The Highland Park July 4th shooter
There’s really little to say except RIP to the victims – and to note that the alleged perp seems obviously nihilistic and perhaps deranged. One look at his photos tells you that. I don’t usually say that sort of thing. But facial tattoos of that type are a really bad sign.
He seems to have somewhat checkered political views, including some indications he was a Trump supporter. But as with so many mass shooting perps these days, his politics seem to have been as disordered as almost everything else about him. He was obsessed with murder and death, and apparently he finally acted that out.
For those who espouse the “fatherlessness” theory of perps like this (I’ve discussed the weakness and lack of evidence for that here), it does not seem to be the case for this guy either, who is reported to have been living with his father and uncle.
Quite a bit of Antifa symbols around him I saw
Re: The shooters father: I hear that his father tried to run for mayor a few years back. I read that at one point the shooter posted the infamous Budd Dwyer video with a comment something like “I wish more politicians would make videos like this” or something to that effect. So perhaps this little monster had issues with his father?
Not sure that going to a Trump Rally dressed as Elmo means he is a supporter of Trump. In any case, yes he is clearly in need of mental help.
I’ve read that his mother was screwed up.
Alex Berenson writes that the shooter was known among his weird connections, whether in person or online, as a stoner. The late teen and early twenties are when susceptible young men may become psychotic or schizophrenic. Certainly this guy looks like he’s psychotic.
Among other things, he may be a shutdown statistic as well. He had a job at Panera Bread which he lost when the pandemic hit. Since then, he’s been quite a loner, living by himself in an apartment behind his parents’ house, slipping farther and farther into psychosis, evidently.
I was wondering if this shooting might have had political overtones, with all the ugly posts by leftists about how awful it is to celebrate the 4th, but that doesn’t seem to be part of it.
the problem is the hollow men, that media and education seem to crafting
http://invisibleserfscollar.com/great-reset-requires-instilled-great-narrative-to-create-desired-consciousness-to-imagine-mind-arson-helps-too/
a lack of any sustained belief, as gk chesterton put it, leads to the most virulent if incoherent beliefs, add economic loss thanks to the lockdowns, and you have a toxic mix indeed,
For some reason, the Slenderman stabbings are rarely mentioned. One reason, I suppose, is that nobody died.
But the point is a couple of impressionable girls, maybe twelve years old, got an idea that to be an acolyte of some on-line cartoon character they had to kill a friend. Friend, fortunately, survived and I believe one of the perps is just out of juvie mental health facilities.
Is it possible that a certain level of mental illness can go on for some time without unduly injuring anybody but the sufferer, and possibly not be a life-ruining handicap for the sufferer? Yes. We usually, by the age of maybe thirty, have run into one or more examples. But what about exposure to social media?
I’d hate to think social media could screw up a health person.
Recently saw a note from 1964. The US military, switching to NATO family of ammo, dumped 240,000 M1 carbines into the market. Small rifle, small cartridge, could get a 30-mag, semi-auto. Assault weapon before anybody thought up the idea. NRA would sell you one for $20 as a premium if you joined and I believe the market price amounted to about one hundred hours of minimum wage work. Ammo was a drug on the market. WW II vets thought a lot of the thing.
No mass shootings involving the best candidate for doing what we see today.
Have to ask what changed. Clearly, it isn’t the weapon.
Can social media mess up the messed-up and what do we do with the messed-up and personal privacy and individual liberty? And when we figure that out, how do we modify it by concerns having to do with the malign influence of social media?
Beats me.
assault weapon is a term of art, that hand gun control people came up with, but when people are weaponized, when there is nothing life affirming (look at the kid, he was a wreck) when dreck like the 1619 project is working like corrosive acid on the foundations of the country, where do you think this leads,
My fear is that we’ll now see many like him, looking to help their cause by demonstrating to us why guns should be banned.
The taxpayers will be paying for his sex change while he serves life in prison.
in the joss whedon series, firefly,there was a savage breed of cannibal pirates named reavers, the film gave their origin story, the technocratic Alliance, a Chinese British sysgy, had sought to tame the rebellious instance of the settlers on a small world miranda, the method used was a gas, that made them so docile that they stopped resisting and eventually living except for a small fraction that became feral, these were the reavers,
in the modern idiom, the crime wave we are witnessing is the superpredators we were warned about in the 90s,
Regardless of the motivation of the shooter, his background, mental state or family life, or whether or not he was known by the police, what can be done to prevent these sorts of tragedies?
Every time we hear of an incident of this sort, the discussion soon devolves into the personal conditions / circumstances of the shooter. This is really a waste of time of time.
There will ALWAYS be some guy ready and able to engage in this sort of activity.
The discussions should center on ways to prevent these sorts of shootings.
I have no idea what can be done to prevent these sorts of tragedy, but maybe other folks can.
The discussions should center on ways to prevent these sorts of shootings.
What John Derbyshire said: with events like these, you’re in the realm of chaos. There is no prevention. There is merely the clean-up afterward. He belongs in front of a firing squad. Problem: the Democratic caucus in the Illinois legislature insisted on eliminating capital sentences eleven years ago.
well I spelled out the general, remind me, did bill ayers the son of the local utility chief, turned wannabe guerilla come from highland park, he found his bomb making skills less effective then his propagandizing many wayward yoot
Agree with Art. This is like trying to pick a signal out of the band of static noise.
When we were a poorer country, it was pretty difficult for someone like this to hide from the consequences of weird behavior. A man had to work, or be a hobo. And to work one had to behave, and be social.
The worrying thing: This guy could be the harbinger of psychotics induced by Covid lockdowns.
Nothing other than family intervention could prevent this kind of thing, and family intervention often isn’t enough.
This was horrible. Many commenters are pointing out the shootings and killings that happen in Chicago, just to the south, every week. Figuring out what to do about that chaos, which is pure evil and not psychosis, would be a good idea.
Richard Aubrey, I think social media and intense news coverage of shootings have been disastrous influences on many people
Following the Buffalo shooting, I feared copycat events, and indeed we have seen some sick young men do similar things.
Kate:
There does seem to be a contagion effect that’s pernicious. On the other hand, the news has to report these events.
“There will ALWAYS be some guy ready and able to engage in this sort of activity.” JohnTyler
Not so. Attacks upon random innocents were exceedingly rare prior to the 70s.
Its the culture stupid. (no offense intended)
Gordon Scott:
There is evidence that the Uvalde shooter may have also been influenced by the COVID lockdowns. He seemed to really start a downward spiral at that point.
Art Deco:
A firing squad would be something that some of these shooters would want. They often commit suicide, of course, although this guy didn’t. But there’s often a self-destructive element as well.
Richard Aubrey:
I think social media has a pernicious effect on people without a solid foundation. This guy also was into rap, and most of his efforts in that direction were reportedly very negative indeed.
Athena might be on to something here. One of her commenters says “Thanks for bringing spirituality into the conversation. It’s a refreshing reminder that the material world is not all there is.”
https://pjmedia.com/columns/athena-thorne/2022/06/07/maybe-its-time-to-talk-about-demons-n1603521
Waidmann
Marijuana, again, like the Uvalde shooter. The role of marijuana in these mass shootings by teens and young men is known, not a secret, but for some reason it cannot be acknowledged publicly.
“When we were a poorer country, it was pretty difficult for someone like this to hide from the consequences of weird behavior. A man had to work, or be a hobo. And to work one had to behave, and be social.”
remember, prior to the great migration of jobs overseas, losers like him could get jobs just tightening screws
“Not sure that going to a Trump Rally dressed as Elmo means he is a supporter of Trump. In any case, yes he is clearly in need of mental help.”
the vast majority of people who attend Independence Day rallies or have American flags aren’t Biden supporters
Here’s a link from FOX about a former coach and the family:
https://www.foxnews.com/us/highland-park-shooting-suspects-parents-problem-says-former-coach
The twisted logic and lack of conscience, lack of empathy that would allow a person’s brain to form a plan, at times months in advance, to take the lives of innocent people knowing there will grief and anguish for those left behind and then actually accomplishing that goal of death and destruction might well be demons, perhaps self made, because none of this makes sense. The fact that these people have mental health issues is apparent and there seems to be enough acting out over the years that they should, even thought they are minors be added to the lists of those who need further looking at before they are sold a gun and along with that relatives could be informed that there is potential danger in the future. I watched some of the videos the Highland Park killer has posted and in the world I live in those are disturbing videos, that along with the way he presents himself seems to be a call for help. Having said that I don’t really know because I am almost 60 years past my teen age years and this is a different world. Please, someone who is smarter than I, come up with a workable plan to cut them off at the pass.
remember, prior to the great migration of jobs overseas, losers like him could get jobs just tightening screws
There has been no secular decline in the employment to population ratio. If anything, it’s a tad higher than it was 70 years ago. There have been two principal changes – more married women working (especially married women with young children) and fewer old men working.
A firing squad would be something that some of these shooters would want.
Well, let’s give it to them. An be sure they’re all tried within a year of their indictment and executed within 6 or 7 years of their conviction. No good reason to have lawyers playing footsie with each other for decades in order to process these cases.
Old Texan. I don’t have the stomach to watch such things. So I don’t know how much a call for help is apparent and how much is inserted by a viewer who can’t stand the idea somebody really, really means to do what he’s going to do and enjoys thinking about it.
If anything, I’d probably scant the call for help thing and presume this miserable oxygen waster has to be taken out right the freak NOW.
One thing which impresses me about these atrocities is that they’ve been planned in advance, sometimes in great detail. McVeigh would likely have gotten away–or at least been at large for a long time–had he remembered to have a license plate on his getaway car. One comment is that, given the meticulous planning, this is an odd oversight, leaving the implication that somebody wanted him busted.
When he reached for his ID, the trooper saw a pistol and arrested him for illegal carry. He was, it is said, moments from a bail hearing from which he would have been released when the feds caught up.
So, while I think the planning is part of the fun, it also means some serious problem-solving or problem-anticipating activities are involved. Which is to say that finding a single obstacle–ban AR-15–check his mental health history–waiting period….. won’t make much difference.
The Tsarnaevs could have made better pressure cooker bombs if they’d had access to something more powerful than old fireworks. Or more patience to unpack old fireworks.
Darrell Brooks…..
Eighty-seven people died in the HappyLand Social Club in 1990, mostly by panic, when somebody pitched a two-liter pop bottle and fifty cents worth of gasoline into the club.
A reasonably fit man with a hatchet in an elementary school could be opposed by a janitor if assault mops were allowed.
As I say, we’re facing guys who are planning and thinking and avoiding the predictable, and who can adjust as things go forward.
A firing squad would be something that some of these shooters would want.
I’m so old that I remember when Gary Gilmore chose to be executed by firing squad rather than hanging (Utah offered condemned prisoners a choice of method in 1977).
We are a wealthy decadent society, one that celebrates “diversity” and non-conformity. The vast majority of people think it’s wrong to shoot up a classroom, shopping mall, or concert. The non-conformist disagrees, and tragedy ensues.
As Mr Aubrey notes above, most of these atrocities are well-planned and well executed (the poorly planned ones are aborted before anyone gets hurt).
The culture has changed over the last half century. It’s no longer acceptable to overtly discriminate against minorities (good). It’s no longer acceptable for a community and the local beat cop to keep an eye on the local misfit and administer some street guidance as needed to discourage worse behavior. That is bad, very bad.
Unless and until the culture improves such that misfits are no longer loosed upon a society in which guns are freely available, we will have ongoing tragedy, at a very low level statistically but rending to the nation’s soul.
There will always be people (most Democrats) who think that disarming America will eliminate these tragedies. They may be correct, but a shooting war stands between them and their goal.
They may need to be reminded from time to time that an armed society will have tragedies, but a disarmed society will have genocide.
I know which I prefer.
I just read that the local police had two incidents with the killer in Highland Park, I will not use his name, and he had threatened mass killing with a large collection of knives in 2019 before the COVID stuff, so there’s that. Large time on the radar and no notice to not sell guns to this dangerous person because minor?
The murderous freak who you could see his zombie stare a mile way, but red flags do farking nothing
Perhaps, if these murderers were mocked, prosecuted and then executed. I suspect that the usual “mental illness” is taken as an indication of “special” and “too good for society”. Reward the creative and productive but mock the disordered so they will not encourage others. The Left has an entire mythos based on failure because of society. In fact, failure is a very personal attribute. Violence and savagery are the result of individual traits that should never be encouraged.
Neo said at 5:47, “There does seem to be a contagion effect that’s pernicious.”
Crimo was original in one respect: he “dressed in women’s clothing to disguise himself and aid his escape — then ran home to his mother, police said Tuesday.”
https://nypost.com/2022/07/05/highland-park-parade-shooting-suspect-robert-crimo-wore-womens-clothing-cops/
Maybe he thinks he’s trans, or has mommy issues. In any case, I can’t think of any other mass shooter in recent years who dressed like a woman in order to avoid capture.
From Gordon Scott (above): “When we were a poorer country, it was pretty difficult for someone like this to hide from the consequences of weird behavior. A man had to work, or be a hobo. And to work one had to behave, and be social. “
And, from Neo: “There is evidence that the Uvalde shooter may have also been influenced by the COVID lockdowns. He seemed to really start a downward spiral at that point.”
I suspect we will be a full generation learning about the level of disruption and toxicity induced by the Covid shutdowns and its peripheral restrictions.
Gordon Scott’s comment (above) about work is pertinent; there are exceptions, but one does not get to choose one’s co-workers and social engagement with a variety of people, around the common goal of working for the employer, generally provides a natural buffer against extremism. We’ve gotten away from that, too frequently far away, with personal technology and social media. E-mail and Zoom calls is not at all like working shoulder-to-shoulder for eight hours, nor is immersing oneself in the manufactured social environment on a personal device.
John Donne said “no man is an island,” but he hadn’t yet met the folks at Apple.
I have no clue what the fix for such dystopia is, nor if there is a fix.
Pa+Cat.
WRT the woman’s dress: Maybe he has issues, maybe he figured it would be a better disguise than….. Because who looks for escaping mass shooters amongst a bunch of women?
Parents who want no one to have a gun bought this nutcase one they will be prosecuted like the parents in michigan right
We are a wealthy decadent society, one that celebrates “diversity” and non-conformity. The vast majority of people think it’s wrong to shoot up a classroom, shopping mall, or concert. The non-conformist disagrees, and tragedy ensues.
The decadence is to be found in segments of the professional-managerial class and among unattached young people. The rest of us did not ask for this.
https://americanmind.org/salvo/postmodernism-criminality-and-madness/
Cavendish @ 6:11– Good point on the socialization. There is nothing like being forced to live in an open barracks, under rather Spartan conditions, with 50 other men gathered from around the nation to teach one how to adjust for a variety of associates’ ideas and attitudes. My training in such matters was in 1967.
By being all volunteer these days, a portion of that group is culled from the outset. Sometimes it takes years or even decades before a person becomes aware of that they learned back then.
Something very, very screwed up here…
“Father Of July Fourth Shooter Helped Son Buy Firearm Just Two Months After Cops Took Away His Collection Of Knives When He Threatened To ‘Kill Everyone’”—
https://blazingcatfur.ca/2022/07/06/father-of-july-fourth-shooter-helped-son-buy-firearm-just-two-months-after-cops-took-away-his-collection-of-knives-when-he-threatened-to-kill-everyone/
So would that happen to be the same father who expressed such surprise and sorrow???
(As usual…given just a bit of time, the plot thickens…)
Related:
“Highland Park gunman’s history, weapon purchase raise questions whether Democrat gun laws work;
“Suspect bought rifle banned by city and was allowed purchase despite prior run-ins with police, defying Illinois red flag law.”—
https://justthenews.com/government/local/highland-park-gunman-used-high-powered-rifle-banned-town-carry-out-mass-shooting
“…raise questions…”, eh?
The question I have about several of these young male shooters is whether they were taking antidepressants, antipsychotics, or were regular cannabis users.
They almost all are, tucker read out a long list back to 97
In a different world, somebody would have taken this fellow out behind the barn with a shovel, and returned alone.
miguel cervantes:
A lot of troubled people take SSRIs, so it becomes extremely difficult to tease out whether the SSRIs are part of the cause or are along or the ride. I’ve discussed this before and linked to studies indicating how incredibly difficult it is to get a comparable control group of effed-up people who are not on some sort of antidepressant or drug with which to compare the group who are.
Tucker can read a list of shooters who were on SSRIs but it is definitely not all of them, plus for many we have never been given the information yes or no.
Oh, and that “fatherless” list is bogus and yet you see it referenced over and over.
Large time on the radar and no notice to not sell guns to this dangerous person because minor?
This is only one case illustrating the incompetence of Illinois law enforcement.
The Aurora IL shooter was an adult felon. Still got his gun card.
There is some discussion of SSRIs in this case. The question for me is whether homicidal thoughts are affected by SSRIs. The argument has been for years that anti-depressants just activate a person who has been depressed and inactive. The enormous increase in their use might raise more questions.
Well, sorry for the lack of contact here; went under the knife for a surgery a little under two weeks ago. Fortunately it seems to be going well and I am recovering in course, at least so far.
It’s probably a bad thing that one of the first things I think of when these atrocities happen is that naggling question of “Was this all it appears to be?” (since I am well past the point of accepting that many of the Powers that Be would be willing to stage something like this), and fear for the ramifications of what will happen to we the living. Both instincts make me feel guilty and for good reason, since the victims are the more important in this case, but we have to live in the aftermath.
I can already hear the score-calling and attempts to gain an advantage using the bodies of the dead on both sides, scoring political points off of what is ultimately not that political an event next to the perp’s human depravity.
@Richard Aubrey
I heard about that, both at the time (in part because I follow pop culture and assorted internet mythos a bit too close). To add to that, what horrified me about this was that Slenderman is, quite literally, a monster. He/It might not have been as outright EVIL or Malevolent as he/it’s been portrayed in the more recent video-game driven interpretations (ironically similar to what’s happened to Sirenhead), but He/It was still an utterly ruthless, horrifying supernatural predator that views humans as just another form of prey. So even if you THOUGHT you could summon this thing by doing this (to one of your FRIENDS no less) why would you? It’s not some kind of supposedly beneficent or benevolent spirit or a kami you can hope to appease.
This is like dragging a friend into shark-infested waters with you and then cutting them open in the hopes of attracting a legendary shark. Like…Why Even?
That I think points to something incredibly depraved in the spirits of the perpetrators that isn’t touched on as much, and why this can’t be just brushed aside with “naive kids believing internet legends” or the like. Because this is not how some kind of reasonably sane or moral person would act in response to thinking Slenderman Mythos might actually have a ring of truth to them, because you’d probably react to them like you would advice (even if bad/inaccurate advice) on avoiding a dangerous predator (Which is what old school Slenderman ultimately is).
@neo
Even if that is true (and while it is true for a great many murderers it isn’t true for all of them), then I am more than happy to accept this is a rare case where their wants and mine align.. I recognize that the Death Penalty pathway is difficult, arduous, and long for VERY good reasons (we do not want to do it casually or risk the innocent suffering) even if I think it has swung a bit too far in that direction, but once the appeals have run I think it is time to punch their tickets. I view it as unjust and inhumane to foist the continued expenses of keeping them up past the point of final appeals on innocent people, including the victims and loved ones of the victims. It’s particularly ironic and bitter that we do so in a culture that is increasingly comfortable talking about euthanasia for people guilty of nothing greater than age or incurable infirmities while we are supposed to keep the likes of the Younger Tsarnaev alive indefinitely.
Besides, our prison system is overcrowded as it is.
Turtler:
Welcome back, and glad to hear your surgery went well.
Turtler. Welcome back to the land of the unbandaged.
I get what you’re saying about Slenderman and his offputting persona. But my question is sort of like yours. Why should these two decide to go along with the program?
What would they have done in a world without social media?
Maybe, if they lived on a farm two hundred years ago, they’d slake their whateveritis in the slaughter of the pigs and chickens and finally putting down the old mule. Nobody would notice, not think twice. Ya think?