Flying while disabled
Commenter “physicsguy” observes:
… I was flying Southwest with their open seating policy [and] I observed that the number of wheelchair people at Delta, UA, American gates was about 50% less…those airlines have reserved seats. Many of the SW wheelchair people were in their 50s. I looked at it as a way to get first boarding even by passing the paid Group A pax.
Disney is running into the same issue and are cracking down. People were claiming disability and getting scooters and wheelchairs which then allowed them and their family to get first in line to rides again by passing both the paid lightning lane people and standbys. Disney said no more and now requires written medical documentation. I was wondering if Southwest does the same?
I had always assumed that in order to get disability boarding on the airlines one had to offer proof from a doctor, much as a person needs to do in order to get a handicapped placard for a car. But when I looked it up for physicsguy, I was surprised to see that I was wrong. Apparently, airlines are forbidden by law from requiring proof of disability. The whole thing is on the honor system, and although the airlines know that people abuse it, their hands are tied.
Here’s the scoop from a Southwest discussion board. The original question went like this:
I understand SWA has wonderful customer services, but departing Chicago yesterday to Florida (a miracle flight) the pre-board number was unreal. There were 10 wheelchairs (and some had person(s) accompanying them, 17 persons with canes (also with some person(s) accompanying them. So there were at least 40 pre-boards. When exiting the plane in Florida, the majority hopped up and exited asap. I even saw one person walking to her rental car in the garage without her cane. I had A-23, but was now A-63….I strongly suggest that SWA re-evaluate its pre-boarding procedure.
And the answer was this:
We follow federal regulations in offering preboarding to Customers with disabilities in order to comply with the Air Carrier Access Act: http://airconsumer.ost.dot.gov/publications/disabled.htm. Certainly and regrettably, some Customers have taken advantage of preboarding when they did not need it. Still, we cannot ask a Customer what their disability is or for “proof” of a disability. Additionally, we are unable to tell preboarding Passengers where they can/cannot sit on the aircraft (with exception of the emergency exit row). When a Customer requests to preboard, our Employees will ask 1) do you need assistance boarding the aircraft? and/or 2) do you have a specific seating need to accommodate your disability? If the answer to either question is yes, we must allow the Customer to preboard and we are only able to use these parameters to ascertain the legitimacy of a Customer’s preboarding request.
There is no question that some people will abuse this policy, but it seems the airlines are powerless to stop it, unless there’s been some change in the law since this 2017 discussion occurred. There is also no question that sometimes you can’t tell who is disabled by looking at the person; there are indeed invisible disabilities. In an airport, a passenger is usually required to walk long distances and might be carrying or pushing a bag. Some people who look completely fine and are not all that old might have significant trouble doing those things without assistance.
And even with handicapped placards for cars, which require documentation to get, people can and do abuse them. I’ve seen it happen with people I know, for example – where someone in the family is handicapped and got the placard, and then someone else uses it now and then. I’ve also seen genuinely handicapped people be harassed by others who think they don’t look handicapped enough to have the placard, and yet they are handicapped and need the help.
So the bottom line is that abuse will always happen, and harassment of the innocent will also happen. It seems to me, though, that the airline system, which requires no proof at all, is an invitation for people to take advantage.
Most of my flying was on planes or helicopters that I was gonna jump from – probably less than 7 or 8 on other flights in my life. Now? With all the “Karens” and other crazies flying nowadays there is no way I’d be on a public flight. From pics & videos I have seen, there’s more room in a hot box w/ 4 other prisoners…Jeez!?!
As I said in the open thread, SW can cut this abuse down to a manageable size by eliminating open seating. By not having reserved seats and an almost free for all boarding process, they open themselves to this. From the discussion board you quoted, I’m not the only one who notices the abuse.
I love SWA but I have also noticed this problem. I have noted most entering requiring a wheelchair seem to be cured inflight and hustle off the plane when it lands. SWA could correct this by requiring those that use early boarding to be the last off. A tip, no need to upgrade when flying out of Orlando. Over half the plane boards early with children…
Technically, the Disney part is incorrect. Most lines at Disney are wheelchair accessible, so renting a wheelchair or scooter hasn’t been a front of the line pass since…well, a long time. A few of the original attractions might not have accessible queues, but those are few and far between these days, and the number of wheelchairs lined up in the alternate way usually don’t save you any time.
The issue is that Disney will give ANYONE what is essentially a free fastpass (or lightning lane as it’s called now) for anyone who claims to have one of a myriad of non-mobility issues – autism, anxiety, IBS, ADHD, PTSD, MS, Chrons, sun sensitivity…and they don’t ask for proof because of the whole HIPAA issue.
However, because fastpasses now cost money and because there IS no system to check for actual disability, they’ve run into the issue where 70-80% of the lightning lane is the disability card holders. That makes the standby queue basically come to a standstill, and it backs the lightning lane up to make the paid LL users frustrated with their wait.
Disney is now changing it to where they will ONLY give it out to guests with “developmental disabilities, such as autism,” and offer some sort of “return to line” pass for those with bathroom needs. They also say they are cracking down on the abusers, but they’re also still not asking for documentation, so…no idea how they’re going to know who is faking it and who isn’t.
The changes don’t officially go into affect until May 20th, and they’ve been tight lipped as to how all these changes are going to actually work.
Anyway, I know your post wasn’t about Disney – that was just a little aside in the commenter’s response – but I just wanted to hop in and flesh out that whole fiasco. Faking disabilities is DEFINITELY a huge issue at Disney, though it’s honestly their own doing for various reasons.
Dear wife and I quit Southwest 100 percent due to its open seating policy.
https://images.app.goo.gl/x5FCXotFraD6BNj48
When I used to fly that airline, I’d rat out the “disabled” pre boarders who’d take an exit row seat. The last time I flew that airline, the flight attendants were better at watching it for that.
(I no longer fly them. I know a piece of garbage who works for them and if they hire garbage like that, I can’t feel remotely safe on the airline.)
Seems as if Homeless Guy could make a few bucks selling cheap canes from Temu at stoplight a block from airport
1. My Wife has a Car Placard for Disabled Parking spots. I do not use it, Period.
2. Many yrs ago I saw a person park in a handicap parking space (do not remember if they had a placard or license plate). She got out and started walking to the Gym. I looked at her, I asked her why she was parking in handicap parking. She turned to me and raised her pant leg – prothesis leg. I apologized and she replied no problem and thanks for noticing the handicap parking.
3. When we fly we do try to board first because we would hold up the boarding process for others.
When my mother was still alive, she had a handicapped placard. When I’d take her places, I’d drop her off at the door, help her to a bench, and then I would go park in the handicapped parking space. Because when we’d leave, she would never wait for me to go get the car and would start walking towards it. So instead, she and I would walk together to the car.
I’m sure there were people giving me the evil eye when they saw me parking in a handicapped space.
I’m a caregiver and travel companion for a seriously physically handicapped person (stroke) … our frustration with air travel is not the pre-board abuse, but the TSA abuse. My friend uses a cane that needs to be set to a specific height and the TSA will take it apart, I suppose to inspect for firearms or swords or something, then not put it back together again. And what’s worse, my friend requires a leg brace to walk, as well as the cane … sometimes, not always, the TSA will require him to go through without the brace because it has metal hardware on it , which is horribly dangerous for him … they could wand him instead, if they truly perceive him as a mortal threat. It is a gauntlet of torture for this poor man, and it’s different every time, so there is no preparing for it.
You know how in some old novels the “authority bureau agents” are shown searching someone’s apartment and leaving it entirely in shambles with clothing and furniture sliced up, curtains torn down, lamps broken, furniture overturned, valuables missing, etc? Yeah, that’s what they do to my friend. He doesn’t travel very much any more. Matrix success.
I liked the Southwest system once you could check in online. The last few years I did the wheelchair thing but now I don’t fly at all. Until this year I drove everywhere under 500 miles but that is over too. I did notice the growth in early boarding lines.
I used to fly a lot internationally, and from quite an assortment of third world countries. I have often wryly noted the magical healing properties of long international flights, especially to NYC, Houston and Miami. A lot of people from South America and the Caribbean travel regularly to these cities in the US in order to shop for the many things they cannot get at home.
Passengers that were pre-boarded in wheelchairs, with their entire retinue of minders (often 2 generations, and many babies) are accompanied onto the plane in a leisurely way, with many, many carry-on items. The wheelchairs line up at the boarding gate in the jetway, just like the planes line up outside on the taxiway.
And then when the destination is reached, my goodness the spryness that is on display is remarkable. I really think the airlines should advertise their services and charge extra for the success of their spas. Maybe it’s the food.
From my previous comment on this:
“Unfortunately, although I’m 91, people say I look like I’m in my 60s. Thus, people give me dirty looks when I’m in a wheelchair. It’s a shame, because I really would prefer to still be hearty enough to deal with airports on my own. Sorry to be an annoyance to my fellow passengers.”
My wife and I have never used wheelchairs for boarding. Once we get to the gate, we walk on board with everyone else. We’re not disabled, just old.
Southwest’s seating system is a oner in the industry as far as I know. Also, that they have no first-class section sets them apart.
It does speed things up during boarding. You’d be surprised how many late departures are due to boarding snags.
If I was an airline CEO, my airline would have assigned seats, and board by rows, beginning at the back and proceeding forward. We flew on LAN from Santiago to Miami once. That’s the way they boarded their plane, and it was smooth and efficient. At least they could board coach that way. But if I had my druthers, and was sitting in first class, I’d like to board last. It’s more comfortable in the terminal than in the airplane, IMO.
The airline industry has always been a difficult one. Herding people on to aluminum tubes efficiently, getting them to their destinations on time, and making money has been an elusive goal. Throw in the TSA and enormous airports with the attendant hikes to the gates, charges for bags, food, etc., and I’m amazed that the demand still seems to grow.
}}} In an airport, a passenger is usually required to walk long distances and might be carrying or pushing a bag. Some people who look completely fine and are not all that old might have significant trouble doing those things without assistance.
Indeed, I had a very elderly friend about 15 to 10 years ago (he passed away in Dec. 2013) who routinely flew to visit relatives. He was 80 to 85 in the timeframe above, and could walk ok, but could not handle the long distances in the concourses, so always had a golf-cart type ride from arrival to departure (usually Atlanta, for his flights — VERY understandable if you’ve been to the Atlanta airport! It’s not the worst, but you are likely to have a pretty long walk!).
He also had a handicapped tag for his car. I often drove his car at that time (he’d had a stroke and was not a reliable driver any more — he could do ok for most functions, but had issues staying in-lane and judging distances), but I don’t believe I ever abused it — it was only used if he was in the car… I personally hate the ridiculous NUMBER of HC spaces there tend to be, but don’t approve of abusing the hang tags at all.
Yeah, I just flat out disagree with this. Yes, it is often true, no argument. But there are a large class of people who rise above that — it’s an animal presentment — not pure animal, as animals don’t have any timebinding ability to remember “evils done” to them… but it’s an uncivilized and animalistic response to the world. There are, unquestionably people who know better than to let this govern them. And this is, by and large, what Christ was all about — the Sermon on the Mount is the heart of everything of Christian philosophy —
The part on Retaliation (5:38) is of particular relevance. No, it’s not always easy to follow and obey, but it is expected for you to do your best to rise above the petty anger and revenge of “evils done to me”. The idea is, that such “revenge” is God’s place, not yours.
Not everyone need be a Christian to see the wisdom in this. Gandhi was no Christian, but even he saw, “An Eye For An Eye only makes the whole world blind” (see after for another observation):
THAT SAID, I believe it is possible to soften it somewhat. Modern Game Theory has shown, via the Iterated Prisoner’s Dilemma, that the proper pattern to live by (the one which “wins” the most often, of all that have been devised) is the Judeo-Christian, “An Eye For An Eye, With Forgiveness.”
This discourages action against each other, but also allows for the breaking of endless tit-for-tat revenge chains, e.g., “Your father killed my father, because his grandfather killed your grandfather, because… (elided), so I will kill you!!“, which “An Eye For An Eye” by itself encourages. And it does very effectively against ruthless living strategies (e.g., “fuck ’em before they fuck you!”)
I believe that action against an evil done to you needs to be dealt with on an impersonal basis, rather than a personal one — if you do act, you can’t be doing it because you are angry or hurt. You can only do something because you believe it was an evil that could not be allowed to go unpunished, to NOT be responded to with a “tit for tat” form of response, for the simple reason that the evil in question could not be seen as having been “gotten away with”… for evils should never be “gotten away with.” You pretty much have to look carefully within yourself to know your own internal motivation. If you can’t do that, or if the motivation is “revenge” in nature, you need to turn the other cheek, just to not stain your own soul with a responsive evil that equals the original.
This is, ideally, where the modern Justice System is supposed to operate from — an impartial and non-personal examination of actions and the providing of consequences for them. Yes, it often fails, but it’s an ideal, not the human reality that we do live with.
BTW:
This is also later addressed, indirectly, via Matthew 9:
I argue that your enemy is probably not your enemy because they want to be enemies, but there is, instead, something which sets you at odds, which might be changed or dealt with in such a way that you may not be friends, but can, at least, not be enemies. By this, one may avoid doing those “evils done by others” to oneself and to that enemy.
And the above observation by Jesus is in line with that — by turning the other cheek, and speaking softly in response to anger, you can sometimes “turneth away wrath” and gain some common ground from which you can both survive and prosper. Because this is both a healthy, civilized, response, and can help find a suitable common ground for both of you to work from, without tearing at each other, as animals are wont to do.
And that last, is, in my Not So Humble Opinion, what Christ is actually about — we started as little better than animals… but now, after however many generations, God expects us to be more than that, to be rational, thinking human beings, not animals driven by emotions alone and no consideration for the position of others.
We should put ourselves into our opponent’s position, and see what their goals and needs are, and try and find an accommodation with them which does not put the entire burden onto the loser, and makes it more bearable for all parties in opposition to one another**.
And, no, I don’t think you need to be a Christian with a belief in God to see the rationality and worth of that to all human beings.
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** No, don’t “roll over and play dead”, but you should aim for common ground, not for “I want it all, and I have the power to take it all… so it’s all mine!“
“As I said in the open thread, SW can cut this abuse down to a manageable size by eliminating open seating. By not having reserved seats and an almost free for all boarding process, they open themselves to this. From the discussion board you quoted, I’m not the only one who notices the abuse.”
I don’t think this will happen. I fly SWA regularly. At a minimum right now, a round trip from either LAS or GEG to PHX every month. But before I retired, I was flying weekly round trips somewhere. We had 6 offices in 4 SW states. All SWA cities. Added some more after I left. Again SWA cities. The firm loved that if your plans changed, the airline didn’t gouge you. No change fees, etc. Two years ago, Lost two 1st class tickets with AA for over $1k, because of an accident. Not with SWA. With SWA, I move my reservations around – a lot. Always have. Last month, I was booked on 4 different flights between PHX and LAS in one day. Harder with seat assignments. Then there is the problem that seat assignments with other airlines have been monetized (As well as baggage). Gouge for anything but a center seat towards the back. Gouge for any checked luggage. Etc.
SWA started with a lot of frequent travelers between cities in TX. And expanded from there. Now, it seems to still have a lot of frequent flyers for short hops, then a lot of budget conscious vacation travelers who fly very infrequently. It’s set up so that frequent travelers with last minute reservations and changes can get an aisle or window seat.
Another reason that SWA likes it, is that, surprisingly, their scheme loads the plane more quickly. They still turn their flights around more quickly than anyone else. (And are allowed to burn fuel to make up time in the air). That ultimately means paying less for their planes, because they spend more time in the air.
SWA tries to police the handicapped preboarding. When you get your reservations, there is an option where you can request a wheelchair or the like. Prints as a code on the boarding pass. Some gate agents won’t let you preboard if you don’t have the code on your boarding pass, don’t arrive in a wheelchair, and are under, say, 70. My wife does need extra time to board, and for awhile needed a wheelchair, so we find this helpful.
A note – SWA does a good job at preventing pre-boarders from sitting in exit rows. They have a flight attendant posted at the exit seats, to keep preboarders, kids, and the obviously infirm or otherwise unable to help out of those seats. They don’t allow seating there until they hear “General Boarding” over the PA system. Used to be that the gate attendant would give the first regular passenger a card, and they would give it to the flight attendant who meets you getting on the plane, and she would make the announcement. This seems to work better than what some other airlines do. On UA, I have seen rows of morbidly obese, and rows of the infirm elderly in exit rows, and nothing they could really do – they got themselves assigned those seats, so they are theirs (yes, they can move them, but it’s a pain, that flight attendants with 20 years seniority aren’t going to go through). I prefer exit rows, and get them about 50% of the time on SWA, but will discontinue when I can’t handle the exit door and helping people out.
What scares me is that the morbidly obese can count as needing extra time as they waddle down the jetway. Up until very recently, they were charged double if they couldn’t fit in a single seat. But apparently there has been a change in policy, possibly under a consent decree, that ended this. So, what happens when the entire flight is sold out (not that uncommon), they board first, take extra seats, and the airplane can’t hold all of the people they sold seats to? So far, it hasn’t been a big problem – they can pick up the slack by putting pilots flying standby in the cockpit (had an JetBlue pilot up there recently), and flight attendants in jump seats.
The overly-standoffish Federal policy has also added to the service animal vs. ’emotional support animal’ nonsense.
LOL it’s known around Las Vegas airport that there are “miracle flights” where seniors (especially) in an out-city request wheelchairs to preboard so they can sit up front, then deplane at LAS under their own power. First, of course.
The Vegas wheelchair-assistance workers are used to showing up for arrivals with a line of chairs in the Jetway, then taking almost as many empties back into the terminal.
Shameless, some people are.