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The differences between the jihadis and the Nazis — 36 Comments

1. (7) The Nazis based their genocide on eugenics whereas the jihadis base their genocide on religion. I’d venture to say that as strong as political stances can be, they don’t quite have the drawing power of obeying God, even the false one Allah, who can override the scruples of a natural conscience. And many Germans had somewhat of a ‘Christian’ background, even if they weren’t Christians themselves. But German culture at the time wouldn’t allow baby-beheading.

   Everyone shies away from calling this a religious war, evidently on the supposition that if you name it, it somehow magically transforms from a virtual monster to a real one. But a real religious war it is.

2. Bill K:

   Some Nazis took Jewish babies by the feet and swung them, dashing their brains out on brick walls.

   The difference between that and beheading is a cultural detail.

   And I believe that the religious war distinction, although correct, is what makes the jihad motive more popular worldwide, as in point #4.

3. My apologies for forgetting that facet of Nazis with Jewish babies.

   I seem to remember that when Eisenhower visited a concentration camp, he forced the nearby villagers to walk through it as well, and forced them to look at the ovens and the bodies. And I believe that many of them wept when actually confronted with the scenes. Were those crocodile tears?

   I also wonder if Gazans, not the perpetrators but the ‘innocent civilians’ were to be force marched to look through the blood and gore at kibbutz Be’eri, would they also weep?

   Did not the background of Christianity versus Islam make some difference?

4. certainly the nazi high command was infused with pagan mysticism of the thule society, but as my link on an earlier open thread, as they condition children to kill jews with the farfour the mouse cartoon,

5. Bill K:

   I wonder too.

   The Germans at least had some degree of plausible deniability. Not sure Palestinians do at this point.

   I do think, also, that a significant number of Germans were not pro-Nazi and perhaps they were the weeping ones. I think there are some anti-jihadi Palestinians as well. What percentage? I don’t know.

6. We may obtain (I say so quite skeptically however) some small insight into the views (beliefs?) of the perpetrators in this video of Shin Bet interrogations of captive Nukhba fiends released today: https://youtu.be/HnLq0DjErIA?si=gyXOeb9N9A13xBIG

   Again, their responses are in many ways impossibly untrustworthy, and yet they are to be found to comment on their understanding (such as it may or may not be) of the Koran with associated tenets of Islam. Take it for nothing, or take it for something. I cannot confidently say which.

7. Reading about WWII as a teenager, I always wondered how ordinary Germans were brought around to support enthusiastically, support in lukewarm fashion, or at least turn a blind eye towards “The Final Solution”. I don’t need to wonder any more, since I am seeing it play out in real time and real life in the USA.
   The enthusiastic support by so many academicians, politicians and celebs for Gaza, and working overtime in excusing the Hamas Einsatzgruppen is just soul-sickening. There are so many Americans who I want nothing to do with now – not to read their books, watch their movies, listen to their music, watch them on TV … How they can even live with themselves is beyond my comprehension.

8. Stupid me, though, for not including this link of another “testimony” released today. This is a voluntary, spontaneous, as opposed to captive testimony, a phone recording of murderer in a celebratory call with his father, mother, and brother back home in Gaza. So obviously there’s no duress, no interrogator to accommodate and so on:
   https://youtu.be/3E-Tfh8Mcgs?si=m9pNR4KgU5biftTn

   And again we can find here some intimations of an heartfelt piety, yes? Something like that. Praise Allah.

   spit

9. miguel c. says, “certainly the nazi high command was infused with pagan mysticism of the thule society . . .”

   Himmler in particular was fascinated with pre-Christian Germanic paganism, setting up a peculiar cult center for SS officers in the Wewelsburg castle in Westphalia. He drew up pagan wedding ceremonies for SS men as well as having death’s-head rings designed for them. Mark Felton has a short video on the dark history of Wewelsburg Castle:

   https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VdpX4g8MqHw

   (FWIW, Hitler mocked Himmler’s interest in mysticism and the occult behind his back.)

   I think there has been a fascination among some German intellectuals with pre-Christian Teutonic culture based on the clades Variana or Varian disaster, the battle in the Teutoburg Forest in AD 9 that resulted in the almost complete obliteration of three Roman legions. In the nineteenth century, Arminius, the leader of the Germanic tribes on that occasion, came to be regarded as the heroic model of true German masculinity in contrast to the “softness” resulting from the introduction of Christianity.

   While it is true that the battle of the Teutoburg Forest occurred during the reign of Augustus, long before Christianity had become a significant concern to Roman officials elsewhere in the Empire, the eventual association of the new faith with Rome led to its being regarded as un-German in some quarters. There is a 50-minute documentary on the battle titled “The Lost Legions of Varus” that includes discussions on the role of the battle in setting what is now Germany on a separate path from those of European countries that were more completely romanized. Interestingly, a number of commenters on the video regard Arminius as a cultural hero: “Arminius was a hero to many Germanic countries as he saved their culture and identity from outside influences.”

   You can see the “Lost Legions of Varus” here:
   https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=93Wb9aa0-6Q

10. A majority of Muslim-Americans agree that Israel has a right to defend itself, but in stark contrast to other demographic groups, a majority disagree that Israel should invade Gaza,

    IOW, Israel has the right to defend itself but not to any significant degree.

    a majority agree that Hamas was justified in its attack on Israel.</

    But Israel is not justified in invading those who invaded Israel.

    .“The Palestinian people have been subjected to 56 years of suffocating occupation. They have seen their land steadily devoured by settlements and plagued by violence; their economy stifled; their people displaced and their homes demolished. Their hopes for a political solution to their plight have been vanishing,” (UN Secretary-General) Guterres said.

    The Six Day War was a response to a blockade of Israel’s Red Sea port, where Nasser made it clear he wanted to drive Israelis into the sea. Gaza hasn’t been occupied since 2005. I can see their complaining about settlements in the West Bank, but Isreal told King Hussein that if he did nothing, Isreal would stay put. Hopes for a political settlement? How many political settlement solutions have the Pali honchos turned down since 1948?

11. many notably in 2000,

    https://www.dossier.today/p/the-roots-of-palestinianism

12. another example are the blood craving thuggees as depicted in gunga din, and temple of doom

13. Hard core Jew haters ( i mean hard core) were a minority in Germany. In fact the percentage may have been higher in the Baltics , France and certainly Ukraine. What Germany had that other nations including Arabs is the banality of evil. Good Germans who would maybe have no inclination to kill Jews would follow orders and kill them. Hard core haters among the Arabs of the Land of Israel is almost universal and dont need orders.

14. UN Secretary-General Antonio Guterres has revealed himself to be both a fool and a knave.

15. Back in Portugal, Antonio Gutierrez was a card carrying Marxist. Like the Pope, we can be sure he hasn’t changed.

16. Sgt. Mom, are you familiar with The Third Wave ?
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Third_Wave_(experiment)

    It can happen here…

17. Bari Weiss has her very own Saul-on-the-Road-to-Damascus moment….

    “MUGGED BY REALITY”—
    https://www.powerlineblog.com/archives/2023/10/mugged-by-reality.php

    Kudos for her: for her honesty, her sincerity and her ability (never easy) to say—directly, coherently and definitively—“I WAS WRONG”.

    To be sure, she—well ensconced in her ideological echo chamber EVEN AFTER she quit the NYT in disgust—did an immense amount of damage along the way…but NOW, at this All-Hands-On-Deck moment, IS NOT THE TIME TO QUIBBLE.

18. BTW, some of the comments on that Powerline article are worth reading.
    And…
    The twitter account linked to by Powerline—article https://twitter.com/AmericanFWoman — regarding that Bari Weiss article is phenomenal….
    E.g.
    https://twitter.com/AmericanFWoman/status/1682180497437327360/photo/1
    https://twitter.com/AmericanFWoman/status/1678173009125822465/photo/1
    https://twitter.com/AmericanFWoman/status/1673334635097473025/photo/1
    https://twitter.com/AmericanFWoman/status/1675483067488534530/photo/1
    https://twitter.com/AmericanFWoman/status/1591093941814046720/photo/1
    https://twitter.com/AmericanFWoman/status/1698445667595702587
    This last link reminds one of Alaska Airlines pilots.

19. Oh, here’s another:
    https://twitter.com/AmericanFWoman/status/1677317934337650688

    Related (to original thread):
    “DAD, BE PROUD OF ME!”—
    https://www.powerlineblog.com/archives/2023/10/dad-be-proud-of-me.php

20. Another factoid surfaces regarding Hamas’ original plan….

    “Hamas used negotiations with Netanyahu’s office to hide massacre plans;
    “Terror group which rules Gaza held high-level negotiations on release of captive IDF soldiers and Israeli civilians while plotting attack.”—
    https://www.israelnationalnews.com/news/379103

    (With echoes of Japanese diplomats in Washington…on the eve of Dec 7, 1941…though, in their defense, they claimed they were kept in the dark.)

21. Related:
    “…The Hamas Attack On An Israeli Kibbutz, And How Residents Fought Back”—
    https://globalnews.ca/news/10042686/investigation-hamas-attack-an-israeli-kibbutz-residents-resist/
    Unfortunately, the exception…as the country, inexcusably, was overwhelmed.

    The government will ultimately not survive—the country, itself, is in existential peril—but in the meantime, there’s much work to be done.
    (And not just in Israel.)

22. Compare and contrast—one article will suffice(!)

    “Fury as ITV airs interview with British Palestinian woman on Islamophobia in the UK just days after she described the murder of Jews as a ‘homecoming’ on Iranian state TV and called Hamas attacks a ‘moment of triumph’ “—
    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-12665495/itv-interviews-Latifa-Abouchakra-Iranian-propagandist-israel-hamas-press-tv.html

    …But here’s a “bonus” anyway….
    “Israel’s plight exposes the truth about virtue signalling ‘values’ ”
    https://archive.md/W9Ocy
    H/T Blazingcatfur blog.

23. @ Barry – for the record, that Powerline post cites an X-Twitter thread that quotes from Bari’s article (and does so badly, implying that something SHE was quoting from venture capitalist Chamath Palihapitiya were her own words).

    Rather than going through layers of quoters, go straight to the source.
    Which is excellent.
    (The URL refers to Kisin’s post which follows hers, and has been linked in comments here several times.)

    https://www.thefp.com/p/the-day-the-delusions-died
    A Political Reawakening?
    A mass emergence from the woke slumber.
    By Bari Weiss and Oliver Wiseman
    October 23, 2023

24. Another HT to Blazing Cat Fur, this being an archived article about the stress on the Israeli forensic teams struggling to identify the partial, burned, or mutilated remains of Israelis murdered on October 7: “‘Horror will be etched in my mind forever’ – Israeli forensic team battles to identify maimed bodies.”

    https://archive.ph/KqVD8#selection-2891.4-2891.104

    The article requires a very strong stomach.

25. Oopsie.
    Thanks for that correction, AF…
    …and for the correct link.

26. And in further “Peace Dividend” news…
    Queen of the Night:
    “Jordanian Queen claims: ‘No evidence’ Hamas beheaded babies”—
    https://www.israelnationalnews.com/news/379141

    I’m sure her heart is in the right place, though.

27. Lest one forget…
    “Never Again: The Gates of Vienna Revisited”—
    https://www.americanthinker.com/articles/2023/10/never_again_the_gates_of_vienna_revisited.html
    H/T Instapundit.

28. For the Nazis, murdering Jews was the “Final Solution.”

    For Hamas, murdering Jews is the first and preferred solution.

29. Pingback:Instapundit » Blog Archive » NEO: The differences between the jihadis and the Nazis. (3) To accomplish the Holocaust the Nazis h

30. The Nazis actions against the Jews was are religious as Hamas. The video below takes the words directly from Hitler. The creator has done academic level investigations into the historical roots of National Socialism.

    https://youtu.be/y011Pdrb3Sk?t=1881

    And unlike what they teach on campus about the Nazis, the German professors spent 70 years teaching German college students the fundamentals that remained unnamed until Nazism was coined. The American professors took up the inculcation into American students following the war, though many of those German professors were welcomed on campus when they had to run from the Nazi establishment.

    “For more than seventy years the German professors of political science, history, law, geography and philosophy eagerly imbued their disciples with a hysterical hatred of capitalism, and preached the war of “liberation” against the capitalistic West. The German “socialists of the chair,” much admired in all foreign countries, were the pacemakers of the two World Wars. At the turn of the century the immense majority of the Germans were already radical supporters of socialism and aggressive nationalism. They were then already firmly committed to the principles of Nazism. What was lacking and was added later was only a new term to signify their doctrine. ”
    –von Mises, Ludwig (1947). Planned Chaos

31. “You can see the “Lost Legions of Varus” here:
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=93Wb9aa0-6Q

    Thanks for that link, PA+Cat. I’ll try to post more. My grandfather grew up on a farm outside Paderborn, Germany, near where that battle took place.

32. Thanks again for that link, PA+Cat.

    Again, my maternal grandfather grew up on a farm outside Paderborn, Germany, near where that battle took place.

    He was the oldest child of a large family, and his father fought on the Russian front in WWI. He immigrated to the US in 1919, when he was 18, later followed by most of his younger siblings.

    Not long before the Berlin wall fell — maybe after, but before East and West reunification — I was at my grandparents’ house, and he was telling me about his family history (things that you might otherwise never hear; they lived to be 96 and 98). The records from his church in Germany apparently show that his surname derives from a Swedish soldier who stayed in Germany at the end of the 30 Years’ War. (The Swedish king led that army and died in battle.) This was all interesting to me.

    Then he mentioned that battle against the Romans in the year 9, that was near where he grew up.

    I was an adult but didn’t know nearly as much as I do now. I doubted that this was correct (though I didn’t say anything) – that this battle really occurred as early as that? The year 9?

    After reunification though, I bought a new German history book through BOMC. Sure enough, on the very first page of chapter 1 was a woodcut of that battle.

    Somewhere I later read that where the battle was memorialized wasn’t exactly where it occurred.

    Your YouTube is highly relevant to that. It explains how that might be, how someone could and would claim that location, how the remains were only recently discovered and identified, like so much other detail about it previously unknown. So now I know how such a discrepancy might have occurred.

    The video contains a huge amount of other detail I previously didn’t know, including that that Roman army was virtually totally wiped out — and was 1/10 of ALL Roman Empire soldiers at that time.

    I had read before that battle was an important incident at the beginning of what is known as the Pax Romana, or the Roman peace, for roughly 200 years.

    Anyway, as to geography, where they show the Lippe River in relation to the Weser River — and the path the Roman army took — it is easy to see in a modern map where Paderborn is on the Lippe, and Minden on the Weser (a place name I am familiar with in the U.S.).

    Late in the video, they speculate how the world today might be different (better, I guess) had that battle not taken place — citing other evidence dating to that time.

33. I question that YouTube’s apparent conclusion that perhaps things would be better today if all of Germany had been Romanized, had that battle not taken place.

    North of where that battle was, generally closer to Denmark, at least in the 400s, were the Angles, Saxons, and Jutes, which would populate much of England at the end of the Roman Empire. I guess they were welcomed there then to provide security — and then didn’t leave.

    British historians trace the development of their system of government to how those tribes dealt with things, made group decisions, in their area of continental Europe — which was more local control rather than top down. This was why it was such a big travesty when the Normans took over in 1066.

    Not that it is like before, now, of course, but the United States is the best example. Countries that were previously part of the British Empire around the world, generally, are more free than other places.

    Again, not that today there are not powerful exceptions to such a generalization.

34. Dr. Peter Navarro, on Bannons War Room yesterday morning, made a point about the tunnels in Gaza I haven’t seen elsewhere — with implications perhaps on how the Israel might best proceed.

    https://rumble.com/v3rh4ep-peter-navarro-joins-warroom-to-discuss-the-gaza-tunnels.html

    In it they cite his article on that topic in the Washington Times.

35. dugans–

    Thank you for your feedback about the “Lost Legions of Varus” video– I first learned about Osnabrück in high school– that it was one of two cities (Münster being the other) where the negotiations leading up to the Treaty of Westphalia took place at the end of the Thirty Years’ War. As for the battle of the Teutoburg Forest, I learned about it in high school Latin class– I had three years of Latin and enjoyed studying the language very much.

    As for German history in general, both sides of my family are ethnically German, coming originally from Niedersachsen, though I’m not sure of the exact town. My mother’s side of the family came to Pennsylvania before the Civil War, because my two great-grandfathers on that side fought in the Union Army during the war. My dad’s direct connection to Germany came from his Army service in WWII. He was a paratrooper in the 82nd Airborne and was involved in the Battle of the Bulge as well as D-Day. He was in a small town called Ludwigslust (in what used to be East Germany) when the European war ended in May 1945; his division was tasked with closing down a small concentration camp and caring for the surviving prisoners.

    Small world, isn’t it? In any case, I’m glad the video was interesting to you and gave you some more information about one of the turning points in European history, bloody though it was. And I hope you’ll continue to visit Neo’s blog– there are a lot of good people here.

36. Thanks for your response, PA+Cat.

    One thing about that battle is how interesting that video might be to others here.

    How did the leader of the German tribes, who was trained by the Romans, completely sandbag three Roman legions leading to their annihilation? There was a clear strategy – only made much more so after people discovered remains in the 20th century. And which also confirmed what the Romans wrote 20 centuries earlier, about their forces going back in a few years after the battle to bury them.

    I had no idea it was like that until I saw that video. It is like the difference between just a sentence or two in a history textbook — versus the detail of how it actually happened. You say you learned about it studying Latin in high school, so I take it you read about it from the original Roman sources?

    I hope the IDF has a better go of it in Gaza.

    Like you, I have other German ancestors on both sides of the family, both north and south, some from other countries or in areas where borders were still in flux.

    Two as I recall met in Erie County, PA, and married there. The husband immigrated from Denmark in 1848, and was actually Dane, but by the time he was drafted (I believe) into the Union Army, his papers said “Prussia,” since that city was no longer part of Denmark then. I think the final border in that duchy was decided by plebiscite after WWII. His wife was from “Swedish Pomerania,” which I think was part of Sweden for quite awhile after the Thirty Years War, but which by then was part of Germany.

    My maternal Grandmother was from a German-speaking part of Switzerland.

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