The House votes to impeach Trump
The charge is “incitement to insurrection.” Which is appropriately Orwellian, since there was neither “incitement” (see this) nor an “insurrection” – except to the degree that any protest against the government that involves any violence at all could be labeled an insurrection. You can find the legal definition of “insurrection” here and further explanation here.
There have been countless anti-government demonstrations by the left that have resulted in violence, both at the federal level in DC and at the state level all around the country. No one has ever been charged with insurrection in connection with these events, as far as I know. Protestors from the left have occupied the Capitol and the Senate offices, have disrupted the Kavanaugh hearings, have accosted Republican senators in the halls, have clashed with police in DC and set fires, have mobbed Republican office holders and threatened them as they left the Republican National Convention. Leftist mobs have done even worse in states and cities around the country. Has anyone who did this, or who actively encouraged them in any violence, ever been charged with insurrection or incitement to insurrection? If they have been, I certainly haven’t read about it.
Nor should they be, in my opinion, because that sort of charge is a dangerous road to go down unless some very extreme conditions are met. But the left has no trouble going down it in order to try to get Trump, even though there was nothing special that distinguishes what happened at the Capitol in terms of the amount of violence (broken windows, clashes with police). In addition, although we know the aim was to protest and disrupt the vote to accept the electoral votes for Biden as president, that’s all we know. They didn’t seem to be armed with guns and there’s no indication that the vast majority of even those who were physically fighting with police were intending anything other than a disruptive protest, which has certainly occurred before. At any rate, not only did Trump not “incite” them to violence, he actually called for a peaceful demonstration.
I’ll add that what evidence we do have points to the fact that the people who entered the Capitol, with the intent at the very least to disrupt the proceedings in protest, began going there long before Trump’s talk was over:
“We developed some intelligence that a number of individuals were planning to travel to the D.C. area with intentions to cause violence,” Assistant Director Steven M. D’Antuono said. “We immediately shared that information, and action was taken.
…[T]here was pre-planning for some elements of last Wednesday’s chaos.
And the official timeline of events constructed by the New York Times through videos shows protesters began breaching the perimeter of the Capitol a full 20 minutes before Trump finished his speech.
We don’t even know if the violent ones were at the rally at all. Nor do we know exactly who they were, although I suspect it’s some combination of extremist left Antifa-types and extremist right Q-believers and/or other groups on the far far right. It’s certainly possible that the people on the right predominated over those on the left. But we simply don’t know yet. An investigation will take time to play out, and whether or not you believe such an investigation will be fair, what’s clear at this point is that Congress has no intention of waiting to discover the facts.
So any legal niceties are irrelevant to members of the House bent on their relentless pursuit of Trump and anyone who ever supported him. They sense that their prey is gravely wounded, and they plan to wound him further, whether he actually incited this or not. And certainly they’re not interested in the meaning of the words they use, such as “incitement.”
As for the ten Republicans who voted for impeachment today, that’s 10 out of 207. The rest voted against it. And yet I see a lot of comments at the LI post I linked earlier (and no doubt all around the conservative blogosphere) that the entire Republican Party is awful and there is no difference between the two parties.
Here are the ten Republicans who voted for impeachment: Liz Cheney, WY: Tony Gonzalez, OH; Jaime Herrera-Beutler, WA; John Katko, NY; Adam Kinzinger, IL; Peter Meijer, MI; Dan Newhouse, WA; Tom Rice, SC; Fred Upton, MI; David Valadao, CA. But 10 votes out of 207 is around 5%, when last I checked. I have said before and I continue to say that the impulse to turn on everyone in the GOP is a reaction that will only further benefit the left.
Chuck Schumer is determined, once the new Senate session begins, to try Trump:
Leader Schumer: “Donald Trump has deservedly become the first president in American history to bear the stain of impeachment twice over. The Senate is required to act and will proceed with his trial and hold a vote on his conviction.”
Note that remark about being impeached twice. I mentioned in this post yesterday that being able to claim Trump was the only president to have been impeached twice was one of the left’s goals, and there it is straight from Schumer.
Note, also, that not a single Democrat House member defected. Not one. And I predict that no Democrat in the Senate will, either, whatever evidence is presented to exonerate Trump, and that some Republicans will join them. As William Jacobson points out:
…[T]he likelihood SCOTUS would issue an injunction halting a Senate trial is significantly less than SCOTUS making a ruling once Trump has been convicted (if that happens) and suffers some concrete harm. So the Senate could have its trial, but whether the result stands would be the issue.
In the past, there were several checks on this sort of thing. One was that the American public hadn’t yet experienced the Gramscian takeover of education and the press (as well as other institutions) by the left, and so public sentiment would have risen up against it on both sides as being a vindictive and dangerous overreach. Another was that in the past even the left feared that such tactics would be used against the left when the right came to power. But now the left thinks it can arrange things so that the right never comes to power again.
That is what all of this is about. That is why I’ve had a terrible feeling in my gut and some trouble sleeping for at least several months now, probably even since the COVID stuff started back in March because it was becoming apparent that it all would add to the left’s power. It’s been clear for years now that this was their goal, and it was one of the main reasons I was happy that Clinton was defeated in 2016. It was always clear that the Trump presidency was a temporary gamble, and that the gamble might ultimately be lost.
I can’t see the future. I don’t know for certain what will happen. Surprises, black swans, turns of events, even a backlash from the American public that will end up mattering – all are possible. But I feel an increased dread about what’s happening now, all the more awful because it was easily foreseeable (and foreseen) but not easily preventable – and perhaps not preventable at all, unless we were to go back about a hundred years with perfect foresight. Maybe not even then.
I wonder what would have happened in Washington D.C. and in lots more cities if Trump had won.
James Zyla:
Much worse would have happened in terms of violence and riots.
And no one would have been charged with insurrection.
Democrats were talking about impeaching Trump before he was even sworn in, which tells you a lot about the seriousness of this stuff.
Great post Neo. I will link to it as I frequently do. I wish my Progressive family would read it. Alas. (Ironic; all of my friends are conservative, and none of the immediate family. I failed.)
Sent out an email today in which I likened the current situation to the Cultural Revolution. I, of course, included a short history lesson because I doubt that the people I target were ever taught that bit of history.
I included a comment about the impeachment that my wife, at least, enjoyed.
“Now we have the obviously mean spirited, unprecedented, effort to impeach a President in the last week of his term. It has become painfully clear that we are about to be governed by spiteful children who demand absolute control over the sandbox.”
I am past anger.
Thou shalt not bear false witness. One of the commandments broken every day, continually and with gusto in every arena, but especially today by many holding high office in our formerly respectable Republic.
Ahab/Pelosi throws the harpoon once again. She is obsessed, and a ruthless dictator in the House.
So there’s a list of the Republicans who need to be primaried in 2022.
I am donating monthly to my local and state GOP organizations. They need to start planning now to remove Pelosi from the Speakership.
Dilbert creator Scott Adams had an interesting take:
One way to look at today’s events is that the House impeached Trump. The other way is that they just handed him the thing he wanted most: a national platform to put election integrity on trial. Senate will be like the Scopes Trial.
Speaking of Black Swans:
https://bigleaguepolitics.com/based-government-of-uganda-bans-twitter-from-country-after-censorship-election-interference/
Poor Sub-Saharan Sods have their own special problems, but it’s nice to see them giving the Black Power Fist of Foucault to GloboHomo Inc.
IQ: it’s nice to have, but it ain’t everything.
Kate @ 8:14 – Kate DO NOT contribute to the GOP. Contribute to candidates or organizations that have explicit goals you agree with. Too often your money goes to RINO’s. Ignore the pleas and demands. Tell them you will contribute to people who will do what you agree with.
Dick Illyes:
I doubt it. The Democrats will decide what evidence is admissible.
@Dick Ilyes:
If by this stage anybody has faith in Trump’s ability to cogently and coherently mount a defense, let alone an attack from the dock… They must be smoking something that Scott Adams probably will have out under his own branding soon for just a small premium over Brand X.
To do such a thing requires a *Team* of very good lawyers plus horde of ancillaries. Nobody with an iota of self-preservatory wit about them within a 1,000 mile radius of the Brass Ring is going to step up to do this now. Trump’s ‘management’ style of ‘You underlings fight each other until I amuse myself by arbitrarily taking sides and grandstanding’ won’t inspire this. Trump is over.
He was fun while he lasted. You throw a bucket of fluorescent liquid shit into a room full of cobwebs –> now you can see the cobwebs. Seeing all the cobwebs you can then decide whether or not to clean house. Doesn’t mean that you order up a tureen of green-glowing shit with a side of garlic toast when dinnertime comes around.
There are no more viable use cases for the Donald except Martyr. If the Democrats are smart, they’ll slap him on the wrist and send him off to self-destruct in slow motion. They could help that along by calling in loans, planning board games, etc. The smart move would be to Do Him Slowly. Still, they’re probably not smart enough to do that.
Dick Illyes:
I doubt it. John Roberts and the Democrats will decide what evidence is admissible. I don’t expect that will include evidence of election fraud.
Slightly off topic but Meaning in History has a great post of how Congress can go into crazy mode regarding Trump. He is not from their world and must be expelled like a virus in a political host. National Politics and Media being isolated within the society of social media acerbates this tendency.
Give yourself a few minutes to read each of the posts. They are worth thinking through.
https://meaninginhistory.blogspot.com/2021/01/life-in-cult.html#more
Embedded within the post is another post about how modern politics mimics Gnosticism. A really good read. Talks about QANON as a different side of wokeism.
https://edwardfeser.blogspot.com/2021/01/the-gnostic-heresys-political-successors.html
I’ve seen Trump speaking and proudly pointing out that he’s not one of them. And by ‘them’, he means the politicians in Washington.
I think Trump probably feels just fine with another impeachment. It’s proof to him that DC is beyond help.
It doesn’t have to be submitted in the Senate, the attention will provide a forum not otherwise available. Keeping it out of the trial will itself publicize it.
My favorite Biblical quotation: Psalm 146:9 ?
King James Version
The LORD preserveth the strangers; he relieveth the fatherless and widow: but the way of the wicked he turneth upside down.
Overwhelming and dangerous times. People are “disappearing” on FB and Twitter. My right/center right/nay saying friends are giving each other our numbers and emails in case one of us is axed from social media. It’s really disturbing and I’ve never quite seen anything like this in my lifetime. It is bound to get worse when Biden actually assumes office. Glad to have all of you to turn to and you Neo — and hope nothing is disrupted here. The right will build more of its own servers and sites but it all takes time.
The new Congress (117th) began on the 3rd January, although the new leadership doesn’t assume their posts until after the Inauguration, apparently.
Trump enjoys the distinction of having been impeached twice and the distinction of being impeached both times for faithfully and lawfully conducting the affairs of office in ways that are patently not illegal, namely a telephone call and a political rally. We should call this Faux Impeachment, Part Deux.
There are other Republican Congressmen who did not vote to impeach, that are still snakes. Dan Crenshaw comes to mind, stalwartly declaring Ms Cheney to be a brave intellect amongst mere mortals. Sit down, Dan. You’ve started believing the Captain America shtick from your own commercials.
Hi Liberty Wolf:
Yes, these are very very disturbing times. I’m not active on social media, so that doesn’t affect me directly although of course I think what’s happening there is awful. But as far as the blog goes, so far the entities involved seem to be of a more libertarian bent than a leftist bent. That doesn’t mean that bad things won’t happen in the future, if more pressure from the left is brought to bear.
James Zyla,
Trump did win and in a landslide. Only the ignorant, foolish and willfully blind imagine otherwise. Knaves know he won and justify it by the end gained. They are the most foolish of all.
neo has the right of it when she states that “Much worse would have happened in terms of violence and riots.”
I’m confident that had that happened, Trump would have legally and justiably invoked the Insurrection Act (exactly as intended). Followed by a declaration of Martial Law in the face of even greater violence. In doing so he would have taken a significant step toward saving the union.
Where has trying to reason with your “nice” middle aged grandmother friends, gotten you? You have obviously seen this up-close and personal for years.
Where have the efforts of several accomplished and successful and obviously supportive fathers on this board gotten them, when they tried to reason with their smug and dismissive leftist kids?
When basic administration performance facts become irrelevant because of the prioritizing of an emotional craving for “acceptance”, “affirmation” and emotional inclusion of a large percentage of the voting populace over such practical and traditional markers for evaluating success as the economy and defense (see the intro to Huxley’s friends’ papers below**), then one has reason to expect that we are in uncharted territory much as Jordan Peterson said in 2017: “we don’t know what a truly female political philosophy would be like …” … https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6bX52d5f0MU
Or the original full length Peterson video (which I have advanced to the question point. https://youtu.be/R_GPAl_q2QQ?t=9189
**
It would be Antifa attacking you in February, instead of the Biden administration and its allied bureaucracies.
“Jordan Peterson said in 2017: “we don’t know what a truly female political philosophy would be like …”
I forgot to add, ” … but we have been finding out”
“Thou shalt not bear false witness.” Sharon W
It’s only been in the last decade that I have begun to fully appreciate the gravity of that sin.
” Our Constitution was made only for a moral and religious people. It is wholly inadequate to the government of any other.”
John Adams
Over the past few years, I’ve often reflected upon Adams assertion. I’ve come to the opinion that Adams was not speaking from a traditional religious point of view.
A personal morality that abjurs a religious basis is grounded in personal opinion. Others may share it, a consensus of opinion by the majority may exist. Yet however many agree, such moral precepts are simply a consensus of opinion.
The UN’s “Declaration of Human Rights” is exactly such a consensus of personal opinion.
Religion, of whatever persuasion, posits that its precepts arise from a source that transcends mankind’s fallible understanding of morally correct behavior. Fallible, whether the personal opinion of the individual or even a consensus of individual opinions.
Because a group, necessarily made up of individuals is still a group of fallible opinions. Even the Founding Fathers, as brilliant and wise a group of individuals as were ever assembled together… were only too fallible, as our present circumstances demonstrate.
Unalienable rights, the very basis for consent of the governed… can only exist if such rights are not subject to personal opinion. Nor to any consensus of opinion, as what one generation can grant, a later generation’s consensus can rescind.
Only when agreement is present that rights are granted by a source that transcends mankind’s fallible opinions can rights be asserted to be unalienable. Otherwise, we have revocable privileges.
This is why the Ten Commandments are of inestimable importance, they ground a society’s moral consensus in an unshakable foundation.
Societal consensus, the glue that binds individuals and groups together, cannot persist without a firm moral foundation. Only religion offers a refuge from the “Tower of Babble” of which mankind’s individual opinions consist.
DNW,
“we are in uncharted territory much as Jordan Peterson said in 2017: “we don’t know what a truly female political philosophy would be like”
Not precisely no but we all have a pretty good idea, given the feminization of American culture since the 60s. Much good can be said of it and even more ill of it. No nation can survive the feminization and demasculinization of its men. Persecution of “Toxic Masculinity” is the death knell of such a society because the Barbarians are always At the Gates. When no threat is upon the horizon, they lack the strength to attack and have to bide their time.
This is of a certainty, given that every generation includes a percentage who are criminally inclined (the barbarians) with a spectrum from the petty criminal to the tyrant. That spectrum of criminality reject civilized norms of behavior and will group together, innately understanding that there’s strength in numbers.
Currently, it’s China’s communists and Islam’s jihadists.
From gang warfare to tribal warfare to violently aggressive national warfare, they exist in all times and places because when a moral compass is absent and egotistical selfishness is the sole consideration, its much easier to take, than to build.
It’s a psychopathy/sociopathy that is incapable of seeing others as real too, as having an equally inviolable right to exist.
I am scared to death. With the left fully in control of the government, media, education, they will have no fear of starting the purge. Actually, it started 4 years ago, when the left never gets prosecuted, but the right is persecuted by lawfare. With the wholesale censorship, deplatforming and cancelling, it is proceeding rapidly.
I don’t know what I can do to fight the left, but I do know that I can work to end the GOP, make sure none of those traitors ever hold elected office again, and found a new party to elect people who will actually “represent” the will of their constituents.
Heaven help us.
Zaphod 8:30, well I don’t live in the corridors of power of DC so I don’t know and can’t know.
But I strongly believe your description is wrong from top to bottom.
I, for one, would proudly support President Trump again. It stands to reason: how bad and how incompetent can the guy be? He won the presidency … as an outsider … with massed opposition of the elites. And ran the country pretty dam’ well too despite massed opposition.
@Aggie
The “new leadership” of Congress is the same as the old leadership for the time being. The Democrats take control of the Senate on January 20th when Harris is sworn in as VP. Until then the Senate majority is 50 so-called Republicans plus VP Pence.
Zaphod is blowing smoke from Hong Kong again. It certainly appears to me that President Trump got a lot more done than can be seen from a former British colony but it doesn’t take long for a turn coat to trim his sails and attack when opportunity arises. I have a Rhino congressman to deal with, a turncoat without a spine or loyalty to his constituents, aka Dan Newhouse.
Good luck out there across the wide Pacific, Creepy Joe and the Ho won’t say or do squat to restrain you new master Xi.
Trump addressed the country this afternoon calling for peace and unity: https://www.facebook.com/WhiteHouse/posts/3800317043389334
I guarantee that the Democrats will claim he called for the exact opposite.
Oldflyer is right: “It has become painfully clear that we are about to be governed by spiteful children who demand absolute control over the sandbox.”
@JimNorCal:
A country which could get from squat to the moon in a decade cannot build an effing glorified fence along its border in 4 years?
USN ship colliding with another ship because the WOMEN were in charge that night who shouldn’t be on board any goddamn navy ship in the first place weren’t on speaking terms with each other.
Military paying for sex change operations for active duty personnel.
Low-hanging fruit right there. And what does any competent leader just appointed and having to deal with a recalcitrant bureaucracy do? Always: Go for the Low-hanging Fruit first. Get some runs on the board… and then don’t sit back taking selfies with the board, promote the hell out of anyone who helped you gather in said fruit and use that runs board to beat out the brains of the #@$%ers who even remotely look like obstructing you. Rinse and repeat.
But: bloviate, photo-op, bloviate, stop the motorcade to shake hands with some firepersons (heh), Monkey around with Fatboy Kim for more photo ops… I don’t think he put in too many all-nighters. And what would a spirited defense of impeachment charges morphing into the fabled Q-Anon Swamp Fever Sicilian Vespers require but a crapload of all-nighters?
I’m really happy Trump had 4 years. He brought a lot of bubbling away in the basement issues into much sharper relief and that’s good. But it seems delusional to me to hope that he’s capable of going on the offense and making needful stuff happen.
We’ve all had our hopes dashed. It’s certainly not remotely all Trump’s fault. But he’s not going to save anyone – except himself and his family if he can cut a deal.
YMMV.
Zaphod,
“Trump’s ‘management’ style of ‘You underlings fight each other until I amuse myself by arbitrarily taking sides and grandstanding’ won’t inspire this. Trump is over.”
If Trump’s management style consisted entirely or even mostly as you characterize it, he could never have accomplished so much. I don’t have it readily available but I’ve seen an extensive list of a great many achievements. Not least of which is keeping a rabid left at bay for what for him had to be 4 very long years.
Give credit where credit is due. Like most great men, he’s deeply flawed. That he accomplished so much against far more opposition than any 10 Presidents you’d care to name speaks volumes about his actual management style.
As for Trump “being over”… they’ve been saying that about him for most of the last four years. He’s proven himself a fighter, he knows he didn’t lose this election, that it was stolen in the greatest demonstration of fraud in history. He also knows that he’s been betrayed by GOP politicians who in doing so betrayed their oath of office to defend the Constitution.
It’s premature to count him out. But if he does retire from the field, only disabled veterans can say they did as much and sacrificed as much for their country.
And yet there is no completed wall. Greatest nation on earth : Wall.
I seem to vaguely remember some kind of campaign promise about some kind of wall.
China has built out 38,000km of high speed rail since 2007. Length of US-Mexican Border: 3,145km.
Yes,… evil totalitarian government which rules by fiat vs. Trump vs. Multitude of his Enemies. Yes, yes yes.
And yet… it’s just a glorified fence. And it’s not done.
Western Liberalism is now so degenerate and messed up that we (even those who are supposedly of the Right) have forgotten that it *is* possible do do a moonshot in under 10 years or build a blinged out fence in 1-2 years max.
Folks weren’t asking for nuclear fusion or the philosopher’s stone. Just a pretty low-tech bit of masonry and ironmongery with like 1% of the surveillance capability the State now points at its own inmates, err Citizens.
I’m not trying to be super nasty or black pilled. I’d hoped the man would win again… no matter his flaws he was better than all the alternatives and his winning would have bought more time. But he didn’t.
There is some little buzzing gnat likes to make comments about my providing commentary from the other side of the world. Has anyone stopped to think just how much geopolitical pants shitting is happening out here in Asia at the prospect of a Biden/Harris administration? Off the charts.
Zaphod,
The entire country was behind the space effort. Most of Congress was against funding the wall, what was built was in spite of Congress’ opposition.
Excluding women from the Navy command track is a political non-starter and would have handed RINOs in Congress an excuse to join the dems in convicting Trump in the Senate on impeachment charges. Get real.
As for a recalcitrant bureaucracy (nice understatement) you kill a snake by cutting off its head not its tail. To fire department heads for passive aggresively ‘working to the rule’ would again have led to impeachment and conviction.
Since the near total inaction in the GOP Congress and now 37 Republican Senators supporting the greatest electoral fraud in history… can there be any doubt that had Trump given them “plausible deniability”… they’d have stabbed him in the back at the first opportunity?
You’re scapegoating Trump to relieve your dashed hopes.
Zaphod,
Responsibility for an incomplete wall is on the dems and RINOs shoulders not Trump’s. Your faulting the man for trying and failing through no fault of his own. Stop monday morning quarterbacking him.
“”The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena, whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood, who knows the great enthusiasms, the great devotions, and spends himself in a worthy cause; who at best, if he wins, knows the thrills of high achievement, and, if he fails, at least fails daring greatly, so that his place shall never be with those cold and timid souls who know neither victory or defeat.” President Theodore Roosevelt
“Western Liberalism is now so degenerate and messed up…
Stop right there, for there is the heart of it.
The moon effort had the memory of a dead president, plus the fact that every congressional district had some factory or research company participating. LBJ was no fool. He knew how to get votes.
The progress on the wall happened despite the efforts of Democrats and some Republicans in Congress, along with the active obstruction of liberal judges. Construction on it has not stopped. I watched them work on it December 30.
We shall soon have the situation of BidenHarris initiatives in front of Trump-appointed judges. Will the judges have the courage to rule against the regime? Obviously Roberts would not.
https://www.unz.com/ghood/china-trolls-the-wests-delusions-and-hypocrisies/
Hilarious. They understand our so-called elites and their blind spots far better than we understand theirs.
Luckily they’ve never heard of the OODA Loop or we’d really be #$@#ed. Guess we can all relax then. Kardashians, anyone?
Shokun, patriots, GB, Zaph, and others that know what is going on, you may find this useful.
https://billwhittle.com/law-abiding-moving-back-to-america-with-bill-whittle/
Elaine Samson on January 13, 2021 at 10:36 pm said:
I am scared to death.
Fear not. There are many who knew of these events in warnings, prophecies, and other methods. We were not sitting idle, trolling online like others. We setup ambushes and traps for this very contingency.
See: https://thenationalpulse.com/analysis/the-insurrection-lie/
It will be interesting to see if Peter Meijer’s vote hurts the family business in Michigan.
The GOP is poorly run and led, has been for a long time, but why hasn’t leadership insisted every Senator and Rep read, “Rules for Radicals” and pass a comprehension test before taking office?
Barry Sotero-Obama literally taught the text in Chicago. It’s the Left’s playbook. Know it and know those are their tactics. And don’t help them use them against you.
Morons.
I Am Spartacus, the GOP in North Carolina did a pretty decent job in this election cycle. Democrats tried the mail-in ballot scam; the GOP sued and got it stopped. We elected NC’s first-ever black Lieutenant Governor, a gun rights advocate. They organized a large fund-raising effort to elect conservative judges and elected five to Supreme Court and Appeals Court open slots. Activists here in my heavily D county managed to get a D district judge candidate disqualified (he lied about his residency). The D-controlled state board of elections decided to let Cooper (D governor) appoint a judge, rather than having the top qualified vote-getter, a Republican, assume office. She’s suing, with support from the party. You’re right about the RNC and the congressional election committees — I’ll wait to see who they’re pushing.
Very interesting link on the gnostic nature of all the leftisms and of QAnon. That one jumps to the eye — secret knowledge.
I Am Spartacus, having read entirely that essay on modern Gnosticisms, let me repeat the link. Very insightful.
https://edwardfeser.blogspot.com/2021/01/the-gnostic-heresys-political-successors.html
Zaphod complains that Trump didn’t make the trains run on time.
Very interesting link on the gnostic nature of all the leftisms and of QAnon.
Read what Q anon really is.
https://ymarsakar.wordpress.com/2021/01/11/apparently-people-desire-a-q-anon-briefing/ Read what Q really is.
Zaphod and TJ, I hope you see what is going on here.
Assuming that the Senate does not take up the impeachment trial until after Trump has left office, who presides over the Senate trial? The constitution says
“When the President of the United States is tried, the Chief Justice shall preside.”
But Trump won’t be the President at that time, although he was President when he was impeached.
The same question would arise if an impeached President happened to resign before his Senate trial.
Prof. Jacobson’s comments not withstanding IMHO SCOTUS will punt on even taking Trump’s challenge to an unconstitutional Senate conviction, citing separation of powers. That’s even before the Left packs SCOTUS enough to destroy the (notional) Conservative majority.
Justice for Ashli Babbitt!
Zaphod, 1:08, no problem. You’re welcome to hold your wrong opinion.
View you can use: Sarah Hoyt teaches us “ HOW TO READ THE NEWS IN TOTALITARIANISM” Posted on January 14, 2021. That is, how to very sceptically read the news and indirectly arrive at a useful surmise.
She uses recent event including Cap Hill and the All Too Perfect Choir to illustrate:
It helps to know that Sarah grew up in Portugal, first under national and then international socialist regimes. (Although Marxism was required at University, because she also knew that to become a science fiction writer, it was best to be in America – so she did. And lives in the Denver area,)
https://accordingtohoyt.com/2021/01/14/how-to-read-the-news-in-totalitarianism/
Rufus – Will his vote hurt the family business? No, Meijer is a well run company with good product. People wouldn’t link the two. But I hope he gets challenged next primary along with Upton. That is Dutch Reform country so they have different views of personal conduct.
I have read and own a copy of “Rules for Radicals”. I totally concur people should read it and understand what methods are being deployed against them and to be able to speak out against it.
As far as using those rules against them it takes a mindset of making the other side an “unperson” if you will. Since we have a Christian outlook we have a view that people can be redeemed. Pagans and Totalitarians don’t have that problem. However you can effectively employ Rule #4 (make them live by their rules, more later) and Rule #5 (ridicule) within our outlook. We call it Christian correction which is encouraged.
So make them live by their own rules. Gohmert did a wonderful thing when he quoted Nancy Pelosi’s words verbatim about riots and hoisted them on their own petard. Pelosi passed rules dis-allowing sex pronouns and yet she used them multiple times in her impeachment statement. File an ethics complaint with the house ethics board and force them to respond. Do it every time they slip up. Make their virtue signaling carry a cost. When it hurts enough they will stop.
A congresswoman claimed no Antifa involvement. We know that John Sullivan a BLM/Antifa supporter was standing next to Ashli Babbit when she was killed. Independent journalists have reported on the tactics used to breach the capital which Antifa uses. Confront her with those facts and have her explain herself on why she lied to her constituents. Make it cost her. Right now they get a free ride due to a supine compliant media. Regarding the breach, it is really telling about the hard core QANON crowd that Alex Jones had to be the voice of reason.
https://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2021/01/louie-gohmert-dunks-pelosi-quotes-support-black-lives-matter-riots-house-floor-liberals-freak/
Finally read the caption at the top of the blog. Chilling.
https://bolenreport.com/saul-alinskys-12-rules-radicals/
Kate @ 8:29 am – North Carolina was the exception to the rule. NC did the right thing by taking action BEFORE the election. The other states didn’t. But what was frustrating and infuriating was the pusillanimous action of the state legislatures in Georgia, Michigan, Pennsylvania and Wisconsin after the election. They could have and should have gotten to the bottom of the allegations before certifying the votes. They have the constitutional right to do so and they punted from fear.
There was a reason why the riots continued in the summer.
In Michigan, the legislature will say they had hearings and the House hearing was very powerful with the testimony of Dr Tavers that was posted and discussed on this blog but they did NOTHING afterwards. Then the House had a hearing on Dominion with its president and they didn’t even have a tech expert on the line to drill down on the flaws of Dominion. That would have been a great time to have Russell Ramsland who audited the Atrium county machines to go through his findings with the president. One of them would have been discredited. Or have a house member fully briefed and able to talk about it. It was as pathetic as the US Senate hearing with Facebook, Google and Twitter CEO’s. All we got was a Ted Cruz sound bite from that.
You know when hearings are designed to be ineffectual when they have multiple questioners and fragmented time. It is a “check in the box” exercise designed to make sure no one is held accountable. That is what happened in Michigan.
Kate, remember that NC delayed reporting election results until after Georgia was known. They froze reporting in my opinion so if Georgia would eventually go to Trump they would try and flip NC. The issue in NC was that there was not a single metropolitan area big enough to do the ballot harvesting fraud so they would have had to use multiple counties which becomes problematic. If there is another explanation for that delay in reporting I would like to hear it.
Do any one here notice this narrative shift from Antifa to the Left’s bogeymen, Q, and Neo here using the New York Times here as fake news sourcing?
It’s like people think they are wised up to fake news, while they are still swallowing the toxin.
Narrative A: President T Red stoked up some hate riots.
Narrative B: Right wingers stoked up some hate riots.
Narrative C: Antifa stoked up some right wingers who stoked up some Trump rioters.
Are people tired of fake news yet or…?
Ymarsakar – read this account. The person’s description of events fits with what I observed until the time of the break in. It jives with several other people accounts. The Capital breech was a false flag operation designed to short circuit the attempt at a commission to review the questionable states voting irregularities by using crowd psychology (The Riot Makers) on the hard core QANON supporters. It succeeded brilliantly.
https://thefederalist.com/2021/01/14/i-saw-provocateurs-at-the-capitol-riot-on-jan-6/
Narrative C is factual. Live with it.
Democrats are doing this because: (i) Trump’s behavior really was appalling (ii) impeachment satisfies their base; and, most importantly for them, (iii) it weakens Republicans by making us fight with each other.
Trump did bring new voters into the Republican coalition. He also drove quite a few voters out of the Republican coalition, and many more are hanging by a thread. Unless Trump supporters want to rule over a rump party lucky to pull 35% of the national vote, you can’t use defending Trump as a litmus test anymore.
Yes, he has many, many legitimate grievances, including about the election. Yes Democrats are awful, and flaming hypocrites to boot. But, Trump makes it so easy for them! (And so difficult to defend.)
You should think twice about driving people out of the party for finally reaching their breaking point with Trump. This battle is lost and its time to move on. Recall Reagan – My eighty percent friend is not my twenty percent enemy. Or, if that doesn’t work, recall Franklin – Either we all hang together or we’ll all hang separately.
Bauxite:
If you’ve read this blog at all up till now, you would realize that I’m always talking about not turning the GOP against itself. Nor am I saying to turn on every GOP member of Congress who criticizes Trump.
There’s a difference between that and impeaching him, though. There is zero grounds for impeachment. It is clear that there was no incitement. It is a manufactured charge and a dangerous one. No Republican should be voting for it (no Democrat should, either, but of course they all will).
neo:
Not intending to be contrary, just confused. Andrew McCarthy is very clear in National Review that Trump did incite and is impeachable:
_____________________________________________
As it happens, I do think the president has committed an impeachable offense, making a reckless speech that incited a throng on the mall, which foreseeably included an insurrectionist mob. These rioters ended up overwhelming security forces and storming the Capitol. They shut down a solemn constitutional proceeding, endangering the lives of the vice president and the people’s representatives. They ripped through the facility, causing not only significant property damage but grave injuries.
https://www.nationalreview.com/2021/01/impeachment-by-the-numbers/
_____________________________________________
Personally I agree with you.
Yet McCarthy is a redoubtable figure in these matters. I can see perhaps throwing a flag down on Trump’s play, to use a sports metaphor, but moving to throw him out of the game entirely or the league, especially in the context of 2020, just doesn’t seem right.
Yammer, who peddles toxin (QAnon) complains that people recognize his wares while he looks for the unwary.
QAnon kills.
Ashli Babbit RIP
huxley:
Well Andy’s star has fallen quite a bit; “reckless,” “incitement,” “insurrectionist mob.” Words have meanings. What did Trump actually say and it is reported that the “insurrectionist mob” started it’s break in into the Capitol before Trump finished saying his magic evil words. Must have been a dog whistle, or something in the air, a “penumbra or emanation” of anarchic madness.
Funny that all the firepower of the “mob” seems to be imaginary but the actual dead body was an unarmed Ashli Babbit RIP. The Capitol Police overmatched the firepower of that awesome terrifying mob. Fortunately the Capitol Police in SWAT attire and armed with M4s didn’t “sh*t the bed” and kill everyone in the corridor sanding beside Ashli Babbit.
Andy McCarthy jumps the shark.
huxley:
The word “incite” has a specific legal meaning, and it must include specific encouragement of violence.
McCarthy has never liked Trump, and he is reacting emotionally here IMHO. McCarthy is often good at explaining law. Not always, though. I’ve disagree with him before, and I disagree with him now and I believe that I am correct.
I haven’t yet read his piece, although I intend to do so. But from the excerpt you published, he concentrates on his perception of the rioters. But what they did has nothing to do with the issue of whether they were incited by Trump. “Incitement” doesn’t mean that something a person said preceded a violent act by another person (although in this case it’s not even clear that that happened, since we don’t know whether the rioters were even at the rally).
I Am Spartacus, I live in one of the largest counties in NC (Wake, that is, Raleigh). We use paper ballots and optical scanners pretty much in NC. I am going to investigate whether any don’t. That really limits fraud quite a bit. We had an election for the NC Supreme Court Justice which the Republican won by 401 votes out of 5+ million. It was recounted statewide using the scanners and didn’t change much. The Dem then requested, in accordance with state law, a hand recount of a sample of 3% of precincts, those precincts chosen randomly. The count didn’t change and she lost.
Anyone living in a state with Republicans in control of the legislature needs to put pressure on, right now, to eliminate electronic voting systems, Dominion or any other, and to institute voter ID.
neo:
Thanks!
Seems like there’s a whole lotta incitin’ goin’ on…
Kate – thanks for the clarification on NC. I agree about cleaning up the election mess so it doesn’t repeat in 2022 and 2024. That is why I am active with like minded people to work towards this end. What I witnessed and endured this election makes me determined. I concur with your solutions.
Huxley – you have a way of injecting some classic rock refrains into the topic. Mazel Tov.
Bauxite @1:15 – Well educated people who expect urban smooth talking cool talkers absolutely loath Trump. They prefer a teleprompter reader to someone who actually gets stuff done. He offends their world view of who can get anything done. A reason is that they have tended to be insulated from the impact of the hollowing out of America. Many of them have advanced degrees, know citizens of other countries and have traveled abroad. Their world is comfortable…..for the moment.
As Instapundit said, Trump’s opponents takes his words literally while his fans take his words suggestively.
There is a struggle between the Nationalist Populists and Global Corporatist within the Republican party while there is a struggle with the totalitarian Tech Overloads vs. the Communists in the Democratic Party. Like Jackson in the 1820’s the Nationalist Populists will win. There are too many of us. Also after 2 years of Biden rule many people will come back. The only reason that the Blue states did well is that the Trump economy buoyed them. Politics are dynamic. The Democrat Party is the one in trouble much more than the Republican party.
Here is another article about the changing party. Note the mention of many Trump supporters this cycle. For a man who was repudiated by the nation he sure had a lot of acolytes get elected like Lauren Boebert and Madison Cawthorn who will join the likes of Jim Jordan, Devin Nunes and Matt Gaetz. And that just the national scene. Many many many state legislators are also in place.
https://redstate.com/jenniferoo/2021/01/14/establishment-republicans-want-to-wash-trump-out-of-their-hair-but-the-dye-is-permanent-now-n309952
I wouldn’t call Q people far right. From what I understand Q started with theories of pedophile rings, but mostly was based on the idea that there was a deep investigation into corrupt government officials. It required you to believe there were honest people working behind the scenes.
It’s very sad that politics went so downe in the US, usually, in some there world we see politician fighting each other and when they get the seats they start revenge from most personal from another side.
Today in US politics we can see clearly this happens driven by personal hatred and jealous by House Speaker Nancy Pelosi (look to her face).
I hope some wise men in the US will hold this woman she by far driven by hatred, not bu the will of the US public.
on the other side, we hear some wild voice attacking Pres. Trump, Rep. Ilhan Omar
Did she look to her follow Biden and Hunter Courrptions that all over the world?
What’s happing is she blind and deaf ignoring all that said about Hunter and his relation to Biden?
Did she forgot she shaked hand with “For years, we have been asked to turn a blind eye to the criminality, corruption and blatant disregard to the rule of law by the tyrant president” ?
For years, we have been asked to turn a blind eye to the criminality, corruption and blatant disregard to the rule of law by the tyrant president ’ with Turkey’s tyrant In 2017, Omar (then a Minnesota state representative) met with Turkish President Recep Tayyip
more, US congresswoman Omar criticized for refusing to back Armenian Genocide bill
This bizarre and laughable statement by a member who supports tyrant and corrupted regimes
Zaphod, would you like T Red and the US Q military to launc hte Pinochet option?
This is a serious question, as I understand the ramifications either way.
How far do Americans have to go, before they approve Pinochet?
I told GB before that the Left would create a “mass casualty” event numbering in the hundreds of thousands, even millions, to get rid of your guns.
This was way before 2019 and 2020. Ymar strikes again.
Dons on January 14, 2021 at 9:13 pm said:
I wouldn’t call Q people far right. From what I understand Q started with theories of pedophile rings, but mostly was based on the idea that there was a deep investigation into corrupt government officials. It required you to believe there were honest people working behind the scenes.
Where did people get this information from though?
Fake news. Not entirely inaccurate, but mostly inaccurate.
I am Spartacus, your facts aren’t logical, which means your mentality is in error due to emotional analysis methods.
Fake Trump protesters. A few young men wearing Trump or MAGA hats backwards and who did not fit in with the rest of the crowd in terms of their actions and demeanor, whom I presumed to be Antifa or other leftist agitators; and
Read that line again. “Fake T red protesters”
Now convert that into “Fake Q Anons”.
That’s a fact you have to live with, but you aren’t aware of it, so you think you can just believe in the fake news. People are still mind controlled by the fake news, as usual.
Also read the word “presumed”.
https://ymarsakar.wordpress.com/2021/01/11/apparently-people-desire-a-q-anon-briefing/ This is what Q is and has been. A bunch of posts on 8 kun, analyzed by anons and others in the conspiracy world.
Who told you there was Q Anon? The fake news. Who told you what Q Anon was? The fake news.
Have you interviewed a single real Q or Anon yet? Or did you just “presume” to know because of your mental programming as a slave, Spartacus. Are you Spartacus or a slave?
Disciplined, uniformed column of attackers. A column of organized, disciplined men, wearing similar but not identical camouflage uniforms and black gear, some with helmets and GoPro cameras or wearing subdued Punisher skull patches.
So disciplined they were working with Antifa… why.
Do conservative brains still work or has 2020 and 2021 broken you?
Narrative C is factual. Live with it.
The New York Times is factual, live with it?
Maybe you should read up on the new firing squad punishments for treason, son.
Responding to neo –
I think you need to give a bit more slack to the GOP reps who voted for impeachment. There are still a lot of people in the right coalition who value the continuity of our basic institutions. If we lose our institutions, then we have a free for all. The chances are very slim that today’s population would support (or that today’s elite would allow) anything like the freedoms of the Bill of Rights, especially the 1st and 2nd Amendment. (Recall RBG suggesting that countries not model their constitutions on ours.)
Trump’s major sin since the election has been his attacks on institutions. The simple reality is that the time to fight election fraud is before the election. (See comments above re NC.) Once the votes are counted, it is profoundly difficult to convince a court to throw out votes or overturn an election. After Trump predictably failed in court, there was no plausible path to changing the election result. Putting pressure on state legislatures did nothing but create precedent to weaken the Electoral College, which is already teetering. Challenging the certification process did nothing but give bipartisan reinforcement to the damaging precedent that Democrats have created over the past few cycles.
Trump’s final offense was pressuring Pence to reject the EC results, which Pence had no power to do. Trump fired up a crowd to pressure the Republican VP to take an unconstitutional action that would have plunged the country into the most serious Constitutional crisis since 1860. That, for me and a lot of others in the Republican coalition, is an impeachable offense that cannot be ignored.
Of course Democrats actually introduced articles with their very questionable and incandescently hypocritical “incitement of insurrection” charge. So what was the right thing to do for House Rs? They could vote for an impeachment that was warranted, but stated the wrong reasons. They could vote against impeachment on the grounds that it wasn’t for the correct reasons. They could introduce their own articles of impeachment or censure resolution citing the right reasons, or they could do what McCarthy did and talk about the censure resolution that would have been appropriate without actually doing anything.
None of those options are particularly palatable. I honestly don’t know what I would have done if I were in that situation. The message to Trump-skeptical Rs over the past four years is that we have to choose the lesser evil. I think 10 House Republicans may have done just that.
If people fought before the election, would Bauxite have supported it?
Perhaps it would be declared as “unAmerican”?
Now Americans realize how deep the problem is. First, they just thought it was a minor leak. But in truth, it was not a minor leak.