The terror of the barbaric
I’ve been covering the Hamas massacre since it happened, and it touches on something very deep that goes back to childhood terrors. When I see or hear the suffering it is sickening. I wish it were fiction, but it’s not.
I have always been sensitive to horror films and don’t watch them. But on TV I once almost accidentally saw the end part of a horror film that I had trouble shaking for a long time because it was so sadistic. The Hamas attacks remind me of that feeling. We see people who are helpless in the face of unspeakable horror, as the bright happy everyday world of a bunch of young festival-goers, or of modern couples with beautiful infants and toddlers, was without warning invaded and overtaken by the most evil of evils.
History tells us this happens again and again, but we try to tune it out because it is so deeply frightening. 9/11 brought it to our attention, the Rwandan massacres by the Hutu brought it to our attention (although much further away and in the third world), every terrorist attack brings it to our attention. And now this. There is a special horror in the fear of being at the mercy of evil and sadistic people who delight in the suffering of their victims.
Civilized behavior is a precious achievement that has taken millennia to achieve. But it is one we all too often have taken for granted. We should not; it is fragile and tenuous.
Not only Hamas but those who support and justify the sort of behavior exhibited by Hamas have gone beyond the pale of civilized behavior. Whether they do so through ignorance or stupidity or pathology of the mind and spirit, that is what they have done.
Over the years I’ve been blogging, I have written many many posts on Israel and Palestine: the history and the moral differences between the two sides. But I believe most people remain ignorant of all or most of this. The MSM has been a big factor in amplifying Palestinian propaganda in the past. Much of the MSM will probably do so even now, which shows how bankrupt they are. But I’m not sure; I detect a slight change of sorts, at least for the moment. It might not last.
One of the things I’ve noticed among those who defend what Hamas does is a failure to understand the difference between a child dying as collateral damage when a military target in Gaza is struck by Israelis after a terrorist attack by Palestinians – a target that was placed by Hamas in vulnerable residential areas and places such as hospitals and schools where children will sometimes be killed even though the Israelis warn the population and even give time for people to leave – and the deliberate, sadistic, purposeful murder of Israeli children by Hamas. It’s all dead children, right? Children should never be killed in an ideal world. But although in war it happens, civilized nations try to avoid it. In contrast, terrorists seek it out and revel in it when they do it. And their sympathizers think those two approaches are equivalent – or pretend to think it. Or, they think the Israelis are worse, because they are modern and successful and the Gazas are poor and “oppressed” (mainly by other Arabs and Palestinians, but that’s ignored as well).
Is this inability to tell the difference between the actions of the two sides a cognitive failing, a moral failing, a spiritual failing, or what? I don’t have the answer. But I know it’s a widespread failing, and is especially common among the intelligent. Propaganda is certainly part of it, but plenty of people are resistant to such propaganda. Why do some succumb?
And so we see photos and videos of children as hostages, being tortured psychologically and physically. Some of them saw their parents deliberately murdered in front of them. We hear of dead babies in cribs – not collateral damage, but murdered in a frenzy of homicidal rage and now justified by college students and even some members of Congress.
At least when the Nazis dashed out the brains of Jewish babies against brick walls they didn’t take photos and disseminate them around the world in order to gain support. They knew, or thought they knew, that most of the civilized world would highly disapprove if they saw those photos (even though much of the civilized world cooperated with rounding up their own Jews and sending them away, as long as they didn’t have to face what ultimately happened to them). Now, Hamas thinks photos of the horrors they perpetrate will enhance their status in the eyes of many people. And they are correct.
[NOTE: Years ago I wrote many articles for PJ Media. They are gone from that site now, but I made copies of them before that happened. Two of them in particular were on the subject of why the barbarity of Arab terrorists appeals to so many people. I plan to republish those essays some time in the not-too-distant future, as well as maybe one or two old blog posts relevant to the subject.]
This is similar to my comment in the open thread – I don’t think that modern, educated westerners retain the intellectual or even the verbal tools to conceive of this level of evil.
A tragedy to us in the modern west is a car accident, or disease or a friend who OD’d on fentanyl. Very few of us who live outside of the inner city have to deal with the deliberate violent death of a friend or loved one.
With that experience, I think that for some the difference between a child killed by Hamas’s terroristic pogrom or a child killed by an Israeli aistrike is like the difference between $1 Trillion and $10 Trillion.
And of course there are a many who are ideologically motivated to conflate the two.
Neo says, “Hamas thinks photos of the horrors they perpetrate will enhance their status in the eyes of many people. And they are correct.”
I think the widespread availability of brutal and sadistic porn on the Internet is one factor that paved the way for Hamas’ glorification of sexual violence as well as outright murder. Neo’s post on October 6 on “Blocking children’s access to online hardcore porn” noted that many female detransitioners from the current trans mania “are so troubled by [online porn] that they decide to retreat from womanhood, since being a woman and sexual contact in general is associated with being the recipient of violent abuse.” Neo then went on to discuss the effect of sadistic porn on young males.
I have little doubt that Hamas militants have been viewing this stuff for years now, and that it explains their posting videos of gang rapes and female hostages with bleeding genitals being paraded through the streets of Gaza. I don’t recall this degree of sexual brutality being posted on the WWW in previous eruptions of Palestinian violence– it doubtless occurred but was less publicized.
Every aspect of this tragedy is sickening. I don’t know, maybe you could call it a rip in the fabric of civilization; or something like a time warp. (I know that sounds a bit hackneyed, but I am struggling to find the appropriate descriptive words.)
I suppose that barbarism and brutality will always be present in some cultures, and even where culturally repugnant; but hopefully increasingly rare.
On the other hand, this whole episode, virtually every aspect, takes us back to a more atavistic time. One writer, I forget who, maybe it was Victor Davis Hanson, likens the blood thirsty reactions by allegedly civilized people to the excitement in the masses as sacrifices were paraded up the steps to the altar in the ancient Aztec culture. The descriptions of the Roman Coliseum also come to mind. We think we are more civilized, then we are confronted with the reality that the veneer of civilization is thin, and the vessel that contains it is fragile.
There are many examples of demonstrations, mostly mindless, in support of Hamas. Notable were the ones at Harvard. Most of the stories do not describe the affiliations of the despicable participants. I did note from one source that most are from Muslim affiliated countries, or U.S counter culture groups; but not all. We have seen similar disgusting responses to other terrorist attacks, 9/11 for instance. So there is no particular reason to be surprised now. Perhaps less, I suppose, considering the anti-Israel/ anti-Zionist, let’s just say anti-Semitic factors. On the other hand, the lack of meaningful response by the leadership of the University is simply beyond the pale. I would hope that civilized people would vote with their feet and their checkbooks. Not holding my breath.
On a more positive note, Glenn K. Beaton of http://www.TheAspenBeat.com has posted a charming anecdote of a visit to the Western Wall, along with snippets of history.
PA+Cat, I agree. , I have long felt that the a major part of the entertainment culture has the effect of dehumanizing people.
I don’t watch TV any longer, and haven’t been to a movie in years, but my gentle wife is addicted to shows like NCIS, FBI and others that feature violent shootouts on virtually every episode. Fortunately, she can separate fantasy from reality. It is painfully obvious that many cannot.
It would be more on point if you would say exactly what you would do to these savages. Carthago dalenda est?
It is all of that: a cognitive failing, a moral failing, a spiritual failing.
What happened on Saturday wasn’t a tragedy; it was an atrocity.
While conventional wars are bad, e.g., Ukraine, at least they’re fought by uniformed armies. Another distinction that is lost among these cognitive-moral-spiritual midgets.
It was in a Ben Shapiro video to which I was pointed this morning in the Open Thread (tip o’ the hat to CapnRusty (11:46 am)).
I noted maybe halfway through the video that the likes of Ilhan Omar, Rashida Tlaib, and the reliably ridiculous Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez have found it within themselves to deplore the violence and mourn the deaths on both sides.
Forget the moral equivalence for a second. I know, I know very well, we cannot. Okay. Moving on to my subsequent thought anyway, . . .
That in itself tells me a lot: the fact that these people, normally foaming-at-the-mouth partisan on the side of muslims and anything reeking of USA-hatred, are standing back and with straight faces invoking this moral equivalence, says something very telling.
*** They know d#mn well their side is f#cking up big time. ***
But I doubt it’ll make much difference in the larger scheme of things.
JackWayne, Israel has declared a “Hamas delenda est” policy, and I entirely agree with them.
*** They know d#mn well their side is f#cking up big time. ***
M J R:
There does seem to be a silver lining to this ghastly barbarity.
I imagine Hamas saw their attack as just a bigger and better version of what they’ve always been doing.
However, in Western eyes, but for the most hardened anti-Semitic woke types, Hamas has crossed a line with their naked, sadistic attacks on civilians, women and children.
Even Biden and Obama, belatedly and too mildly, nonetheless had to call out the Hamas attacks.
I say it’s different this time. A new chapter.
Israel has more leeway for Hamas delenda est [h/t Kate] than ever before.
Bauxite – I don’t think that modern, educated westerners retain the intellectual or even the verbal tools to conceive of this level of evil.
There may not be any educated westerners left, after the last 50 years of the colonization of Western universities by ‘teachers’ more interested in Western sins than civilization.
It used to be that a classic liberal education included enough explicit history that its graduates were well-versed in what ranges of human behavior – from bad to good – lay in the past millennia, and might yet be resumed if opportunities arose for the right barbarians. An educated Westerner would have known that humans have in the past pulled off frightful massacres far exceeding Hamas’s Saturday exploit, and that many changes of government over centuries – several in the 20th – have been based on just such behavior.
So the intellectual and verbal tools of comprehension had better be dusted off, if not by the foolish leaders who feel that chanting Kumbaya and ‘never again’ are sufficient to fend off the Devil, then their surviving grandchildren – if some new ‘teachers’ can resurrect and apply the concepts and values of the liberal education.
What explains the Pale’s continual culture of martyrdom? A big question with a too many answers at the moment to survey. (The biggest are the UN and Iran, behind Hamas — but I am straying.)
Instead, let’s focus on one, key missed opportunity for Israel to stanch their enemy by assuring that Youth WILL NOT be encouraged and reproduction penalised. An anti-natalist policy keeps the numbers of potential recruits to attack Israel to the smallest size.
This is because the young males are prime target for indoctrination and cultivation into martyrdom. The fewer in Gaza makes the horrors seen less fearsome because the perpetrators are fewer.
This controversial idea made major waves in 2010, when ME and Islamist historian Martin Kramer put it on the table of policy options.
Wiki: “At the February 2010 Herzliya Conference in Israel, Kramer caused controversy by advocating for the elimination of Western aid in what he termed “pro-natal subsidies” to Palestinian refugees in Gaza in order to discourage population growth and Islamic radicalization:[17][18]
Kramer: “Aging populations reject radical agenda and the Middle East is no different. Now eventually, this will happen among the Palestinians, too. But it will happen faster if the West stops providing pro-natal subsidies for Palestinians with refugee status. Those subsidies are one reason why in the ten years, from 1997 to 2007, Gaza’s population grew by an astonishing 40%. At that rate, Gaza’s population will double by 2030 to three million. Israel’s present sanctions on Gaza have a political aim, undermine the Hamas regime, but they also break Gaza’s runaway population growth and there is some evidence that they have. That may begin to crack the culture of martyrdom, which demands a constant supply of superfluous young men.”
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Martin_Kramer
Time and occasion to revisit and reverse this opportunity must be pursued. Better late then never again.
Neo says that at PJmedia she shared essays on this topic. “Two of them in particular were on the subject of why the barbarity of Arab terrorists appeals to so many people. I plan to republish those essays some time in the not-too-distant future. “ YES!!!
Nicole Zedeck reports that ‘About 40 [dead, massacred] babies were taken out on gurneys… Cribs overturned, strollers left behind, doors left wide open’
— savage barbarism targeted to deprive people of their future through eliminating all children.
https://twitter.com/i24NEWS_EN/status/1711718195025821976?
Neo,
I think you give the folks who don’t “understand” between the child dying of collateral damage–likely by being in a nursery next to a rocket launching site–and one deliberately and individually killed too much credit for humanity.
They know. They just don’t care and they exert themselves to mislead others.
I started to get a glimpse in college, going on sixty years ago. Oppose the generally accepted view of things–patriotism, the Constitution, use of the atomic bomb, anything you can imagine and you’re in the minority which by definition means morally and intellectually superior.
It is not the moral and intellectual work that has to be done. Simply take the opposite view and they’re done for you. Follows lies, rationalization, forced self-delusion. But, having been guaranteed moral and intellectual superiority, you can’t very well abandon it. So they have to get more and more intense until…they make themselves believe as you describe.
In retrospect, I wonder what lack in themselves required the whole process.
Bring death to every single HAMAS member.
Hamas has announced they will be executing hostages as Gaza civilians die in Israeli counterattacks.
Hamas has American hostages. What will Biden do if Americans are executed?
Muslims have killed Americans like Daniel Pearl as one-offs, but I’m not sure it plays the same if Hamas is publicly executing hostages one-by-one as in a Hollywood thriller.
ICYMI on the open thread (h/t crasey):
Greenfield makes the case that we’re witnessing a war between civilization and savagery.
https://www.frontpagemag.com/savages/
Anyone have a subscription to Mosaic? This looks like an interesting post, but I hit the paywall.
https://mosaicmagazine.com/response/israel-zionism/2023/10/hamass-messianic-violence/
It is a Progressive (and, at this point Western) staple to support the underdog. Even when that underdog turns out to be rabid.
Some context and courage.
https://nypost.com/2023/10/10/95-year-old-reservist-joins-israels-fight-against-hamas-terrorists/
https://notthebee.com/article/here-are-some-stories-of-heroes-who-saved-lives-in-the-midst-of-the-barbaric-hamas-attack
https://nypost.com/2023/10/10/israeli-woman-25-hailed-as-hero-for-killing-terrorists-leading-security-team-at-kibbutz/
“While we are being bombarded with horrific images from the Middle East, it feels like the perfect time to revisit this thread someone created to highlight one of C.S. Lewis’s most important lectures.”
https://notthebee.com/article/now-seems-like-a-good-time-to-revisit-cs-lewis-answer-to-whether-or-not-beauty-matters-when-the-bombs-start-falling
The X thread has pictures, but let’s go to the source, which is far broader and deeper than the internet “trailer,” as indicated by the actual title.
https://www.christendom.edu/wp-content/uploads/2021/02/Learning-In-Wartime-C.S.-Lewis-1939.pdf
Also this:
https://fscsmn.org/email-article/very-applicable-to-today-written-by-cs-lewis-in-1948/
“In one way we think a great deal too much of the atomic bomb. ‘How are we to live in an atomic age?’ I am tempted to reply: ‘Why, as you would have lived in the sixteenth century …”
Inbar Lieberman – NOT a diversity hire!
Pearls and plumeria – gotta love it.
We can’t ever give up our guns.
Stev3 Hayward addresses the population issue this way, and with one of his Daily Charts posts :
“THE DAILY CHART: THE PATHETIC GENOCIDE CLAIM
“The crazed anti-Semitic left likes to say that Israel is engaged in ‘genocide’ against Palestinians, but it is hard to see how anyone can take this seriously if you look at the growth of the Palestinian population.” https://www.powerlineblog.com/archives/2023/10/the-daily-chart-the-pathetic-genocide-claim.php
Also, this background goes to why the issues upset so many critics in 2010 about Martin Kramer’s musings.
Frank, commenting at Hoyt’s latest post, linked to this proposition by Chris Bray, which is another point on the barbarian line.
First he points out something that did seem a bit peculiar for a revolution:
https://chrisbray.substack.com/p/hamas-and-the-military-logic-of-sexual
“Hamas and the Military Logic of Sexual Violence – never come back”
I’m not sure how much weight to assign this motive, especially since the Muslims want all of Israel, not just the southern part, but I can imagine Iran calculating that any attack on a true military objective would fail miserably, and the blood-thirsty destruction of basically helpless victims would appeal more to their client Hamas, which has never been particularly successful at anything truly strategic.
What would be Iran’s motive for letting their puppets proclaim their guilt so obviously and disgustingly, to the point of forcing their higher-placed Western supporters to at least feign condemnation?
Got me.
The range of complex, convoluted plots in the minds of the Manic Mullahs probably defies categorization.
Provoking a response from Israel that would justify other Muslim nations joining to attack the Jews, or Iran to nuke them unilaterally, is high on my list, but Iran & others are backing off now that the Israelis have reacted with genuine fury instead of the usual quasi-apologetic “lawn mowing” (Israel’s former stance on reprisals for Hamas violence).
One possibility is that the Iranians had counted on a few more rounds of reprisals, repeat attacks, and recriminations from the West while they got the rest of their allies and weapons ready to go.
Was there a miscalculation such that Hamas had things too easy (they apparently were surprised that their super-secret plans really did go totally under the radar), and their rampaging was wider and worse (to the Western audience) than expected, which short-circuited the gamed-out time-line?
Doubtful we will ever know.
Israel never went full “Gaza delenda est” before, and I don’t think Iran expected that now.
“… Is this inability to tell the difference between the actions of the two sides a cognitive failing, a moral failing, a spiritual failing, or what? I don’t have the answer. But I know it’s a widespread failing, and is especially common among the intelligent…”
I don’t know either (where the failure lies). But intelligence is no guard against it. Indeed, the most intelligent creature of all used his intelligence —was used by it?— to do the greatest harm. “Evil, be thou my good,” said Satan, and with those words created Hell.
@DX
Well, you started off well.
And for a very good reason. Hamas massively escalated the conflict and created a slew of horrifying and lavishly broadcast atrocities, many of which were utterly counterproductive.
Oh read the room and go fuck yourself. Because this reeks of bad faith and whataboutism.
Especially since the US did not commit many atrocities in Iraq. This much is ironed out even by reflexively anti-Bush and anti-Western sources like Iraq Body Count, which show the vast majority of civilian deaths were caused by “insurgents”, or the terrorists the US was fighting against.
And on the subject of Abu Grahib, I am tired about hearing about it because it is just about never put in its proper context, much like you are failing to do now. I have no love for the American perpetrators who did this (without orders I might add), but they were punished.
And frankly in a fair history of the complex their sins – while real – would amount to a footnote.
What people seem to monumentally forget is that the history of Abu Grahib did not start with the US or 2003. Indeed, it’s more accurate to say its history ended there. Because prior to that date it was a prison under the control of the Saddam Hussein dictatorship, and primarily in the administration of his KGB/SS cosplays the Iraqi Mukhabarat and Republican Guard.
And the atrocities committed there make Englund and co look like frat or sorority morons.
Mark Humprys is one of the very few people who bothered highlighting what actually happened here, and with graphic evidence (WARNInG, LINK CONTAINS GORE).
https://markhumphrys.com/abu.ghraib.html
I will summarize his pOints, which he does Aptly:
More than 30,000 lives were snuffed out at Abu Grahib under Saddam’s watch. Even more suffered torture, rape, and mutilation.
And frankly, Humprys if anything underplays the horrors because he doesn’t go into much detail about the well documented but overlooked other side of it: the use of Abu Grahib as a playground for rape not only of the grown but also of children, catering to highly ranked pedophiles in the regime such as Uday Hussein.
Nothing that happened there under US administration comes close to this. Indeed, nothing alleged as happening under US administration comes close to this.
So seeing you bang this particular gong makes me believe you are acting in monumentally bad faith.
As is appropriate. And frankly is long overdue. Gaza is and remains a totalitarian regime under the control of internationally recognized terrorists. Siege is the proper recourse for this, if not storming. And one cannot clutch beads and pull the “what about the civilian casualties?!?” Card after this.
I realize you’re both acting in monumentally bad faith and are ducking stupid to boot, but it was the nature and scale of the atrocities and JUSTIFIED complaints about them that led to the Animals label, not the other way around. Making this “why complain about atrocities if you are going to label the perpetrators animals” thing completely stupid, dishonest, ass backwards, and disingenuous.
That’s nice. Got any proof of the lies? Especially given how CBS has usually ran interference for Hamas.
And in the meantime we have things like the videos of the gang rapes and murders, as well as this.
https://vxtwitter.com/LernerIsaak/status/1711836152167280777?t=PgV2UujlerXJvBh9TOq4Fw&s=19
Frankly I object to referring to Hamas as Animals, because we are all ultimately animals I object to being lumped in with the scum that did this; hell I object to my beloved turtle and other peoples’ pet rats and bunnies being lumped in with that.
They are however genocidal monsters and savages who have shown why there is zero grounds for trusting them and no grounds to make peace without destroying the entire terrorist organization.
Excessive sympathy for the underdog–especially the fake underdog. The late John Campbell, editor of Analog and other SF referred to it as “hyperinfracanimania”.
Obviously, competition in the underdog status is very important, and however fake it may be, the sympathizers are pleasuring themselves watching the results.
“,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,Is this inability to tell the difference between the actions of the two sides a cognitive failing, a moral failing, a spiritual failing, or what? ………………”
I don’t think any inability is in play; IMHO, what is in play is pure, unadulterated hatred and contempt.
This hatred is so deeply ingrained within an individual’s persona, they will accept and justify any and all horrific acts as long as the victims are the target of their hatred.
This mind set applies not only to those actually committing atrocities, but also to those who demonstrate/agitate in support of the murderers and who are exempt from any of the consequences of the atrocities (e.g., pro-palestinian demonstrators here in the USA or London or Sydney).
Basically, their hatred is so profound, that they simply do not care what horror befalls the victims or even who are the victims (e.g. children).
For “intellectuals” especially, they have the brain power to justify anything; and they do.
After watching online some of the pro palestinian demonstrations, it would be a good idea to begin deporting “undesirables.”
We can start with members of “The Squad,” then move onto the execrable pro-palestinian protesting scum, then onto all those students and academic who are rejoicing in the horrors purposefully inflicted upon Israeli citizens.
Let them all suffer real world consequences.
And to which countries should they all be dropped off? Any nation that is a backwards, impoverished, violent shit hole that will treat them like garbage.
There is precedent for deportations; during the administration of one of the worst presidents in US history, Woodrow Wilson, he authorized
In 1919 and 1920 the “Palmer Raids,” in which foreign born communists, anarchists, socialists – all causing trouble here in the USA – were rounded up and sent back to their homeland (mostly Eastern Europe and Russia).
That’s pretty much the only thing he did that was any good.
Huh.
Anybody heard anything from or about various Muslim organizations in the US? Mosques?
Friends and fighting men of the Achaeans
Henchmen of Ares:
Be men now, dear friends, remember your furious valour.
Salvation’s light is in our hands’ work, not the mercy of battle.
Richard Aubrey @9:38pm,
That is a succinct and accurate way to describe why so many adopt such views and poses as Undergrads and why many continue to double down as age, experience and reality reveal the superficiality of their knowledge.
Great commentary neo
What happened last Saturday reminds me of what the Nazi Einsatzgruppen did to the Jews in Poland and the Soviet Union in World War II.
https://www.theholocaustexplained.org/how-and-why/how/the-einsatzgruppen/
I think it’s a religious thing. There are numerous conflicts within the Koran about the attitude Muslims should exhibit toward other religions. Some parts preach tolerance, while others preach annihilation. Obviously, Hamas, Hezbollah, and Iran exhibit the latter.
Brooklyn Boy:
Yes, somewhat like the Einsatzgruppen except that the Einsatzgruppen didn’t take videos and proudly broadcast them all around the world. They had an idea it might backfire on them if they did that. Not so Hamas.
Another difference is that the Einsatzgruppen did this after invading a country militarily and taking over, rather than as terrorists. Still another difference is that I’ve never heard of the Einsatzgruppen raping and torturing people en masse before killing them. Maybe they did, but I’ve never heard of it. If I’m not mistaken, also, the Einsatzgruppen were run by Germans and manned by many Germans but also there was help from the local Eastern European populations.
In the process of comparing Hamas to the Nazis, let us not forget their similarity to the communists & Bolsheviks, in all nations and eras.
The Left (socialists, progressives, “liberals” and Democrats) own a share of the Islamic terrorism.
@ turtler > thank you for the fisking of DX.
Neo used to draw a better quality professional troll; I suspect this one is a free-lancer.
As always, they must be severely rebutted with the facts, for the benefit of readers who may not be familiar with history (going on Ancient by today’s news-cycle standards).
The memory we codgers have may be our primary asset in the blogwars.
Turtles:
THANKS for your due frisking of (presumably deleted) “DX” comment.
I expected that the terrain argued in your post would have to be reiterated sometime during the reactions to this atrocity and mass murder massacre.
But I repeat myself.
Your post has been copied by me, and I’m sure bookmarked by others, for ready
redeployment.
Information war “arming” is our friend, people. So thank you for your very useful reminder of the context of the War in Iraq.
No comparison, indeed.
}}} Civilized behavior is a precious achievement that has taken millennia to achieve. But it is one we all too often have taken for granted. We should not; it is fragile and tenuous.
As I have commented, Islam is, as a result of multiculti, totally anti-civilized.
They were slowly shifting that way by the 1950s, but the 60s and the multiculti, “all religions/creeds are valuable” set them free to think Islam was not in need of reform, and their classification as a “victim group” set them free to behave as Islam is wont to promote — hatred and violence as THE means to an end.
BTW, “Allah is the same being as the Christian God”.
FUCK THAT BULLSHIT.
The Christian God is about love, compassion, and acceptance of people’s failings, especially and particularly if they are at least trying to Do Better.
Allah’s Islam has no compassion, no love, and only barbaric hatred, violence and oppression for ALL women and anyone not totally in thrall to Islam. It is an EVIL meme, and needs to be repudiated, as does PostModern Liberalism.
Both are utterly antithetical to civilized behavior, and to civilization itself.
God — The God of Abraham is not Allah