Do you think this will ever happen?
I have grown very cynical. So Rand Paul’s call to investigate the four senators will probably go nowhere:
Sen. Rand Paul (R-KY) called for a probe into four Democratic Senators on Sunday over a letter that they sent to Ukraine in 2018 that threatened to withhold aid from the country if it did not continue to investigate President Donald Trump.
But their actions certainly seem to be an obvious case of a quid prop quo of the type of which Trump was accused and which served as the original supposed pretext for the latest impeachment inquiry.
Speaking of going nowhere – I noticed this related piece at American Thinker that makes this point:
Without doubt, a criminal cabal is an extraordinarily complex organization, and understanding who did what, why, when, and how is a challenge to the mental faculties of anyone. But, what happens if the full scope of activities is never clear? Does everyone get off? Does complexity confer immunity?
In engineering, there is no perfect answer to anything, so changes are made incrementally, addressing the problems as they are recognized. Each step brings a clearer view of remaining problems, which are then addressed, each in its turn. The completed project is still flawed, but the solution is practical and productive.
So it should be with a grandiose scheme like the Russia Hoax. The ringleaders don’t have to be handled with kid gloves. They don’t even have to be handled at all. Just start with the low-hanging fruit, and get as far as possible…
A DOJ that fails to move loses its credibility and its honor. The foundation of the Republic is placed at risk. Without the rule of law, what do we have?
At some point, deferral of prosecution is dereliction or abetting. Has it reached that point?
In other words, as the title of the essay asks, “Will We Ever Prosecute?”
If you take a look at the comments there, the answer from the right is a resounding, sorrowful, and angry “no.” I believe that for most people on the right, two events in particular began to solidify this feeling. The first was the lack of consequences for Lois Lerner. The second, of course, was Comey’s rather remarkable performance in trying to explain why Hillary Clinton would be skating in regard to the emails.
By now, the right has grown tired of waiting, and the last week or two of the renewed and energized impeachment push from the left has only deepened the right’s cynicism about the end results. It also seems rather obvious that part of the impetus for the impeachment “inquiry” is to drive home the idea that any prosecutions of the Russiagate perpetrators that might be forthcoming would only be a baseless tit-for-tat retaliation by Durham et al against the noble left’s determination to bring the corrupt Trump to “justice.”
Prosecution, no.
But I think at this point, the Cold Civil War has reached a state where a measure like this will be used purely to blunt a specific offensive. Prosecute us for quid pro quo? We prosecute you for the same if you do. Attack is probably cancelled while adversaries look for a new angle.
Overlapping and converging interests.
Mr. Chairman, we do not have a crisis at Freddie Mac, and in particular at Fannie Mae
The same problem was observed auditing the Fannie/Freddie redistributive debt scheme as early as 2001.
As usual Victor Davis Hanson has a great, inclusive (this, this, AND that) take on the impeachment theatrics, showing how impeachment can work and is working for Democrats — given their givens.
An aspect that hadn’t occurred to me:
Put so much political and media pressure on Trump that after three years of these serial assaults, and even the animal energy of Trump could fade. Consider all the smears as taps on an eggshell that leave only invisible fissures until the final hit—impeachment—explodes the supposedly invulnerable shell to pieces.
Look what the campaign trail finally did to the similarly septuagenarian Bernie—slimmer and traditionally more careful about weight and exercise than is Trump. So, the aim is to ramp up the pressure, threaten impeachment, and so tax and endanger Trump that he goes the full Nixon pneumonia/phlebitis route and physically either collapses, goes into a coma, or just up and quits. Impeachment is just a pretext for physically and mentally destroying the person of the president of the United States.
https://amgreatness.com/2019/10/13/the-strategies-of-targeting-trump/
Trump sure seems built like a tank, taking all this non-stop abuse. Damn few at any age could handle what he has. He’s been a marvel so far. I pray he can keep it up.
VDH’s other brilliant point is what does Pelosi’s House do now, if not impeachment?
<i.Would Democrats prefer to introduce in the House legislation to enact the Green New Deal? The wealth tax? Reparations? Health care for illegal aliens? Open borders? Abolish $1.6 trillion in student debt? Or sit back and see whether Andrew McCabe, James Comey, or James Clapper might get indicted in a month or so?
Compared to those alternatives, daily venting and screaming without doing anything at all about the ogre Trump under the guise of exhaustively pondering impeachment inquiries, impeachment voting, impeachment hearings, and impeachment verdicts seem smart.
You could take the position that a few powerful members of Congress are leading the entire–otherwise mostly blameless–Congress off a cliff.
But, if that were so, you would think that the more traditional, rational, and patriotic members of Congress–however small in number these days–would be complaining about this suicidal conduct and, by now, would be complaining very vociferously and very publicly; if effect, jumping up and down, screaming, and waving their arms in the air.
But this has not really happened to any extent that I am aware of, and the overwhelming majority of members of Congress stand by, mute, as the bank account containing an accumulated 250 years of something approaching trust is overdrawn, and Thelma and Louise gun the car, and head for the cliff.
Thus, looking at the evidence–with apparently only a handful of exceptions–we are today dealing with a Congress that lives in it’s own warped reality, that has abandoned its role under our Constitution, and it duties, has cut its ties with reality as experienced by the majority of its constituents, with our history, traditions, and with precedent, and is no longer attached to this country and its citizens. It is an entity all to its own, and living in its own little bubble.
It seems to me that Congress has gone so far off the rails that it no longer really represents the people–no more traditional “regular order” budgets, no major bi-partisan legislation of benefit to the people; it represents itself and its member’s interests, it represents major business interests, it represents a whole variety of ideological interests of the Left, it even represents the interests of various foreign countries which have bought influence and, perhaps, even “reality” TV.
At this point it’s going through the motions, giving the appearance of life to an empty shell that has, in recent decades, been increasingly drained of substance or meaning.
But, represent the real interests of the American people? That, it no longer does, nor–despite what it’s members might tell us–does it actually care.
Do you think this will ever happen? –neo
I’ll settle for the ever-forthcoming report from Barr, Durham et al. I’ve forgotten who is next at bat. The test will be if that report contains real, actionable indictments.
I want to believe.
Of course that was a poster caption in Fox Mulder’s “X-Files” FBI office…
Tit for Tat would be a BIG improvement over what we have so far.
The USA, and “rule of law”, needs indictments.
But they need to come from a DOJ which is manned mostly by … the Deep State Trump haters. Not going to be many, if any.
I hope and pray for indictments against the Deep State criminals. Any of them, to start. McCabe, Comey, Rice (exposing citizens); the 4 Senators.
A recent recurring fantasy — Trump and Barr set up a new “Office of Gov’t Justice”, to specifically review violations of the laws, and of the regulations of the agencies, by bureaucrats in any agency. Get funding for that agency.
Only hire those whose public facebook/ media has been indicating support for Trump.
Then, have Congress eliminate 99% of the budget of the DOJ. One year without the DOJ, and all the swamp folk need to leave. Then the new OGJ expands to do more of what the old DOJ was supposed to do, but now with more Reps. Naturally, this could only pass thru a Rep controlled House & Senate, but that’s my 2020 dream.
In the meantime, I pine…
pine for indictments.
DoJIG Horowitz has a report huxley, said to be complete, under review by named parties in the report, and due before Oct. is out, possibly as soon as Fri. this week.
AG Barr, Durham, Huber will have grand juries and indictments, if they have anything I guess. They’ll come along after people have absorbed Horowitz’ news, which may take awhile.
According to a Bartiromo tweet today, outing of Horowitz’s Rept. is delayed again, for the sake of more Classifications.
If the D.S. (and its Cong. pals) can push to make the Classified section the size of a phone book, and the public part the size of an H.S. term paper, let alone if we never see anything, you can stick a fork in the Constitution.
sdfeer, aNanyMouse: Fingers crossed.
I don’t know what will happen.
Tom Grey,
This Republic ain’t dead – it’s pinin’!
Would any DC Jury convict a Lois Lerner? I fear that hopes for prosecutions may not be well founded. Unsuccessful DC Jury trials may only make things worse as jurors become the new heroes of the Resistance.
A world that finds no problems with Hunter Biden and impeachable problems with asking about it is not going to change because of the facts revealed by Horowitz.
I don’t have a solution beyond a Trump 2020 win that takes both houses, which I think is likely.
What is missing is a public debate about specific reforms to the Deep State. What exactly should be done. There is a large public waiting for some plan for reform.
Insubordination by government employees should be grounds for expedited termination. Department heads actually appointed by the winning President need a lot more power to reform their departments and terminate employees.
Massive downsizing of employees in selected nonsense programs should be proposed. Some sort of sunset legislation that would end the thousands of programs without specific congressional renewal should be discussed.
Oppression under color of law needs to become part of the public debate. Government employees who act without legislative foundation should be personally liable for damages, damages not paid by taxpayers.
The republic is dead. Trump is an outlier in the country’s (to paraphrase Bork) slouch toward Gomorrah. Sad.
The two tiers of our Injustice Department have been blatantly obvious ever since Ted the Baptist. He dropped a car and a girlfriend into the Chappaquiddick River, then went home to sleep it off before notifying the police. And faced no legal consequences.
At this point, what does it matter if we have a dictator: a Franco or Pinochet; what would be the difference in the government: that big D democracy is a failure is evident before all the world: Man cannot rule himself, not even those who govern can rule themselves. Is it any wonder that Jesus Christ declares when he rules in the millennial kingdom he will smash the nations with a rod of iron.
We need an Alexander who will cut this Gordian knot the wicked have tied for us.
If this story is as reported, and supposed “Top advisor on Russia” Fiona Hill, the “very concerned” “witness” that this “star chamber” committee reportedly heard testify for some 11 hours, had already resigned, and was not even working in the White House when President Trump’s call to the President of the Ukraine was made, then Schiff’s secret Impeachment hearings might as well just go out and pick some random passerby off the street, and crown them as the next witness/whistle blower against Trump.
See https://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2019/10/revealed-latest-dems-impeachment-witness-fiona-hill-was-not-even-working-in-white-house-at-time-of-trump-call-another-deep-state-shill-video/
Indictments probably won’t even matter, unless the consequences for the attempted coup are personal and substantial.
And that won’t happen unless the people rise up in defense of our Republic. Tarring and feathering at a minimum will be required.
Each session Congress puts out a compilation of all the laws it has passed.
Looking through several such compilations a couple of decades ago, I couldn’t help but notice that a fair amount of the legislation that had been passed in many of those sessions–and which bulked up these compilations–was not serious or substantial legislation but was, instead, commemorative legislation, which designated this or that day as being “National Ingrown Toenail Awareness Day,” or “National Salute to Pig Farmers Day.”
In other words, non-controversial, feel good legislation that, no doubt, pleased those constituents and groups interested in these particular issues–and could be counted and pointed to as legislation passed–but which did not really do anything to help address or solve major issues, or improve the lives of citizens in general.
I thought of this because, as I have commented above, Congress is essentially gridlocked and, to read the news, members of Congress are not churning out major pieces of consequential legislation that is able to be make it thorough both houses, and on to the President for his signature or veto.
So, the obvious question arises, in terms of serious, major legislation, just what are they spending their days doing?
Perhaps I am wrong, though, in thinking that this inaction is wrong, and gridlock is actually the function that–at this particular time–best serves our Republic, by blocking pernicious pieces of legislation from even getting to the President’s desk?
No matter how vile the crime, our elites just don’t prosecute each other. The “deep state” is a perfect example. Anyone else would be crucified for what these people are doing.
Rich Vail’s comment is 100% correct. The political class does not prosecute each other. If that we’re to start, they’d all be in trouble. Who knows where it would end. They all live in glass houses.
Trump, on the other hand, is an outsider, so fair game.
Trum doesn’t prosecute Hillary because Hillary was his friend, and they are from the same power class.
Trump sure seems built like a tank, taking all this non-stop abuse. Damn few at any age could handle what he has. He’s been a marvel so far. I pray he can keep it up.\
when people say a billionaire doesnt deserve what they earned
your seeing why they do… the more you have, the more intense the taking
the harder it is to hold onto, unless you hide away.. and its still very hard
i learned this from a half billionaire…
most morals are limited by funds, not ethics or goodness
most people thing getting it is the point, nope, its actually easy to get
hard is holding onto it.
i bought a waterman pen for 100… why? well i never actually bought it.
you see, i put a 100 dollar deposit on it, been using it, and now its worth 800
when i sell it, i get my money and interest back… the value
so did i buy that wealthy item? or did i borrow it with a deposit?
did they buy the rolls or borrow it?
rambrandt?
see a pattern.. those collections houses and things are a form of diversification and asset holding… the more you have, the more you have to have some in all kinds of places…
just think of what would happen if you had a billion dollars in one estate
and everyone knew it was there…
My debutante girl was always petrified of being kidnapped.
IVAN KASPERSKY. …
BOBBY GREENLEASE. …
VIRGINIA PIPER. …
JOHN PAUL GETTY III. …
PATTY HEARST. …
ALFREDO HARP HELU. …
WALTER KWOK. …
ALDO MORO.
here is an interesting link..
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_kidnappings
shows that having a high paying job isnt as much fun as it seems
neither is money for nothing
Trum doesn’t prosecute Hillary because Hillary was his friend, and they are from the same power class.
may i ask the moron how does a president prosecute?
your forgetting this isn’t the communist place you want, they cant..
what he CAN do, especially as a lame duck..
is declassify things… its one of his powers… (at least now it is)
seems that stupid never changes…
but ignorance has a cure, it learns…
I have an idea…
IMPEACH CONGRESS – 2020
may i ask the moron how does a president prosecute?
This is what I am talking about. Art takes all the abuse he said he got from feminism and instead of overcoming victimhood, just adopts his abuser’s modus operandi. He acts like they do because he seems to think that is how it actually “works”.
No, that’s not how it works. Reading a book doesn’t confer wisdom of the author on you either, Art. You lost those arguments before but have no way to recover other than through the usual psychological satan soul tricks of projection, denial, or displacement.
I’ll let you hear Trum’s words for yourself, although it will be hard for you to understand it.
https://www.nytimes.com/video/us/politics/100000004701741/trump-to-clinton-youd-be-in-jail.html
Also, do you understand how stupid it is for you to call Ymar stupid or a moron or ignorant? You’re just a SJ Whore and Social Just Wrong, trying to beat Ymar when Ymar specializes in beating Leftsts. How does that work? It’s like women trying to beat Trum on twitter by accusing him of whatever.
It does not work.
I can read your minds.
Comey was at fault!
And who was at fault for letting Comey decide what happens with HRC? President Bush II or Hussein?
https://www.fbi.gov/news/pressrel/press-releases/statement-by-fbi-director-james-b-comey-on-the-investigation-of-secretary-hillary-clinton2019s-use-of-a-personal-e-mail-system
Ya think Bush II and Hussein muslim was President in 2016, ayup?
GB and I argued about whether Trum could become a tyrant in 2015 to 2016. I said that his supporters, the Alt Right, could easily push him to do it.
GB and others said something like “the media will prevent Trum from doing anything bad like that”.
Actually, now we see current events, the media is the thing most liable to promote Trum’s supporters into going “Hot war”. Because the media is an organ of the DS.
The media is going to ensure Trum does everything Constitutional?
Wait, let’s look at it another way. The DS will make sure that Trum is so provoked by the media and other things, that his supporters will demand he be made Caesar to “fix the swamp”. How about that. That’s more likely.