Singing prodigies: Jeffrey Li
Child singers are an interesting phenomenon. Some people like them; some don’t. Child singers can’t bring the depth of feeling to a song that someone with greater life experience can.
Or can they? At least, a few of them?
At 10 years of age, Jeffrey Li sang with an aching purity of tone and tremendous sincerity of delivery. This is a clip from some Asian talent show, seemingly for kids (with some strange shenanigans from the audience). The girl singing the duet with Li, Celine Tam, is around 7 years old here. She has a nice voice, too. But to me, Li is the undisputed star .
Please watch the whole thing, because one of the highlights occurs when they start their duet at around 2:33. I defy anyone not to get a little shiver at that point. And their pianissimo ending is superb as well:
At 13 years of age, Li is still great, singing the same song alone. But maybe not quite as great (here the audience screams in a distracting way, but Li doesn’t lose his composure):
And I love the reaction of Li’s parents as they listen.
Sooner or later Li’s voice will change as he goes through puberty. He may still sing very well, like Aled Jones before him. But as with Aled, he probably won’t be quite as good as he was as a child.
A quality duet that belies the singers’ ages. The last 15 seconds were a perfect harmony of masculine and feminine.
Beautiful. Thanks for the treat.
I don’t have video capability, or I would watch it. Music (tho instruments) was my first love.
Long ago, when I was supposed to be doing something else, I read an extended treatment of the old-days (institutional) Boys Choir phenomenon. It belongs in Mackay’s Extraordinary delusions & the madness of crowds” … in which, actually, a rather great deal belongs.
Especially the stars lived in agony with their coming changes … and of course other beneficiaries of the fame, parents and competing schools & cathedrals dreaded it too.
I will have to give this a whirl on the search engines … though there are a few other old readings I’ve tried to find, particularly with history, unsuccessfully.
Given my cousins went to juliard
and i performed lincoln center (avery fischer hall) and carnegie hall before 10 years old
and entered bronx science
and
who gives a crap?
what you dont get is what happens when they grow up!!!
[and you would be horrified what they are doing to them in the name of improving the world…]
if your on top of the hill of skill, your bosses fear you, and your coworkers hate you
Again.. Maurice Seymour my dad friend. 2nd wife opera singer.. classical musician daughter… had the world famous Ponte make my clarinet for me and paid for it and hid that fact from my poor parents…
Accordion Store’s Departure Signals End of Manhattan’s Music Row
For decades, musicians from around the world flocked to a segment of West 48th Street in Manhattan that was known as Music Row. Both sides of the block, just off Times Square, were lined with shops that sold and repaired guitars, drums, keyboards and other instruments.
But the music finally died there in December when the last holdout, Alex Carozza, packed up his accordion store and 50 years of memories and moved off the block. Now, all that is left of Music Row are the signs and awnings that beckoned to virtuosos and neophytes alike.
The block is haunted by empty buildings and the occasional tourist straining for some echo of its harmonious past.
first string solist… half deaf… also photographer, and more.
not that neo would let me show you all the range and stuff
better let them erase me. eh?
“Musically, it’s kind of depressing,” Mario Tacca, an accordion player and longtime patron of Music Row, said. “I guess it’s part of the new world that we’re living in. The old world is kind of disappearing slowly. It’s kind of sad to see.”
and here he is: Charles ponte
https://static01.nyt.com/images/2016/01/04/nyregion/04MUSICROWweb2/04MUSICROWweb2-jumbo.jpg?quality=90&auto=webp
Charles Ponte, left, at his store on Music Row in 1968, when music shops there first started closing. In a New York Times article from the time, he predicted that “every last one of them” would be gone within a year
it was in early 70s… i had a bundy… very cheap… they wanted me solo, and my instrument was too poor… we were too poor…
i wasted my childhood to develop skills that would ruin my life later
when the people like neo and others stopped defending and watched the ends
lots o talk, not much action, and so, its just a running dialogue of erasure
anyway… i remember dad calling us up and saying seymour wanted me to come down and we would go to the store and try to find another clarinet… rent was 75 and we lived in the bronx…
ponte took my old one… as a trade in…
he said how many people did i beat with it…
keys were bent… bad springs..
my cousin played church organ… bach…etc
the other cousin was 15 instruments
i could play many by ear, and sing, and more..
[have unrecorded voice credits, one clio they took away, and more… after all, i have aspergets and robbing me, hurting me, locking me down and taking advantage of me is pretty easy… even more so given people to day vs yesteryears]
he asked me to play… had some fun..
and we went to the back of the shop just as it was in the picture
he talked to the guy and pulled out this case… and they put together an instrument
he selected it himself… (i am tearing up now… oh ponte… all the people who loved me and my work and such are all dead… )
at that time, i didnt know who he was..
i didnt now he was a musician of oboe…
what a great man… and no one remembers him, also erased
he found a bell for my instrument to match..
and out we went.. seynmour was phoogrpahy, and chess, and we played like spasky and and others… his wife sang opera the fat lady… to see her do das neiblung… his son was lost, never found at sea… killed by drug dealers his boat was recoved with on one on it… other son, said screw you, and there was lots of involvment in the porn industry and film industry… (all coming to the same places fo r head shots, which is what seymore did… blue eyes, amos andy, russian ballet.. all these people were around in my childhood… so decades later doing a bit of sesame street for run, celeb photog and more… was a nothing for me)
the son who was lost had a child, raul… he played chello… tammy played a stratavarious (no name)… she referred to it as her strat… [mom and dad hoped we would hit it off and get hitched…] betsy my sisters friend played viola
i played acadmy, and other places..
all forgotten now..
but a long long time later…
i went to get a spring for my clarinet…
and went into a small music store in jersy and asked do you have them
he said yes, which do you need…
i pulled out the wrong case… with the right instrument
opened it up and he nearly dropped…
he said its lovely… would you sell it?
i said no… probably will be buried with it.. (he frowned)
he said i will give you 3000 for it…
no
looked in the register.. $5000 for it…
no
$5000 cash and a check?
no
i bought my 75 cent spring and went home…
you see… Ponte, seymour and so on… they backed me up without telling me
mom and dad didnt know about instruments… just music… dad sang bass
so, when Ponte said the clarinet was $300 after talking to seymour..
dad and mom blew needed money on it…
it was later on i discovered what it was worth..
and realized that seymour, who was wealthy, paid for it and put a token price on it so that it woudl nto be taken for granted… but we didnt know what it was worth, so we wouldnt sell it in need and so on..
two great men.. of many i have known… but dad was always ahead of such
family made me an actual real modern reneisance man
Ponte also had the double reed company and played oboe… he opened his shop with the idea that he woudl help poor musicians and artists… like me… and he did..
We carry on the proud Charles Ponte tradition in the form of the Charles Reed Makers Knife, the secret to which was handed down from Charles Ponte to Brian Charles, our owner. We handmake the full line of Charles double reeds including student and professional level oboe, English horn, oboe d’amore, bassoon and contra bassoon reeds, all backed by an unbeatable guarantee.
its funny, but he is like me a star among stars but not regular people
I always wanted to do a American Express commercial with the people i have known and taken pictures of behind me… lenny cravitz, tommy james, and on and on…
i would stand up and be in front…
“you dont know me, but they do”
like the old commercials..
anyway..
i had always hoped that people here might see some of my stuff
sad to produce artwork, music, designs, chips, math solutions, graphic arts all for the garbage dump… cause i have no idea how to promote myself and others have lots of ideas how to trap and use me
it will be good when i am dead and gone…
no?
i would be so happy just to hear what people here thought of things
so much stuff… i would even be happy if everyone hate it..
i have more work and such than can be easily seen
and i dont want to be erased or saved after death like Vivian Maier
http://www.vivianmaier.com/
without neo helping i would have to reveal who i am..
i wish she would put up the boy… he was stolen, and i would love to have a tiny chance of that coming back from people seeing it… i was going to register it, but alas, alone, aspergers and so on… its dead end
but its nice to see the process of picking them up
making them special
then dropping them from on high
is still going… sadly
maybe if someone asks nice neo would select one or two she has seen
or i can send her…
my chances of dying and having someone find my art like vivien is pretty null
and aspergers and so on prevents me seeking as much as i could
after all, since i cant read people, the ones who seem to be best tend to be the socuopaths who would do not best…
in fact, its now to the point i feel if they do want to help and jump at it, they are going to hurt me and my family (by hurting me)…
but like neo, if not, then i know if they did, they would not do that…
so all i really have is the psychopaths..
and so, i dont create any more…
its bad enough few ever see anything
its worse that i would create for them
give a prayer i am taken and can sing i the choir triumphant..
though i doubt there would be even the tinniest corner of heaven allowed for me
🙂
I pretty much hate talented kids. Mainly because when I was a kid, and they’d have a talented kid on tv, my relatives would ask me, “Why can’t you be talented like that kid?”
my favorite prodigy today is Yoyoka
Watch This 8-Year-Old Girl Crush Led Zeppelin’s ‘Good Times Bad Times’
https://www.npr.org/sections/allsongs/2018/06/11/618963329/watch-this-8-year-old-girl-crush-led-zeppelins-good-times-bad-times
the MOST important part is to listen carefully at the VERY end..
you know, like me as a child, she is not forced..
bet you cant guess what my parents said when i quit music…
The video, which features Soma playing along to the 1969 hit, earned her a spot in the international competition’s final round. She didn’t take home the gold, but she did win our hearts.
Soma has been playing drums since the tender age of 2. At 4, she started performing at concerts, and now she’s been on over 100 stages. She’s a member of her family band, Kaneaiyoyoka, where she contributes keyboard and vocals in addition to drums. She even composes her own lyrics and music.
“I want to be an artist who can do anything: playing all instruments, recording music, mixing the sound and designing the CD album jackets,” she said in a statement accompanying her entry.
skip the article and see her play
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=91pz1E8pAOY
i have known many and was one
and dont give a **** anymore…
But … did he get his dog??
I like this 11 year old from 2006 who sings a show tune pretty well.
I have wondered, and read it somewhere, that most babies are born with perfect pitch and, if they grow up speaking a tonal language, tend to keep it. Lots of very good classical musicians among Chinese.
A large body of research has proven that children today are given less freedom by their parents than previous generations. In 1972, geographer Roger Hart conducted a famous study, measuring the distances that children in a small New England town traveled outside their homes, producing maps that showed the average distance most children were allowed to stray, and how far they actually went. When he returned to the same town in 2004 and caught up with the now-grown children he’d studied to see how they were raising their own kids, he found his experiment impossible to repeat: the parents barely trusted their children to go outside their sight, not to mention to be followed on unsupervised adventures around the town.
I don’t watch those Talent shows; are they all like that? I used to watch Star Search long ago, if anyone remembers that one. Ed McMahon hosted, I think; I was especially fascinated by the “TV spokesmodel” category… Last night, after hearing Crimson and Clover on one of our CDs, I looked up Tommy James and the Shondells, and waddyano, there he is in artfuldodger’s post. Guess that’s the same Tommy James! He was singing with the predecessor band to the Shondells when he was 12, turns out. From there, for some reason youtube cued up for me a couple of “touching” songs done on the British version of this Talent show, before Simon and three others. The songs were very emotional… like this little kid’s song, You Raise Me Up.
But the emotion seems odd, to me. The emotion feels entirely unearned; it’s instant melodrama, instant soul-baring, mawkish. Can I really be alone in that reaction? I doubt it. Neo, those two Asian kids in the first video looked like CGI to me. The odd gestures, their littleness, their attempt to look grown-up (which seemed perfectly sincere, but still peculiar).
I remember when Charlotte Church was a prodigy, although my memory says she was singing a lot better than these two kids. Then she grew up and dissed us for 9/11 and where she is now, I don’t know, maybe not even in a church choir.
Artful, I don’t know if you’re “a star among stars,” it sounds to me that you have some unresolved issues on that score but when you look at the brevity of so many artistic careers, who can judge that? Not me. I do remember W. 48th Street, if that was home to Manny’s and also to another guy’s mostly drums music shop. Sorry to hear they’re gone, but times do change.
Neo, the point underneath this rambling is that I found those kids odd, ersatz. I find a lot of stuff in our culture today ersatz. I’m tempted to make a little note of apology for this dyspeptic response, but why? We have watched our culture get ever wackier, maybe that is the polite word for it. I try not to go there with it!
Most children are incredibly malleable and adaptable and it’s nearly impossible to predict their future talents and interests based on prepubescent talents and interests.
Children with exceptional ability like these two will almost certainly carry that talent through to their adulthood, but whether they stand out as uniquely among their peers, or even have the drive to continue singing is anybody’s guess.
Like others here stated, I generally find things like this disturbing. Why not have them dress age appropriately and sing an age appropriate song? There are fun songs about things that interest children. They have obviously not experienced any of the things they are singing about. I suppose Celine Deion wasn’t on the Titanic either, but at least one can believe she’s had her heart broken. I hope these two truly have an innate passion for singing and performance, but my hunch is mom and/or dad are backstage shouting, “Sing out, Rose! That’s peachy for some people, for some, hum-drum people to be,but some people ain’t me!”
i bet you never heard this young lady… [starts at 1:41]
Amira Willighagen – O Mio Babbino Caro – for English-speaking viewers
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qDqTBlKU4CE
what have i learned from my life in what i do from then?
the world is full of talented people and suprising to most people would be to find out that we are much more talented and capable (in general) than we allow ourselves to know…
Bonus….
The last Castrato
Alessandro Moreschi sings Ave Maria (no scratch)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KLjvfqnD0ws
Alessandro Moreschi Sings Tosti’s “Ideale” 1902
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GyodNzbjVkw
A castrato (Italian, plural: castrati) is a type of classical male singing voice equivalent to that of a soprano, mezzo-soprano, or contralto. The voice is produced by castration of the singer before puberty, or it occurs in one who, due to an endocrinological condition, never reaches sexual maturity.
it was an effort to preserve longer the ephemeral
Choir intro to You Can’t Always Get What You Want.Rolling Stones, San Diego. 2015-05-24
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D2Nbr07JIiQ
and of course..
there is
Kaitlyn Asley Maher [four years old]
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PZUvsCdEw7I
My sister had an appreciation for boys choirs, and we had an LP produced around 1964 of some prestigious British outfit that she’d listen to with considerable care. I always found boys choirs alienating, especially the mixed junior choir at the Anglican parish we attended. (I doubt you could staff a junior choir so well nowadays). There was a presbyterian congregation near downtown that had a bell choir, which strikes me as a much more appropriate activity for a boy.
Ideally, at Mass, you’d have a schola or cantor in the sanctuary to chant the propers and a women’s choir in the balcony to chant the ordinary and no hymns or congregational singing at all.
I gag over anything with inspriational content.
I remember when Charlotte Church was a prodigy, although my memory says she was singing a lot better than these two kids. Then she grew up and dissed us for 9/11 and where she is now, I don’t know, maybe not even in a church choir.
Kai Akker: I was enchanted by her version of Delibes’ “Flower Duet.” Later I read she went through a rough brat period. I was annoyed by her anti-Americanism. Now she has a career in music and television. However, no, she didn’t become some ultimate singer.
I must say I share your impression of Li:
But the emotion seems odd, to me. The emotion feels entirely unearned; it’s instant melodrama, instant soul-baring, mawkish.
Of course, the unearned emotion charge is frequently leveled at whites singing black blues.
I’m not sure where I come down on that, but when the Rolling Stones covered blues standards at least they were adults and had some mileage as a scruffy, hungry-to-make-it band.
Of course the kids are odd and unusual, almost by definition (although at 13, Li seems a lot less odd than at 10). These things are not spontaneous. However, I happen to think his voice is very beautiful, especially in the earlier clip.
Artfldgr:
You would lose that bet. See this.
“when the Rolling Stones covered blues standards at least they were adults”
Just barely. When the Stones’ first album came out Jagger and Richards were 20 years old, though the rest of the band was older.
Huxley, the “Flower Duet” is very pretty, I agree; there are several songs on that “Enchantment” album (“Carrickfergus,” for another) that are beautiful, I think. But musicians have said that was when Charlotte Church’s voice started to show its limitations. She was either 14 or 15 when she recorded that album. There is something about a child’s purity of tone, as Neo hears in Li — hence the castrati, obviously.
As for the blues argument, isn’t that another from of the “cultural appropriation” complaint? Yet, like you, I find there is something to it. The experiences and the sound were so particular to one place and one kind of life, for a time…. at least until Muddy Waters went to Chicago. Paul Butterfield, Eric Clapton, John Mayall could all play the blues, but it never sounds the same and it doesn’t really deserve the name the blues, IMO. Johnny Winter, I’m not sure; maybe he came the closest. The Rolling Stones and even a couple early Beatles covers made for some fairly good music, but that’s because they were good musicians, not bluesmen.
Come to think of it, after the Muddy Waters–B.B. King generation, are there any blues singers left? I can’t name one. Also loved Otis Spann’s piano playing, just had to add that in here somewhere, LOL!
Talented kid. Fabulous voice. (I could do without the hand and arm gestures myself, but hey, “That’s Entertainment”…)
Yes an incredible talent. And it’s wonderful to be able to move, in a good way, masses of people with your art….
So, thanks!
So much incredible music out there. Gotta admit, though, that this tune is more my speed (at least on some days):
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K_QAoanXntw
As for the (aw, shucks) dog, I was expecting one to come bounding on stage right at the closing bar (more “That’s Entertainment”!!). Yes, that incomparable eons-long companionship…a “boy and his dog”….:
https://www.amazon.com/Boy-His-Dog-Harlan-Ellison-ebook/dp/B01G4MZ6YW
But what happens when the music stops?:
http://www.bbc.com/future/story/20190108-the-cyber-attack-that-sent-an-alaskan-community-back-in-time
Huxley, the “Flower Duet” is very pretty, I agree; there are several songs on that “Enchantment” album (“Carrickfergus,” for another) that are beautiful, I think. But musicians have said that was when Charlotte Church’s voice started to show its limitations.
Kai Akker: Back then I read comments from the seemingly knowledgeable that Church was risking damage to her voice by singing the “Flower Duet” at such a young age. I have no idea.
Re: Blues — I’m satisfied to enjoy the Stones’ versions of the blues as good music without worrying about boundaries. Also, their love for the blues is unquestionable. Throughout their career they have upheld the blues and blues artists.
Such as Buddy Guy, whom the Stones brought on stage for their “Shine a Light” concert/movie. Buddy Guy is the real deal. He’s in his 80s and has slowed down but he’s still working. One of the guitar greats too.
“Rolling Stones “Champagne And Reefer (with Buddy Guy)” Shine A Light Stones Scorsese 2006”
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=omxPvKWThUo
Mississippi John Hurt makes an interesting bookend to Jeffrey Li.
Hurt had a brief shot at a musical career in the 1920s, but worked as a sharecropper and farmhand for most of his life. He was rediscovered by a musicologist in the 1960s and enjoyed a well-deserved revival until he died at the age of 74. Here he is the year before:
“Mississippi John Hurt – You Got To Walk That Lonesome Valley (Live)”
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=85BvT5X6WSo
You can tell from Hurt’s picking (influential BTW), he is a skilled musician, but it’s the light in his eyes and his nuanced voice which convey volumes. You just know he’s walked that lonesome valley and for the moment you may share a few steps with him. He is the music he is singing.
It’s not fair to compare Hurt with Li. Li is walking his lonesome valley as well and who knows where it takes him. The issue of congruence between art and artist has its place but it’s not the only test nor the most important.
I’ve loved many artists for their work though later discovered they were pretty creepy people (J.D. Salinger, for one). For all I know, Mississippi John went home after that broadcast and kicked his dog for no good reason.
But it is an aspect of how we respond to art and something I ponder now and again.
Artfldgr,
“[C]hildren today are given less freedom…”
Raised in the far-rural Pacific Northwest woods, I was aware of this, very early. We had more freedom than ‘regular’ kids, but had elaborate, specific & fine-grained Rules, too. And we had corporeal punishment.
But what put me on this trail in-earnest, was reading a set of well-known ‘anthropology’ books, mainly centered on a Kung Bushman woman who relates her childhood experiences in the Kalahari. Ho, boy.
My grandmother writes to her brother, a sailor in the (strategic near-wilderness) Pacific Northwest, segueing to a pioneer, homesteading life, that her oldest, my 4yo dad, was the biggest little man you ever saw. He does a heavy round of chores on their hard-scrabble New Mexico hill-farm, and is soaking everything up like a sponge.
When I was 4, dad ‘tried’ Boeing, in Seattle. I got a few months good look at ‘high-density life’, then dad decided working in the woods wasn’t so bad after all, and we went back.
At 12, mom let me and my 10 yo brother backpack 80 miles through the Olympic National Park, for a week. And although there were a couple folks on the trail here & there who gave us a quizzical look, talked to us a little, it was no biggie. “Yeah and there were these two little boys up there by themselves – way up there – startling, but they were fine”.
Before universal education – packed in a room in ranks & files, authority figure hovering at the front – childhood was WAY different. Alaska still goes out of their way for the few remaining bush-family kids’ education … and Reality entertainment knows it sells.
‘Tortured geniuses’ more likely to commit suicide, study finds
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2017/03/17/people-artistic-professions-likely-commit-suicide-ons-study/
Dark side to bright minds
Often, Child Prodigies Do Not Grow Into Adult Genius – NYTimes.com
The Downside of Being a Child Prodigy – TIME
Child Prodigy, 14, Commits Suicide – CBS News
what if your like that, grown up and have aspergers… wait to die, its the only peace you will have as normals teach by pain, torture, and give no quarters. your bosses hate you in fear, your coworkers hate you in competition… you have few friends, and what you do get tend to use and abuse you trying to get from you what cant be taken but only stolen… on and on..
i cant wait till i am gone…
the world will rejoice…
Terrifying new study suggests ‘1 in 10 violin prodigies attempt suicide
‘Out of 10 violin prodigies, one will attempt suicide, two become alcoholics’
-=-=-=-=-=-
Autism’s ‘Worryingly’ High Suicide Rates Spur Conference
Experts sound alarm on autism’s “worryingly high” suicide rate
New Research on Autism and Suicide | Psychology Today
my work has not given me a raise in 15 years, despite a career on wllstreet, fortune 10, bronx science… they keep the tax money that is supposed to help… 175 iq, cant protect myself… they rob me… which isnt so bad, but they made sure that my wife and i cant have a baby… i am caucasian, and so, they thought i was priveleged.. now what?
cant wait till its over..
there is nothing to do but wait and hope
what do you freaking think happens to people like susan boyle
what do you guys think happens when i leave after a long stream of go away?
Aspies have a hard time making and keeping friends
Does anyone else have no friends? : aspergers – Reddit
I Do Not Exist — On Being Female with Asperger’s
[could be why i am so upset when erased]
Asperger’s Syndrome and the Illusion of Friendship – GoodTherapy
no support, no help, no claws to deal with normal
they steal, they take, they lie its theirs, they destroy you the better you are
better to be dead.. and gone..
as the only hope you have is none…
but yet, you trundle on…
as i said before
who gives a………………….
we are naturally hated..
and when you hate someone, you dont want anything from them
you can have a chip design
great art
great math
music, and more
and none of it will EVER be good enough
because you could paint like titian, take pictures like scavulo
even be recognized that way in many ways
but whatever it is you got, they dont want it
and you cant even get a ghost to be your front
https://community.autism.org.uk/f/adults-on-the-autistic-spectrum/4943/no-friends
how do you learn to make friends when your contemporaries are playing in the sand box and you have a reading level of college? your friends are old people, and they die out..
then what?
when your young, they cant suppress your difference and you have confidence
older, the whole game is social skilsl to put down others who are better cause no one will concede the job and walk away if they can neuter you, and without claws, rriends for advice, support and more..
well, cant wait for the choir triumphant..
because all this amazing stuff is worthless and your hated for it
just tired of being hated.. .
after 57 years its not trending better…
The Pain of Isolation: Asperger’s and Suicide
Why would a person with Asperger’s feel driven to suicide?
https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/aspergers-diary/201011/the-pain-isolation-asperger-s-and-suicide
i wont commit suicide (ever), but i certainly dont care any more..
you would think those kids would be able to bond more..
or that i would… but no one ever wanted ME, just my magic
do you care who the magician is, or what the trick does for you?
https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/aspergers-diary/200805/autistic-aloneness-when-coping-mechanisms-go-bad
Navigating in the “normal” world, for a person with Asperger’s, can be difficult, if not downright painful. The most difficult area for me to handle, personally, is rejection. While some people with autism or Asperger’s report a reduced desire for human attachment, the reality for many of us is to want it very much, but struggle to achieve it.
By default, people on the autistic spectrum have trouble reading others, and predicting how they will react to things. This can make for a very jarring life experience. You can feel like you’re driving down a road blind – and relationships can become very fear based. If you cannot read other people’s subtle body language, how can you see the problems coming down the pike, until you’ve already collided? How can you predict what will happen next?
An aspect missed by many mainstream articles and coverage on the subject is this – while those on the autism spectrum have trouble reading so called “normal” people, the reverse is true as well. Many of the offshoots of the way our minds work can be routinely misinterpreted, leading us to have difficulties in relationships and relatedness to others.
im going away…
but its taking longer than i had hoped…
my apolgies…
Gifted children with Asperger’s Syndrome – Davidson Institute
http://www.davidsongifted.org/Search-Database/entry/A10167
Unlike autistic children who often receive special assistance in schools, the bright student with Asperger’s Syndrome (AS) may be left to manage the best he or she can. In some cases, gifted students with the disorder may not be allowed to participate in their school’s gifted program because teachers do not know how to make the necessary accommodations.
Do all prodigies have traits of Asperger Syndrome
What Genius and Autism Have in Common
A study of eight child prodigies finds that share some striking characteristics, most notably high levels of autistic traits and an overrepresentation of autism in their close family members
http://healthland.time.com/2012/07/10/what-child-prodigies-and-autistic-people-have-in-common/
Are Prodigies Autistic?
New study on prodigies reveals some startling findings
https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/beautiful-minds/201207/are-prodigies-autistic
Prodigies dazzle us with their virtuoso violin concertos, seemingly prescient chess moves, and vivid paintings. While their work would be enough to impress us if they were 40, prodigies typically reach adult levels of performance in non-verbal, rule-based domains such as chess, art, and music before the age of 10.
[by then i had already won science fair, perofrmed at lincoln cener, carnegie hall, and was working towards early entry in bronx science… and more… ]
Their performances are hard to explain from a purely deliberate practice perspective. While it’s true that many prodigies receive support, resources, and encouragement from parents and coaches early on, such support is typically the result of a demonstrated “rage to learn”, as the prodigy expert Martha J. Morelock refers to the phenomenon.
we want to be liked..
we know we are not l;iked for ourselves
we will never be liked for ourselves
and we are not liked for the prodigy stuff either, as we are unliked
so…
can you imagine being so disliked by everyone so much that at 8 you wrongly think that if you can perform like a 40 year old adult, they will love you.. but not even your family loves you… your relationships are often sociopaths torturing you, taking from you pretnding love, or BOTH
Researchers who have spent years working with prodigies and witnessing their development firsthand have come to a different conclusion.
Now you know why i quit music.. what good is a career you top off at at 9?
At 18 months, he was speaking in complete sentences, and by 22 months he was reading 1st and 2nd grade readers cover-to-cover, sounding out unfamiliar words.
by the time i was in 5th grade i had 13th grade reading level
i got into bronx sciecne early
feminism destroyed me… as i could not get school, become a researcher. and so on
for the example in the article…
Total IQ Score= 129; Fluid reasoning= 106; Knowledge= 126; Quantitative Reasoning= 119; Visual Spatial Abilities= 126; Working Memory= 141
yeah, well… my IQ was 175 without the questions..
You take a IQ test with only the answers to pick and no questions and see if you get that high!!!
you have to look at the series of answers, come up with the question they would make, then pick which one… fun.. harder than normal…
high IQ is not necessary to be a prodigy…..
More striking is that every single prodigy scored off the charts in working memory — better than 99 percent of the general population. In fact, six out of the eight prodigies scored at the 99.9th percentile! Working memory isn’t solely the ability to memorize a string of digits. That’s short-term memory. Instead, working memory involves the ability to hold information in memory while being able to manipulate and process other incoming information. On the Stanford-Binet IQ test, working memory is measured in both the verbal and non-verbal domains and includes tasks such as processing sentences while having to remember the last word of each sentence, and recalling the location of blocks and numbers in the correct order in which they were presented.
ah, so thas how i know most of the music man has written
all the texts of more than 5 cannons
lots of textbooks, sciences papers. and more
of course, people who are gifted hate me too
why? ever blow the curve of the gifted? i did…
one even tried to poison me to get rid of a competitor to BX sci
There have been many descriptions of the phenomenal working memory of prodigies, including a historical description of Mozart that involves his superior ability to memorize musical pieces and manipulate scores in his head.
i do it all the time, but i am not like mozart.
but i dont need an ipod… i have whole scores memorized.. thousand and thousands of scores and parts… the same way kim peek remmebered baseball scores
oh, and in programming… literally over 100 languages
the gifted have exceptional memories
people like me, have even better, and they are not used to seeing someone who didnt go to harvard or yale (Cause the ladies and poverty), beat them from below
they then work to hurt me and put me in my place.
exterminating my wifes dream of family
[they are going to save the world too]
Of course, the million-dollar question is this: How did all the prodigies develop such a high working memory?
[we are born with it… and that screws marxists, and so on, dont it? talent is real]
Most memory champions have spent years deliberately practicing techniques such as the method of loci to increase their memories for random strings of digits, numbers, faces, and even decks of cards.
One of the prodigies in the study reported that he sometimes pretends to not remember things since he found that people become uncomfortable with his prodigious memory. “People assume I must be thinking about them 24/7 when I am not,” he noted. “It’s just that I can remember every detail of the past.”
im hated here… i remember the actual answer to the test
so those who dont, who are trying to be smart making things up, get foiled
get rid of me, and they are darlings.. but only if no one remembers the real answer!!!!!!
the work of Ruthsatz and her colleagues suggests another important piece of this puzzle may involve autism. Individuals with autism-spectrum condition (ASC) are typically characterized by social, communicative, and motor impairments. In an earlier, preliminary study, Ruthsatz found that both the first-degree families of individuals with autism and the first-degree families of prodigies in her sample displayed three out of five common traits of autism: impaired social skills, impaired ability to switch attention, and heightened attention to detail. This intrigued her, so she decided to look for autism in her current sample of prodigies.
Lo and behold, while about one in every 88 children in the United States is diagnosed with autism,four out of the eight prodigies in the current study had family members who either had an autism diagnosis or had a first- or second-degree relative with an autism diagnosis. Additionally, three of the prodigies had already been diagnosed with autism, and as a group they showed higher levels of autistic traits compared with a control group consisting of people weren’t prodigies (but scored only slightly higher than those with high-functioning autism, or Asperger’s).
cant wait…
erase me…
Wish i could show you guys what i worked out about genomics…
and more… (i work in med research but without paper, why listen. ramanujan would not be known if he lived today, instead they would ahve stolen his work, or kept him away)
5 Creative Geniuses Whose Autism Contributed to Their Success
https://www.appliedbehavioranalysisedu.org/5-creative-geniuses-whose-autism-contributed-to-their-success/
you will find the common thread is soeone who cared who could liff them away from the crabs in the bucket that pull you back..
Temple Grandin
Tim Burton
Matt Savage
Dan Aykroyd
James Durbin
and i am a slightly famous photographer…
so i cant add my name to the list or my family might get hurt
all the best
world will be a better palce when i am gone
why?
well, they are sure not shy about telling me how i am ruining it
and more
Artful. : (
But we’re not therapists. This isn’t a therapeutic setting. (In fact, it’s often the opposite.)
Wouldn’t your pain be more usefully expressed in a therapeutic setting?
I was only coming back on here to tell Huxley that I watched his clip of Buddy Guy and the Rolling Stones. Buddy Guy looked surprisingly healthy. No further comment. (Except I have ALMOST recovered from the sight of Keith Richard. Almost, but not completely. Good grief!)
I think the white guys have trouble playing good blues because they are overawed by the down-home authenticity of that blues generation from Robt Johnson to Muddy W to BB King to Buddy Guy.