I’m not going to…
…even try to explain this:
Nothing much has changed, except that Jay is old enough to not be a prodigy any more.
The New Neo
A blog about political change, among other things
…even try to explain this:
Nothing much has changed, except that Jay is old enough to not be a prodigy any more.
Among other things that have’t changed, Juilliard is still a conservatory, not a “conservancy“; insert Layers of Editorial Oversight joke here…
Retardo: if one considers musicians trained in the classical traditions to be a members of a dying species, then “conservancy” might be appropriate. 🙂
Joking aside, this is another example of sloppy journalism. Yet another. Yet another.
The New London CT Police Department had a cutoff point for hires. Those who scored too high on an aptitude test were not hired. Only the dumber should apply to be hired for the New London Police Department.
Is there a similar policy for journalism hires? Are only the dumber hired to be journalists?
Given the horrendous amount of inept journalism on record, one can only wonder.
I remember this story from yrs. ago. As Neo said, he is much older now -an adult. His future accomplishments will indicate much about his “gift.”
However, I don’t know about the stories the parents tell (i.e. asking for a cello at age 3 before he ever saw one; starting to compose and write pieces at same age with no previous instruction as to what musical symbols represent, and how to chart them, etc.) but the teachers’ comments (themselves highly gifted, learned, and experienced) do lend credence to his prodigal talent. It may be that the talent is outsized and amazing for a child of his age and lacking of formal education training. That is what made him a prodigy throughout his youth. If his talent does not increase exponentially relative to his age, he might just not be exceptional as an adult musician. That still doesn’t mean he was a prodigy as a child.
Must note: I am not versed in music at all (much to my regret and chagrin). I was raised in a household ignorant of (?) music, and my parents refused my requests to take piano lessons. The result is that when I hear music, I just know if I like it or not. But just because I am not acquainted with theory, cadences, the difference between a fugue and a sonata (or whatever), can’t distinguish one note from another, let alone scale (at least I know some of the language that refers to music!) lol — that doesn’t mean I cannot HEAR the music.
My gift was in the area of Fine Arts, and I’ve always been able to draw anything, paint, understand perspective and be able to translate what I see 3-dimensionally into 2 dimensions at a very early age (not 3!). I certainly was no prodigy.
With my knowledge and understanding of what it takes to draw, paint, sculpt, etc. I have to admit finding humorous similar 60 Minutes stories about painting prodigys (for example, see this: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marla_Olmstead) which show abstract art (the evaluation of which is always subjective at best unlike the technicality of music) or primitively formed shapes which in my eyes show no indication of talent, let alone being a “prodigy.”
Very simply, much of it lies in the eyes — or ears — of the beholder, and the beholder’s ability to evaluate based on real knowledge and experience.
Oops! 2nd paragraph, last sentence should be:
“That still doesn’t mean he was NOT a prodigy as a child.”
I think i have a decent ear for remarkable classical music when i hear it. I didn’t hear any.
I will express some concern he might become another Bobby Fisher. Such adulation at a young age is fraught with hazard.
CBS focused on process-kid walking to internal rhythms (walk in 5/4 time yet?), playing Beethoven “symphony” (nope,’twas a sonata!) upside down & backwards, and ignored product; I didn’t hear any music.
But so it always goes with the MSM: Process over Product.
I did not watch that video, but I have sincere doubts about some of the stories about this kid’s “genius”, I think it was massaged by the parents and the media.
Mozart is frequently brought up as the foremost musical genius who ever lived, and he may well be, but even he did not have some of the abilities that this kid claims to have. They are just not humanly possible.
For sure, Mozart’s parents massaged some of his abilities for press coverage. Even he did not have fully composed music running through his head per se, he composed just like a normal human but better. Basically Mozart was a really really good ad-libber, and he had the benefit of not having recordings at the time – much of his music is borrowed from other pieces he wrote.
See this wikipedia article:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mozart%27s_compositional_method
Here is a quote from it:
“Once in Geneva I met a child who could play everything at sight. His father said to me before the assembled company: So that no doubt shall remain as to my son’s talent, write for him, for to-morrow, a very difficult Sonata movement. I wrote him an Allegro in E flat; difficult, but unpretentious; he played it, and everyone, except myself, believed that it was a miracle. The boy had not stopped; but following the modulations, he had substituted a quantity of passages for those which I had written …”
Yeah, o.k., maybe it’s just math, and maybe he’s just a flash in the pan, but I’ll prefer to think that he’s evidence of a power, a presence, in the universe greater than us. Sometimes I think our species needs a really big miracle; none seem forthcoming, but little ones can keep me hoping.
Julliard? HaHaHaHaHaHa!
Mozart didn’t go to Julliard. Beethoven didn’t go to Julliard. Bach didn’t go to Julliard.
Untalented east coast snoots go to Julliard.
Even John Lennon didn’t go to Julliard.
East coast elitist schools – a complete joke. “Take my wife…please!” Ba-d-bing! Ba-da-boom!
Nasty little twit, ain’t he?
It’s wonderful that Jay can do these things. I have to say, I’m shocked by the apparent mean-spiritedness of some of the comments.
Genius does exist, and is a marvel in our midst. I think it’s wonderful. And he seems like a sweet kid, too.
Don Janousek
For goodness [XO] sake, he started at Julliard when he was 11 or so. Give the kid a break.
Beverly:
I am in agreement with you.
I had a conversation with a friend over some beers not long ago and was posed with the interesting question “Do you think computers will ever be superior to humans in creating music?”
I just don’t see it. Music is not pure mathematics. And the computer can’t be moved by what it creates. But i suppose you could argue that the computer may possibly pull it off, only because the computer itself was created by humans.
His future accomplishments will indicate much about his “gift.”
that USED to be the case and what WAS the case in a meritocracy.
but today, we dont have that, and so he will either cave to ideology so that its ok to promote him, or he will be pushed aside to make room for others whose race or gender align with the ideals of a few with an agenda.
my cousin graduated from Julliard, so did his brother
he had his coming out concert at avery fischer hall (his own concert with a singer accompanyment), i had mine at alice tully hall (as first string soloist of an orchestra). The famous photographer i have mentinoed before, Maurice Seymour, who photographed the russian ballet, hoped i would get along with his daughter. he was photography, a son was film, wife at the time was an opera singer, one daughter played a stratavarius (her dad helped my family by ‘arranging’ a cheap instrument for me, a buffet, not bundy – and we did play together), grandson was piono and strings, other daughter was cellist.
Once merit fell from grace, the reasons for someone to stand and be counted in the room of others with similar skills, was spoiled.
my childhood was quite eclectic and full of famous artists and others, which i thought were normal, until that all faded when i was older.
what happens later is VERY sad…
his age allows one to look at him and say, wow, he is special.
later, when he is an adult, he will exist in a sea of people for whome they all claim the similar title, or work hard to put him down, if he mentiones his exceptional early years.
there are quite a lot of us… And when the iq is over 130 or 140, the outcomes are not so rosy.
generally disliked, they never get to have what they didnt realize was so special when they were young. no one will ever treat them as nice or respect them out of hand that way again.
they dont do well generally. a few do, but we forget the army of others who also showed similar promise.
to our self esteem society, they are arrogant coming out of the gate, not admirably skilled. they are a living walking talking proof that we are not equal, so you can guess who targets them too. everyone wants something of you, and no one wants to give back or reciprocate.
performing lincoln center and carnegie hall before i was a teen was cool, but beyond that, not much.
getting into bronx science a year early was also cool, but beyond that, it means nothing, as i am not listened to more than others who never went there, in fact quite the opposite (as if the punishment for attending is to be ignored to then be equal. even worse is when someone from podunk who never had the drive in their life that us few did when we were 9, claiming to be equal).
the world mostly hates us…
and we literally live dispite it and all the things that gravitate to us… from adults who think they can benifit from a study of you, or being your trainer, or introducing you to others, or having you on their team, etc… to coworkers who work hard to isolate you, cut the tall one down, etc..
you basically invent a past that is more acceptable.
Carnegie hall, dont talk about it, erase the experience and never share it.
Lincoln center concert, dont talk about it, erase the experience, replace it with a story about taking free swing lessons around the fountain.
Runway photography at Fashion week? friends with models, and marketing people, famous people, authors, politicians and more… dont talk about it, erase the experience, comment about the weather.
new project your working on? learning i may lose my job now because i work on projects at home that are unapproved by my boss (and having nothing to do with my job, and for the company!). So cut your resume down, do NOT describe what you have done, what you can do, what skills you ahve and experience. cut it down so you can be hired… hired by someone who is at the peak of their career and that peak is not as interesting as what you did when you were half their age and screwing around.
then there are the people who equate smarts and being a loner with arizona, kazinsky, etc… and are paranoid of you. they are fun.
you want to help, but that reveals you.
people are quite nasty and abusive
and there is NOTHING you can do abotu it since the more left we go, the WORSE it gets.
you stop being the person society knows helps it along, adn become the devil that enabled it to be so evil.
want to see how far it goes?
here is a book in which they make everyone of us into something we are not. its not real psychology, any more than class hatred is based in real.
remember, as long as prodigys exist, marx is wrong, and so there is this huge side, liek dawkins on athiesm, to end the existence of prodigies or make them out to be mental
he is a good example of how the information around and surrounding such people can be twisted and used to affect others to take a side.
I can tell him so much that what he spouts is untrue. it reads more like a leftist idea of oppressive parents and victimization. while that may be true of some, its not true of the majority, who such people dont believe have their own drive.
The Prodigy as Narcissistic Injury
By: Dr. Sam Vaknin
so all who are exceptionally capable are really hate filled people wishing to hurt people.
sigh…
my parents were great… i was not the tool of their failure, or the object of their future success. i was a person from birth and someone whose desires in the world are important as the adults. they would move heaven and earth to get me something educational, as they would my sister.
the day i came into the kitchen and said i didnt want to play instruments any more, was the last day it was brought up. no one ever said it was a shame, or that i should have stuck with it, or any of that.
if i picked it up again, they would say, great.
yes we desire to be listened to more, but not because we are special, but because depending on what was our focus, we may know more, and have more ability… so want to be useful in terms of merit and wish to earn our place.
we NEVER EVER got anything in any simple way as the as s hole above describes, other than ingratiating adults.
we actually had to fight and prove ourselves every step of the way through an army of syuch adults claiming that its a trick, and trying to catch us.
want to know why he plays music upside down and backwards? to prove to some adult that HE has more merit than the other kid claiming the same because like “the competition” they practiced a few pieces.
want to know why i can recite things? because it was a way to put out my competition who would have grabbed the fruit they didnt earn!
the kids that take the test for science, styvesant and brooklyn tech, certainly do not get what they have for free and easy, and certainly are competing harder than most adults ever compete in their lives!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
the fact that people dont know what you went through to EARN your place ther against others. that you had to beat out by merit on a test two grades of ny city school kids all vying for college, and this is to get into a HIGH SCHOOL.
granted, its alumni, have been fashion photographers, and nobel prize winners (7), fields medal holders, and lots and lots of others.
but sadly.. as good as they seem going in, the system sure does play games with them from then on, and the number that go on to do great things is only a small percentage given that they spend most of their time trying to re prove themselves to someone in a judges position who will change their lives and has a deep inner resentment (believing the drivel above).
I have to say, I’m shocked by the apparent mean-spiritedness of some of the comments.
i am completely NOT surprised…
try living it…
hatred all around on tap and never ends…
If Blue Jay has been born any later than he was, in any place besides NYC, in any social status lower than upper middle class, he would have been another of the broken birds this nation is filled with, intentionally crippled on the grounds that his talent would only breed jealousy amongst his peers.
I failed out of high school after repeating the 11th grade, on the grounds that I couldn’t complete homework, even though my parents by that point were standing over me with a stick to make sure all my homework was finished and dated. They never understood that public school teachers could and would claim that they never received the work, or simply put a “zero” on it for any arbitrary reason, and their union took steps to ensure that any lawsuits against them would fail. One of the most hilarious incidents was when my 10th grade biology teacher actually threatened to sue us because I’d taken apart the working model of the chlorophyll atom that I built for my science fair project. She claimed it was school property after I turned it in, and had wanted to keep it for use as a teaching aid… after she had given me a zero on the project because it was “too technical.”
Small wonder I failed out, even though I scored a 31 on the ACT.
“”I have to say, I’m shocked by the apparent mean-spiritedness of some of the comments.””
If i came off as mean spirited it was aimed at the adults giving this kid the baggage of “being the next Mozart”. Too bad his parents weren’t of even average enough intelligence to tell CBS news to f*** off. Maybe i’m just a big subscriber to the under promise and over deliver axiom.
Chlorophyll MOLECULE, I mean. Heh, I’ve become so good at making sure everything I do is flawed in some small but important way that I probably couldn’t even stop if I tried to.
Tatterdemalian,
I had one who divided the class up in rows ranging from moon rock, jelly donut, all the way up to pupil and student…
he relished putting the males in the rows of moon rock mentality, hoping to move up one notch to something useful, like a jelly donut.
All girls got As automatically
he would mentally fck with kids heads, and he HATED me for two reasons. i was tall and he was short, and he couldnt screw with my lack of confidence in my work, as i was not unsure (coming from where i came from)
he failed me in chemistry…
why? i was a male…
he had to retroactively change my grades from fails to Bs at the order of the principal, since he couldnt explain how i failed the course, but got perfect scores on the mid terms and finals which accounted for a large part of the grade.
due to his games, i was then able to get dinked for not having a score sufficiently above average to not be denied in favor of a female or race applicant.
the guidance councelor decided to tell me about things LATE (we foudn out she told others early), so that the early ones would get in, and the late ones would be out as they had no time.
told me taknig off a year to take care of my grandfather and his alzehimers wouldnt be a problem, rather than the truth that it would lock me out from scholarships.
my physics teacher was exasperated with me. i came to the new school and was put int he advanced courses. but since this was entry level physics and at bronx science we were doing college level in junior high i was bored bored bored. so i would eat and read books. she would confiscate the books, i would come up with some way to retrieve them.
the way it worked was that you did the work at your own pace, then took some tests to show you knew it, and went back.
what drove her nuts? easy… i wouldnt do a lick of any work all term. then one week before the end, i would due the whole terms work tests in two days.
to her, it meant that i could have done the whole years work in the first month.
she wanted desperately to know why i didnt. i said, then what? she said i could go to the library for the rest of the year. and i said, great, and be with the abusve sociopaths that they warehouse there, yes? be away from wht few friends i had, yes?
and what did i get extra for doing a terms work in a week? nothing… the same reward for doing the work all through the term. better to sit in the back, read books, and answer student questions.
art teacher hated me, dad was a rennaisance classicist painter. i have been doing art and music since i was a child. (neo could put some up if she cared to). she was too busy psycho analysing kids with her liberal left ways.
we would sit there, and she woudl tell my parents that i was in competition with my father, to which we looked at each other like she was nuts. he did oils, i did pencils, we worked well together, and never competed. the science idiot said all kinds of things, but we didnt let him get away with it.
back in ny i had a permanent pass and didnt ahve to attend classes except to take tests…
most of those nice people that steal my work?
they tend to think i can do more, so i will be ok. years later, everything has either been stolen, or not acted on…
Tons of stuff..
my boss was upset and yelled. your so smart, why are you working here and not upstairs with the researchers…
i said easy… they had to eject me to make room for more women and minorities… since she is a feminist activist and greenie, she sat there realizing that i was doing crap work at a dead end, with no hope of raises, promotions, and being fired… bored to tears, and all because of social engineering.
her solution was to come up wiht special rules that only apply to me. so i cant work on any projects, cant work on things to keep me busy, cant talk to the researchers unless she sits and records the meetings (they are my friends, so this makes no sense).
ie… i am in solitary confinment, where i am not allowed to make freinds at work, cant work on my own projects to get a raise, reward or award, or even show that i can do the work. cant use my experience. am told i dont have skills i have had for YEARS (and managed too).
so basically. i have to make the same salary i did 20 years ago. have no future. no friends. no work or any hobbies… and under constant abuse warehoused so that i can never succeed, but they can use my skills to bail them out.
my choice?
none…
without alternatives, there are no choices…
no hope either… only fear that it will get WORSE.
meanwhile i secretly work on artifical life and other math models and simulations for some researchers. they get to use the work, include it in their papers, but have to erase me… i have no degrees, and so will end up fired if i am on the papers. so that isnt even a hope either.
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Amy Chua Is a Wimp
http://www.nytimes.com/2011/01/18/opinion/18brooks.html?_r=1&partner=rssnyt&emc=rss
@Artfldgr: Get your own blog and stop polluting this one. You /might/ have something to say, but tl;dr, squared. And take your old socks with you when you go.