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On the election and the law

The New Neo Posted on by

I haven’t watched this video yet, but I’m putting it up here because it’s been recommended, and I’ve liked these two lawyers’ discussions in the past. I believe the relevant part starts about minute 18:

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On the election and the law — 39 Comments

  1. The streams of these two on Sundays have become regular watching for me. I have learned more about our system and it’s history by listening in than from any other source. Do yourself a favor and watch and share it.

    If you don’t have time for all 2.5 hrs, Viva puts up segments as separate videos during the week.

  3. Barr’s on it.

    Barry Meislin: Not to be a downer, but wasn’t Barr on Russiagate a while back?

    Though I’m sure Barr will have a crackerjack report on 2020 vote fraud by 2030.

    I partly blame Barr for Trump’s current hard spot. If Barr had gone to bat, even if not perfectly prepared, sometime before Labor Day, it might have made a difference.

    As things stand, if Biden is elected, as seems likely, Barr’s work will count for nothing. Even if he gets off the dime before Trump is out of office, it won’t matter much.

  4. In the video this was not explained: The Court also has held that a legislature may delegate its authority under the Elections Clause to other entities or officials. A few states have chosen to transfer power to draw congressional district lines from their respective legislatures to non-partisan or bipartisan “independent redistricting commissions.” These states believe that such commissions can make the electoral process more fair by preventing voters from being divided into congressional districts in ways that unduly protect existing officeholders (“gerrymandering”). Did not find any info where the state’s executive officers have that power.
    https://constitutioncenter.org/interactive-constitution/interpretation/article-i/clauses/750

  5. Scott adams has some very interesting angles as well..
    like how the left set themselves up
    and how biden will have a hard time dismantling america first…
    and other good insightful looks

  6. I too am skeptical that Barr will come up with anything. I suspect what will happen is that the DOJ will look into several allegations and find nothing “substantial” which will put all this to bed. Perhaps that’s cynicism.

  7. Scott adams has some very interesting angles as well..–Artfldgr

    A funny thing Adams mentioned is how great he feels physically about a Biden win … because he no longer feels like he might be killed at any moment for supporting Trump!

  8. amr —

    From the page you linked:

    On occasion, Congress has exercised its power to “make or alter” rules concerning congressional elections, and some of its laws lie at the very heart of the modern electoral process. It has established a single national Election Day for congressional elections, and mandated that states with multiple Representatives in the U.S. House divide themselves into congressional districts, rather than electing all of their Representatives at-large.

    One would have to go run down the act of Congress mandating districts, but I would imagine it puts authority to do so into the hands of the state legislatures. Presumably a redistricting commission works for the legislative branch and isn’t part of the executive branch.

    We also see Congress intervening in redistricting with things like the Voting Rights Act and the mandating of a certain number of majority-minority districts.

  9. “…skeptical…”

    Always good to be skeptical.
    But note that Richard Pilger the TOP DoJ Voter Fraud Investigator (with quite a bit of “baggage”) has quit as a result, which tells me (at least) that this is the REAL deal.
    https://www.zerohedge.com/political/ag-william-barr-authorizes-justice-department-probe-voter-fraud

    And while the Obama/Bidenites will undoubtedly cry “MOST FOUL / MOST TRUMPIAN / MOST DEPLORABLE”—that he’s quitting to protest an ILLEGAL (or something—the Democrats/MSCM will come up with something; they always do) investigation—his compromised history SHOULD tell us precisely that the investigation is exactly what’s required and on the right track (as if there were any question about it…).

    Onward.

  10. Pilger (cont.):
    The plot thickens…
    https://redstate.com/shipwreckedcrew/2020/11/10/pay-not-attention-to-the-drama-queen-at-doj-who-resigned-after-barr-authorized-us-attorneys-to-investigate-fraud-n277710
    H/T Blazingcatfur blog

    Key grafs (of many):
    “I worked with Pilger… He was so arrogant and never let us pull the trigger on election fraud cases. He resigned because of this right here… Barr told ‘prosecutors they could take investigative steps such as interviewing witnesses during a period that they would normally need permission from the elections crimes section.’ Before Barr’s annoucement (sic), that permission came directly and solely from Pilger. He was arrogant and lazy… He lost the power today so now he’s walking. Good riddance.”

    …and:
    “But, missing from much of the coverage of what Barr did today is the most significant point — what his statement did was authorize the use of federal grand juries to gather evidence.
    “FBI agents will often conduct interviews and gather evidence without the benefit of grand jury assistance. But federal prosecutors don’t go forward with new cases without opening up a grand jury matter.
    “THIS is what the left-wing pundit class is so alarmed about over AG Barr’s announcement.”

  11. I do want to know if it is possible for the federal government to establish standards for elections for federal offices. Fraudulent state mail-in elections cannot continue to be allowed to determine the direction of the entire nation.

  12. Hello, Kate. That’s an interesting gap in the process, is it not? I was just thinking about that this morning. Nothing was dropped into the U. S. Constitution by chance, so there must have been a reason why the Framers left the regulation of place and time and so on of the presidential election, for example, to the States. But I don’t know what that reason was at the moment.

    huxley, hello – that bit from Adams that you mentioned about his feelings at this point is a little curious to me; didn’t he say something several weeks ago that he was going to take Biden down, having that little grudge factor going on, as I recall? Or is Adams starting to try to memory-hole that stuff? I hope not.

  15. It would be impossible to have ‘one’ election day. 140 million voters could not vote in one day unless election law changed to make people – what – vote by their phone? Or maybe put a polling place on every corner of every city in America and doing 24 solid hours of voting? This guy has no clue what he is talking about. The courts have not ‘turned a blind eye’ to allow voting for more than one day. What he seems ignorant of is the fact that in the 1780’s only about 20 to 25% of the population could vote. Today around 70% of the population can vote.

  18. Jahaziel:

    Could you say what’s horrible about it? I watched some of it and didn’t find it horrible, but it’s long and I haven’t watched most of it.

  19. ” …The courts have not ‘turned a blind eye’ to allow voting for more than one day. What he seems ignorant of is the fact that in the 1780’s only about 20 to 25% of the population could vote. Today around 70% of the population can vote….”

    That’s not an argument, it’s a joke. Voting has never been easier for those supposedly competent and responsible citizens who wish to have a say in how we are governed.

    Perhaps we could do better yet, and satisfy the most punctilious concerns that all “voices” be heard, by having lounge chairs installed in each dwelling space, and rigged with red and green buttons labeled “Yes” and “No”, or “Give me more”, and “Enough”. This, so that even the most intellectually comatose and languidly disposed of our “fellow” citizens may conveniently express their opinions as to how we may better serve them.

    How unfair to expect that those who would direct us to defend them, or pay for their personal follies, or share their personally worthless, soulless fates, should have to actually show up or even conform to a particular day, when announcing their preferences.

    Yeah …

    This is going to be hilarious. As TJ mentioned, watch what Bejing does when Daffy and the Tramp take office. LOL

    Don’t worry about mushroom clouds on the horizon though. They will drop to all fours the moment the really “big guy” snaps his fingers.

    You deserve to be a serf, or a human termite as Helmut Thielicke* framed it, Montage. You were obviously born for it. Too bad we have to share the same polifical space.

    * author of “Nihilism: Its Origin and Nature … 1961.”

  20. DNW
    Good grief.

    Republicans and Democrats alike have voted prior to the election day for years because it is allowed. Yet even voting a full two weeks before an election voters wait in line for more than an hour. Not everyone is rich [or unemployed?] like you are and find it very inconvenient to wait 12 hours in line to vote on election Tuesdays. Early voting is a convenience that causes no harm.

    Or do have some conspiratorial evidence that it causes irreparable harm to our elections? LOL.

    I get it if you dislike mail-in voting. But now you dislike even making regular legal voting done in more than one day? Wow.

    I don’t often answer some of the foolish comments here, which is why I usually only address Neo who at least provides cogent arguments within the realm of reason. Good day, sir.

    Chases Eagles
    Prove that the mail-in votes were fraudulent to tip the election to Trump. I await your ‘evidence’. Not anecdotal three dead people in West Virginia voted evidence but irrefutable evidence.

  21. Montage:

    Your dripping condescension is quite misplaced. Usually you are more polite than that.

    If this country wanted to have one-day voting it would. It just a question of logistics and money, and could easily be done with enough polling places. Some absentee voting under certain circumstances would be fine, too.

    Or at the very least, limiting voting to a much shorter period. The current sytsem is ridiculous and an invitation to fraud of many kinds. No country on earth countenances a similar system.

  22. Montage defines what “evidence” is. LOL

    Somehow I suspect nothing will meet his standard. Just as there is likely no such thing as an invalid vote or an ‘illegal” alien (aka non-citizen).

    Prove it Montage. What do your words actually mean?

  23. Montage, I don’t have to prove a damn thing. You are one that said something was “impossible”. Prove impossible.

    There is zero proof that mail-in voting is secure. There is NO chain of custody from a valid, verified, legal voter to the ballot box. None. Zip. Zero. Nada. Period. The end.

  24. Hard to say what “proof” really IS these days…if the person asking for it insists on looking in the opposite direction whenever it’s proffered.

    But, um, maybe this will “help”…. (Not holding my breath, though…):
    https://pjmedia.com/election/tyler-o-neil/2020/11/10/10-reasons-pennsylvanias-election-results-may-be-irredeemably-compromised-n1136044

    (Or maybe it will help in the future—in a “post-facto” kind of way—if that makes any sense…)

  26. No doubt, as a seeker after Truth—wherever it may lead you(!)—you’ve read avidly the links I posted above…and are thirsting—nay, clamoring!—for more.

    Well, here goes:
    https://thefederalist.com/2020/11/10/i-was-in-philadelphia-watching-fraud-happen-heres-how-it-went-down/

    Bonus (for seekers):
    https://www.zerohedge.com/political/why-biden-should-second-trumps-call-ballot-reviews

    (I think we can all agree that this must be designated, “Fantasy of the Week”!)

  29. Yawn….
    https://www.foxnews.com/politics/trump-2020-campaign-pennsylvania-election-lawsuit-will-prevail

    Key grafs:
    ‘…On Tuesday, Murtaugh claimed that “Democrat voters in Philadelphia were called and said, you better come on in, there might be a problem with the mail-in ballot that you submitted and they were invited to come in and cast a provisional vote before Election Day.”

    ‘ “That is not allowed,” he stressed, aruging (sic) that “Republican voters were not given that same opportunity.”

    ‘ He went on to say that those who voted in person in Pennsylvania, “were subjected to rigorous security standards,” which including checking ID’s and confirming signatures.

    ‘ By contrast, Murtaugh added, “there were no such safeguards” for the more than two million voters who mailed in a ballot in Pennsylvania.

    ‘ “You cannot have an election and treat different voters differently within the same state,” Murtaugh said. “That is a violation of the equal protection clause of the U.S. Constitution and it’s a very, very serious offense.” ‘

    Just one more reason for the Democrats to trash the Constitution, I guess…

    (Oh, and don’t forget about that amazing prophet who moonlights as PA’s Attorney General….)

  30. The deep state Dems were cheating in numerous ways. There is almost no way to know what the real legal vote totals are.

    They should redo the election in the fraud cities.
    Or, declare Trump the winner since Biden gained only after the voting fraud/ irregularities started.

    I’d prefer a redo with much better security and only in-person / handicapped support effort. With cameras watching the counting.
    And likely seeing that Biden’s totals are reduced by 20-40%, far more than Trump’s maybe 5% total reduction.

    But gloating Montage brings up two important points:
    find it very inconvenient to wait 12 hours in line to vote on election Tuesdays. Early voting is a convenience that causes no harm.

    a) the long waits, due to lousy gov’t logistics. McDonald’s tries to serve millions daily with only a 6 min wait or less. It’s a matter of dedicating enough polling places, like every school district, and poll workers.

    b) Ease of use that causes no harm. False. It presents an irresistible target for gov’t fraud. Fraud in elections is quite harmful.
    Yet it’s very very true that Americans love convenience.
    In this case, too much – meaning the love of convenience means accepting a very fraud-friendly mail-in process.

    In order to reduce fraud, most states have specific procedures to be followed. These procedures were not all followed – and many were deliberately not followed. Like a supervisor’s order to backdate a mail in ballot received too late. Backdating is illegal.

    The BBC in 2016 gave a list of red-flags on fraud:
    https://thefederalistpapers.org/us/new-bbc-study-elections-shows-spot-tell-tale-signs-vote-rigging
    (in case you hadn’t already seen it).

    The Dems committed fraud. There is evidence. It’s not clear what the courts will do with the evidence.

    So … like in 3rd world struggling democracies, they should redo the election. Honestly.
    Even with less convenience to the voters, and especially to the dead voters.

  31. Montage,
    I have read your pathetically whining [Neo was unjust in accusing you of condescension] excuse for a rebuttal; and note it hinges on nothing more than your complaint that you or those of a mind with you, might find the exercise of the franchise “inconvenient”.

    Which rather than refuting my mockery of your puling weakness, instead demonstrates its aptness. Won’t somebody somewhere wire up Montage a reclining rocker so he can vote without extending himself?

    Federal law, Montage, made in accordance with the Constitution sets aside a Tuesday in November for the election of members of Congress and electors. This regularization of procedure is critical to safeguarding the validity of the announced outcome.

    If the effort of cooperating with the program in order to help ensure its integrity, if one day spent in tne exercise of your franchise every four, or at most two, years is too inconvenient for you given the availability of absentee ballots in most states for the aged and infirm, that, then, tells me all I need to know about your personal fitness for citizenship. Perhaps you should join DNW as he looks skeptically at the moral propriety of Montage’s even holding the franchise. Wouldn’t Montage actually be happier in a nice warm crib somewhere?

    The issue of your personal inferiority aside Montage, I do have no problem in principle with secure ballots being sent through the mail when there is no other option for the honest exercise of a franchise right to which that particular person is entitled.

    But wholesale voting by mail makes a joke of the very serious matter of citizenship: transforming what are public actions with potentially life altering consequences for both one’s self and one’s ostensible peers, into a lazy parody of the moral seriousness with which it truly must be approached if the act and the actors, are worthy of being taken seriously.

    Of course, for those of you who have been granted a voice but can muster no substantive, as opposed to purely formal, reason on God’s green earth why anyone should take either the voice or the body that emits it seriously, then mailing your vote in probably comports nicely, if figuratively, with your way of approaching most other things in life not related to your immediate self-interest.

    Lavinia, peel the boy a grape …

  32. Montage
    Not everyone is rich [or unemployed?] like you are and find it very inconvenient to wait 12 hours in line to vote on election Tuesdays

    In previous elections, voting on the day of the election, I have never had to wait more than 2 or 3 minutes before I was at a voting booth. This year, there was no wait at all. Your claim of 12 hours is, like most of your comments, total nonsense.

    Your sneering “Not everyone is rich [or unemployed?] like you are” earns you contempt.

  33. Your dripping condescension is quite misplaced. Usually you are more polite than that.

    My aura and the Divine Will is breaking them.

  34. “Your sneering “Not everyone is rich [or unemployed?] like you are” earns you contempt.”

    I guess that slipped right by me as a dig; if that is what it was supposed to be. After years of political commenting, personal swipes unrelated to the construction of my comments per se, go pretty much disregarded by me as being part of the expected and standard operating procedure used by emotional types. It’s related to their class consciousness “personal is the political” hermeneutic.

    Many of my own comments have focused on turning the ultimate implications of their own predicate assumptions back on them in the form of casual reductios, as if assuming per their own worldview: radical naturalism, scientism, and atheism or at least moral nihilism.

    Of course by the time you work your way through their list of causes, from antinomianism to xenophobia, you pretty much get the picture that it is definitions and boundaries and the concept of intelligibility itself that are at the root of their problems and grievances.

    That has become especially clear in recent years as slogans about unconditional inclusion, acceptance, welcome, validation, affirmation, “community values”, non-judgmentalism, and other like themes have emerged from behind the ideological draperies of the past to stake their claims to preeminence in their own and by their own, right.

    The “snowflakes” have constructed an overarching ideology, even a moral anthropology you might call it, based on their own mental disorders and their craving for inclusion and public validation above all else.

    It’s a pretty remarkable thing to behold.

  35. @ Gringo: This year was much different. I waited for two hours this year in the morning after deciding to miss part of my work day. The turn out in my district was a lot. Keep in mind the was the very first of early voting. I can’t imagine the lines for those that decided to vote the day of. This was in a relatively dense city. My brother waited for about 4 hours in UWS, NYC to vote this year.. In past elections I waited, at most, maybe 5 minutes.

  36. GRA:

    That seems strange to me. There was a large turnout, yes, but far more people voted early or voted by mail. So the lines make no sense. Is it because they had fewer polling places this year? I can’t find any information on that at the moment.

  37. GRA
    The turn out in my district was a lot. Keep in mind the was the very first of early voting. I can’t imagine the lines for those that decided to vote the day of.

    I recall driving by an early voting site in my precinct in the last month, and saw a substantial line. But there was no line on Election Day.

  38. Hello, Neo. Re: your comment at 3:02 11-Nov, at least in the Capital Region, there were indeed fewer polling places, and somewhat different ones than usual. There was some consolidation, for example. Where I went to vote was about a quarter-mile away from my usual polling place and combined that usual clientele with one other. I infer this because they had 2 voting machines, one for each of the usual precincts, and at one point as our early-morning line was moving along slowly, there was a call for anybody from [my usual polling place] to skip ahead, presumably in order to speed things along.

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