Home » Hezbollah: entwined and enmeshed in Lebanon

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Hezbollah: entwined and enmeshed in Lebanon — 23 Comments

  1. The governmental heads at Damascus and Tehran need to roll. I wish Turkey could fulfill this necessity as a duty for World Peace — follow up with an occupation to crush disorder and restore order. But what we are going to get more than likely are more half measures. At this time what needs to be implemented is a Dresden Strategy; quick and deadly is better than slow and ten-thousand times more deadly. I say go for it asap … the choice is only between bad and worse … as always – thanks to the socialist.

  2. Inviting the Turks back into Lebanon? Would that not be like turning the clock back to 1918?

  3. I agree with the above, keep the Turks out of it. The biggest mistake of the WWI treaty was not the harsh treatment of the Germans, but the easy treatment of the Turks. Kurditsatn and Armnia shoud have been carved out, and Constantioble shoud have been returned to the Romaians.

  4. Ruthless monomaniacs such as Hizbollah and its backers Syria and Iran, have rolled right over the Lebanese, who were tired of war. The Lebanese are mentally and spiritually exhausted from their civil war, like the Europeans have been from World War II and the Cold War. They couldn’t lift a finger to help themselves if they had to. The same thing is unfortunately true of the Iranian people who cannot defend themselves against their tyrannical rulers.

    This is the time of Iran’s theocratic dictators’ greatest strength. If the free people of the world can find it within themselves to stand up to the tyrant mullahs and fanatics who rule Iran, Iran’s theocracy (and its puppets like Hizbollah) will fade away like the old USSR did when the free world stood against it. Iran must not gain nuclear weapons until the mullahs are gone.

  5. This whole situation illustrates the truth of those famous words by Edmund Burke: “All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing.”

  6. Brad,

    The harsh treatment of the Germans was a significant error leading to WW2. The post-WW1 partition of the Middle East is a problem, but of a considerable lower magnitude.

  7. “It’s clear that Hezbollah needs to be rooted out of Lebanon. But it’s very difficult to see how this could happen if the Lebanese people themselves don’t wish it to happen”

    It is not difficult to imagine at all: the entire state needs to be defeated. That is how wars are won, look at history. The “state” is: the government, its military, *and its civilian supporters*. Until we have smart bullets that only kill bad guys, winning a war will mean defeating the entire state including its civilian population. Any actual innocents who happen to be in the geographical region should not be used as a reason to not win a war — not if the war is worth fighting in the first place. And an innocent is not just any “non-combatant”, it is someone who resists the bad government and WISHES FOR a good government like Israel to come in and wipe out the bad guys and replace them. This means that the masses in Lebanon who hate Israel and wish the Jews didn’t exist are the enemy, they are culpable and don’t deserve any protection from Israeli bombs.

    If this sounds horrible, consider the alternative, which is what we have right now: an endless war in which more Israeli’s and American’s are murdered each year.

  8. Brad,

    It seems to follow from what you wrote that you think that (innocent) Israeli and (innocent) American lives are worth more than (innocent) Lebanese lives (going by your definition of “innocent”).

    Because, you seem to be suggesting that the deaths of innocent Lebanese is acceptable, as long as it prevents the deaths of innocent Israelis and Americans.

    But aren’t all innocent human lives equally valuable?

    Furthermore, what makes you think that the problem will be solved once and for all even if Israel/USA scores a decisive victory over Hezbollah this time (manages to kill all current Hezbollah members, in addition to a lot of innocent civilians as collateal damage)? Don’t you realize that the resentment among the relatives and the children of the innocent people killed today will almost certainly lead them to take up arms tomorrow, to create yet another round of violence… leading to a never-ending cycle?

    Think about it. Hezbollah didn’t even exist in 1980. It was resentment at the civilian deaths that occurred during the Israeli/ US war in Lebanon in the eighties, that was the impetus between the rise of Hezbollah, in the first place. What makes you think that history will not repeat itself?

  9. Dave:

    So… what? Israel should just sit on their hands while Hizbollah rains down thousands of rockets on their cities and hides behind the Lebenese civilian population on purpose?

    They have spent the last six years, ever since the Israel pulled out of Lebanon, building fortified concrete bunkers and supply bases interwoven with civilian popultions.

    In other words, they are using those civilians as a weapon.

    Israel is doing everything it can to minimize civilian deaths. They regularly drop leaflets in places where they’re going to strike. Meanwhile, Israelis in the north live in bomb shelters while rockets rain down on them.

    Cycle of violence! You say. The reason why that cycle continues at all is that the Islamists won’t rest until they’ve killed every last Jew. If they left Israel alone, there *would* be peace.

  10. Seems we have two Brads now. I’m the old Brad that has been commenting for a long while. Not the last comment though.
    Don, you are right, I should have written “not only was the harsh treatment of the Germans a mistake, but also the …” and I should have used spellcheck. But only time will tell how minor of a mistake that was.
    Brad2

  11. Because, you seem to be suggesting that the deaths of innocent Lebanese is acceptable, as long as it prevents the deaths of innocent Israelis and Americans.

    The terror strikes originate from Lebanon, that’s the critical difference . . . Lebanese need to root out the terrorists, or expect that someone else will.

    Aside from that, it appears that many ‘innocent’ Lebanese victims were in fact Hez . . .

    Think about it. Hezbollah didn’t even exist in 1980. It was resentment at the civilian deaths that occurred during the Israeli/ US war in Lebanon in the eighties, that was the impetus between the rise of Hezbollah, in the first place.

    Hez is Islamic radical org funded and controlled by Iran. Even without IDF going into Lebanon, the goals of the Iranians in creating Hez would be the same. More significant in Hez success was IDF withdrawl in 2000.

  12. I meant in my last post that the IDF leaving in 2000 did more to build Hez than IDF going in in ’82; Iranian support was critical.

  13. Israel is doing everything it can to minimize civilian deaths.

    Apologist.

    “On Sunday, UN High Commissioner Louise Arbour told CNN Israel’s actions in Lebanon could lead to the prosecution of its military commanders. Meanwhile, Human Rights Watch says Israel is shelling civilian areas with cluster bombs.”


    interview
    with Emergencies Director for Human Rights Watch, currently in Beirut.

  14. Hezbollah didn’t defeal Israel in 2000, Israel pulled the troops out in return for a promise of UN-brokered peace… a promise that was broken within a month.

    Don’t mistake Hezbollah’s propaganda for the truth. The Lebanese government did, and now they’re paying the price.

  15. Apologist.

    “On Sunday, UN High Commissioner Louise Arbour told CNN Israel’s actions in Lebanon could lead to the prosecution of its military commanders. Meanwhile, Human Rights Watch says Israel is shelling civilian areas with cluster bombs.”

    Who cares what the UN or Human Rights Watch says?

    If the IDF wanted to kill civilians in Lebanon, the death toll would be well above 10,000 now, not in the hundreds. My guess is that the “civilian” death toll has a very high percentage of military age males, and a surprising lack of feamles, elderly, and children . . .

  16. Hezbollah didn’t defeal Israel in 2000, Israel pulled the troops out in return for a promise of UN-brokered peace… a promise that was broken within a month.

    I know, but Hez capitalized on the pull out, claiming it as a victory. The rapid IDF pull out made the Hez claims appear reasonable.

    It was only a propaganda victory, but it raised Hez’s esteem in Lebanese eyes.

  17. Ever heard of a little group called the IRA? Bunch of terrorists, were mainly active in the UK and Ireland. Main terrorist MO was bombs in crowded areas, like town centres. Sometimes they gave warnings first, sometimes they didn’t.

    Anyway, the various factions of the IRA did a lot of their fund-raising in the US (as well as a certain amount of arms-smuggling). You see, they weren’t declared illegal there for far too long. Even now, the US isn’t bringing into force a new extradition treaty with the UK because the Irish-American community are worried might allow them to extradite suspected IRA members.

    So, by your argument, it would’ve been perfectly fine for the UK to bomb Irish-American areas of the US, should they suspect IRA terrorists are hiding there. After all, they were supporting and sheltering terrorists, and if we had to kill a few of them in the process of taking out the evildoers, well, fair enough.

  18. So, by your argument, it would’ve been perfectly fine for the UK to bomb Irish-American areas of the US, should they suspect IRA terrorists are hiding there. After all, they were supporting and sheltering terrorists, and if we had to kill a few of them in the process of taking out the evildoers, well, fair enough.

    No.

    In the US, the IRA was never part of the government (the Kennedy’s notwithstanding), and it was always illegal in the US to ship arms to the IRA. I know US arms did go to Ireland (“me little Armalite” is a song about the AR15, an IRA favorite), but that was always something the US gov would investigate and prosecute.

    If the IRA actually ran Boston like Hez runs Southern Lebanon, you might have a point. But they never did and you don’t.

    But if you want to extridite Ted Kennedy, you have my support.

  19. So, by your argument, it would’ve been perfectly fine for the UK to bomb Irish-American areas of the US, should they suspect IRA terrorists are hiding there. After all, they were supporting and sheltering terrorists, and if we had to kill a few of them in the process of taking out the evildoers, well, fair enough.

    Let me add to Don’s reply that you’d also have had to have had IRA terrorists from Boston kill eight British soldiers in Britain and Kidnap one, then launch hundreds of missiles into London…

    Keep trying.

  20.  
    I’m going to regretfully agree with anonymous to a certain extent. Although there was never official approval for the IRA, many in the US who should have known better(including Kennedy) were supportive of the IRA in various unofficial ways. Not a particular nice page in America’s recent history. I’ve read that Kennedy has since expressed regrets.
     

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