Trump’s birtherism, past and present
For some reason, this story, which is the talk of the internet right now, doesn’t interest me enough to write about it. More Trump blah blah blah, and then more blah blah blah about the Trump blah blah blah.
Trump rode the birther controversy for a while—particularly when Trump was thinking of running for the presidency in 2011-2012 but dropped out very early. And then he mostly dropped it. Now he’s really dropped it and said he thinks Obama was born in the US. That’s the summary version, without any of the details.
But it occurs to me that you may want to talk about it. So here’s your opportunity.
Or you can consider this an open thread to talk about anything you want.
Trump is running against Hillary; not Barack. She just had to play the race card as she has nothing else.
Hillary’s finished. The emails will finally destroy her.
From your lips to God’s ears.
Or, to put it another way,
Fun dayn moyl in gots oyern.
Why does no one bring up the sleazy birther talk against Cruz, played to the hilt by the blowhard himself and all over the internet by the even sleazier alt-right for many months. In my opinion, it was the wedge that allowed Trump to stick around early against Cruz, until they could make up a couple more truckloads of garbage to attack him with..
geokstr:
Correct. Trump can’t play the “Hillary is not a citizen” so he had fall back on Hillary’s “plausibly deniable claim” that she didn’t go birther on BHO.
Trump is and was full birther and worse, it’s just not convenient now. Down the memory hole for the Trumpers.
The interesting thing about this story is how blatantly the MSM has swept into the memory hole their own reporting from 2007 and 8 showing the Clinton campaign starting this meme!
It’s almost as if CNN, MSNBC, NY Times, WaPo and others don’t care if they destroy what little credibility they have left if they can just drag Hillary a little closer to winning.
They are pretty much down to blind partisans as customers now but even they can find the truth if they stumble over it!
Steve W from Ford, you’re correct. Hillary’s 2008 primary campaign birthed the idea that Obama might not be a “natural born” citizen. It was subsequently taken up by some on the far right (maybe alt-right) during the general campaign with McCain. McCain denounced the birther idea in public as I recall, But that did not deter the people who wanted to believe that Obama was not a U.S. citizen.
The primary force behind the birther meme since that time has been an attorney named Orly Taitz.
A quote from wiki: “Taitz alleges that President Obama is not a natural-born citizen of the United States and is therefore ineligible to serve as President. She claims he was born in Kenya and that he falsified his Selective Service papers and his application to the Illinois bar.[22] “I believe [Obama] is the most dangerous thing one can imagine, in that he represents radical communism and radical Islam: He was born and raised in radical Islam, all of his associations are with radical Islam, and he was groomed in the environment of the dirty Chicago mafia. Can there be anything scarier than that?”[23]”
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Orly_Taitz
Google her. She is still on her mission against Obama.
Questions about Obama’s birth certificate went unanswered until he released a birth certificate after Trump brought up the issue, making it more visible than in had been before. Many in the birther movement believe the released certificate was a forgery and have advanced some interesting facts about that. For which see this:
http://science.co.il/obama-birth-certificate.htm
Obama’s mother was a U.S. citizen. Thus, no matter who his father was or where he was born, he is a U.S. citizen. Ted Cruz’s situation is informative in that regard. He was born in Canada to a Cuban father and an American mother. There was some questioning of his eligibility, but it was settled to everyone’s (well almost everyone’s) satisfaction that he was eligible to be President. The issue is now unimportant except as it can be used to smear Trump as a racist. It will continue to be used by Hillary. Look for it in the debate.
No issue about where he was born, even though I am a Cruze fan, I am a little confused about how someone born in Canada, yes an American mother, is eligible. My youngest son, now a retired Army officer, was born in Africa when I worked there yet he had to jump through several hoops to get into the Military(His Mother and I are both native born Americans). One other issue with Obama – why no info from his college application and what passport did he travel on when he toured Pakistan and Afghanistan in college? Is a foreign countries passport a disqualifier for the presidency?
Trump is a bona fide conspiracy theory enthusiast. His thing about Cruz’ father and JFK proved this because it gained him nothing to go on about it.
I’d bet that he still believes Obama is a foreigner, and is lying to us. That would make him a lying kook instead of an honest kook.
Stan on the Brazos :
How much of a Cruz fan can you be? You didn’t even spell his name right.
I think what happened earlier this week is that the media started to talk about Trump’s previous questions about Obama citizenship qualifications, so Trump headed it off at the pass.
I have no idea if Trump was sincere the other day, or not, but it doesn’t matter- he made the media look like fools once again while, at the same time, putting the issue into the ground. I was watching CNN after Trump made that short statement at the end, and their heads were exploding. I am not quite sure what they expected him to say- I thought Trump had already clued them in to what he was going to say on the matter- but whatever it was they expected, they didn’t get it.
As for Clinton’s ties to the issue- they are abundant, and all you really have to do is look around. I remember when I first heard about it- it was in reading pissing contests between Obama and Clinton supporters in late February or early March in 2008, so I don’t think the issue arose from Republicans initially, though some of them foolishly took up the issue after Obama won the nomination.
I have no idea if Trump was sincere the other day, or not, but it doesn’t matter
Nothing matters…
It’s MOOT.
But the odds favor that FMD is the biological father of our President — as Obama Senior had never met Stanley Ann before the Spring of 1961… then the whirlwind romance… that was never consumated as a marriage. ( See Barry’s autobiographic Dreams )
With TWO American parents it doesn’t matter that Stanley Ann give birth to Barry in Kenya… something that’s easy to believe based upon 1961 norms.
Folks just didn’t have their daughters give birth to a bastard ‘down the street’ — it was simply NEVER DONE.
Either way, FMD or Obama, Senior, could not confer legitimacy — as BOTH would have been bygamists, being married with children at that time.
It would’ve been a lethal scandal at that time… for the grandparents.
That Barry was born in Kenya… that government has NEVER retracted that claim. Are they all wrong ? Stupid ? Dense ?
The Long Form Birth Certificate has NEVER left cyber space. It has NO PHYSICAL REALITY.
So, it’s impossible to examine, directly.
It’s so LAME that every expert slams it. Even the cyber version is absurd.
Governor Abercrombie thought that the doubters were nuts — and soon found that HE couldn’t lay his hands on a physical copy, either. He flipped is story 180 in 72 hours. Check the record.
The fact is that Barry had his name changed when he was in Indonesia. His adoption was into a PROUD family name.
He never changed it back to his birth name when he came to America.
He was indoctrinated into Islam — which was virtually compulsory — to obtain a state sponsored education in Indonesia.
It just happened that his imam was a Wahhabist from KSA.
What you have with Barry is a fellow that confounds the Founding Fathers. He’s a natural born citizen by the test. Yet he is an indoctrinated alien American hater by philosophy and up-bringing.
From her own lips, his mother did not regard Americans as being “her people.”
All of this makes more sense when you realize how nutty the GRANDMOTHER was.
She’s the undiscovered person who spent more time raising Barry Soetoro than ANYONE.
Trump roped and doped the MSM with the Birther ‘thing.
Played them like a violin.
They are furious.
And not quiet about it at all.
I have some sympathy for the birthers- the original birther likely is Obama himself. Bios of him before he became a US Senator had it that he was born in Kenya. It is difficult to understand how those bios came to be written that way unless he had instructed it so. Now, having pointed this out, I am pretty sure Obama was born in Hawaii, and like most teenagers and very young adults probably lied about his past a bit just seem exotic within his peer group. I think if most of us are honest with ourselves, we no doubt exaggerated our uniqueness with various large and small lies at those ages- it is part of growing up.
@YW – nor is it at all unusual to think that a political candidate might lie about his background, especially when so much is at stake. Questioning his birth certificate was never crazy. Not accepting some pretty good evidence was where the birthers went wrong.
That said, I have an original birth certificate in the baby book my mother kept for me. There is also an official birth certificate that was obtained from the City of Holyoke in order to validate my age for entry into kindergarten. It looks entirely different, but is valid. Were I to request a birth certificate from the State of Massachusetts now, it would look a third way, yet be entirely valid. The “long-form” that Obama released is a document based on the information of the original birth certificate, but it is not the document that was signed when he was born. That is true for many of us. I don’t doubt that the information on his form is correct – really, I think his being born in Hawaii is the mostly likely scenario by far – but it still isn’t what he claims it is.
Maybe if obama didnt claim to be kenyan for that deal
maybe if obama actually didnt put up a bad photoshop job with the wrong serial number as a birth cert
maybe if the people involved didnt die
among a bunch of other things..
but note, the ONLY way for someone to believe the birth cert was a fake and obviously so (like grade school photoshop) is if they know how to make a fake themselves.
but the list of the fakery and the fact you could see the separate layers in the original and the history of how it was made, never registers
and now its moot…
so what if he blieves the prior president is not a citizen? its a non thing that the left is using to force belief or punishment if not…
Jimmy Carter saw a UFO…
One evening in 1969, two years before he became governor of Georgia, Carter was preparing to give a speech at a Lions Club meeting. At about 7:15 p.m (EST), one of the guests called his attention to a strange object that was visible about 30 degrees above the horizon to the west of where he was standing. Carter described the object as being bright white and as being about as bright as the moon. It was said to have appeared to have closed in on where he was standing but to have stopped beyond a stand of pine trees some distance from him. The object is then said to have changed color, first to blue, then to red, then back to white, before appearing to recede into the distance.
so which is worse?
believing a fake birth certificate that everyone beleives is valid is valid… or that it means he didnt have one? etc
the cert was faked and i have used photoshop for 20 years now from the earliest versions… its so FAKE..
but knowing and geting someone else who is ignorant of what makes a fake know, are two different things, and even more so when they dont want to believe what your showing
the numbers on the long-form birth certificates issued by Kapi’olani to the Nordyke twins are lower than the number given President Obama, even though the president’s birth certificate was accepted by the registrar general and stamped with a certificate number three days earlier.
Susan Nordyke, the first twin, was born at 2:12 p.m. Hawaii time on Aug. 5, 1961, and was given Certificate No. 151 — 61 — 10637, which was filed with the Hawaii registrar Aug. 11, 1961.
Gretchen Nordyke, the second twin, was born at 2:17 p.m. Hawaii time Aug. 5, 1961, and was given Certificate No. 151 — 61 — 10638, which was also filed with the Hawaii registrar Aug. 11, 1961.
Yet, according to the Certification of Live Birth released by FactCheck.org during the 2008 presidential campaign — and now according to the long-form, hospital-generated birth certificate the White House released yesterday — Barack Obama was given a higher certificate number than the Nordyke twins.
Barack Obama was given Certificate No. 151 — 1961 — 10641, even though he was born Aug. 4, 1961, the day before the Nordyke twins, and his birth was registered with the Hawaii Department of Health registrar three days earlier, on Aug. 8, 1961.
In 1961, the birth certificate numbers were not assigned by the hospitals. Instead, the numbers were stamped to the birth record by the Hawaii Department of Health at the main office in Honolulu.
how was it possible that the Nordyke twins had their birth certificates accepted by the registrar general in Hawaii three days later than the registrar general accepted Obama’s birth certificate, when their birth certificate numbers are lower than Obama’s number?
they did lots of checking of the birth certificates around that one too, and guess which one is the only oddball?
then the records were sealed… so was the book deal contract, so was the college transcrpts and whether he claimed to be kenyan to get federal aid… and on and on…
[and they dont reserve numbers and they dont skip them then fill them back in either… and lots of other oddities… like who constructed the border to go around and match the border when you can see the curve of the copy machine? why layers if its a scan? ]
tons and tons of stuff…
and no one wants to accept any of it
The reason it was/is still an issue is that trump plays that line to cater to folks who want to believe it is an issue…
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mvk-4T8enro
Said this many times before, trump knows how to skirt the line to cater to both sides of an issue – nobody truly knows what he thinks or believes, leaving him free to reverse himself later.
.
The MSM did get played. Fools.
.
And artfuldodger just won’t let go of the conspiracy theory. If it were all so easily true there are too many people involved to keep it all a secret for so long. But, of course, there is always an explanation for why that is so.
Just like how the cure for cancer is locked up somewhere by big pharma – all who know about it are quite happy to sit on it, letting family and friends to succumb.
Don’t know if I agree with it all, but here is an interesting article by Jonah Goldberg today on how obama has his own role in birtherism and in the rise of the anger that led to trump…
http://www.nationalreview.com/article/440220/donald-trumps-rise-got-help-obama-trolling-republicans?target=author&tid=897
Trum also was obsessed with it concerning Cruz, so it wasn’t just a thing against Hussein. In fact, it’s probably against everyone, Trum’s obsession with where you were born and to what class. It’s something nobles usually obsessed about, for good reasons and bad reasons.
And artfuldodger just won’t let go of the conspiracy theory.
Many would have said the same thing about HRC, how it was impossible for a conspiracy to occur. Yet she did sell US secrets for cash donations and other favors, and yet she is immune to consequence as a result of this conspiracy.
And no, people like B and others, didn’t know about it before hand.
They should have, since there’s more than 6 people in the email chain, but the general public don’t know what they don’t know.