bernard Woolley: What’s that?
    Sir Richard Wharton: Standard Foreign Office response in a time of crisis.
    Sir Richard Wharton: In stage one we say nothing is going to happen.
    Sir Humphrey Appleby: Stage two, we say something may be about to happen, but we should do nothing about it.
    Sir Richard Wharton: In stage three, we say that maybe we should do something about it, but there’s nothing we *can* do.
    Sir Humphrey Appleby: Stage four, we say maybe there was something we could have done, but it’s too late now.
    Bernard Woolley: What if he demands options?
    Sir Humphrey Appleby: Well, it’s obvious, Bernard. The Foreign Office will happily present him with three options, two of which are, on close inspection, exactly the same.
    Sir Richard Wharton: Plus a third which is totally unacceptable.
    Sir Humphrey Appleby: Like bombing Warsaw or invading France.

  5. I guess Russia negotiating in good faith is not on the table. They never have in the past . Hope Z does not fall from a bridge or out of a building.
    The history of Russia and its neighbors and anyone who questions the great leader ending up in a gulag just can’t be made up. I could go on.

  6. I don’t give a tinkers damn about Ukraine. It was part of the Soviet Union for many decades, so what if worst case it goes back to Russia?
    It’s a totally corrupt country, never allied with us, that demonstrably bought off the Biden crime family and others to our detriment. Not to mention the twin bloated treasonous Army guys who set up Trump for impeachment. Led by the same little crooked punk who aided and abetted that.

    The question I have is what minerals deal? This one or the one Z already did with the UK. Is he selling the same product twice?

  7. Given his most recent comments, it would appear that Zelensky does not have great confidence in the EU. The Europeans are great talkers, but when push comes to shove—. The bottom line is that they desperately need Russian oil; and Russia desperately needs to sell them their oil. Who blinks? Putin is tougher, so Europe may not be in a postion to broker anythng. Without Trump/U.S. Zelensky is between a rock and a very hard place.

    I was all in for supporting Ukraine, even though I knew that it was probably the most corrupt country north of Africa.
    Reality can be ignored at some risk, but cannot be denied. They stopped Russia, for now; but it is inconceivable that they can evict Russia; and it is problematic what Putin might do if he becomes frustrated enough.
    Despite being called out for my comparisons to WWI by someone whose name I forget, I see others making the same comparison It is time to try to end the stalemate that has been described as a meat grinder. There are other ways to punish Putin and the Russians for anyone who has the will to do so.

  8. I doubt Trump was truly bothered, and if Zelenskyy waves the white flag, Trump will go forward as if nothing happened. He isn’t that unpredictable, indeed, his response to Zelenskyy was completely predictable.

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