Gunwalker
I haven’t dealt with the Gunwalker controversy up to this point, but I guess it’s time. Here’s a summary of the timeline, and here’s a discussion at Ace’s of the issues involved, and what might be behind the whole thing.
I’m with Andy at Ace’s:
The central question is, just what in the hell was the administration trying to accomplish here? Was this operation simply a colossally bad idea in pursuit of really stemming the (dramatically overstated) flow of guns to Mexico, or was it part of a larger [passage of gun control legislation] agenda?
Either way, it was a bad idea. But just how bad is as yet unknown.
You have to realize that although guns are strictly regulated in Mexico, most law abiding citizens with any wealth have them anyway for protection. The Narcos latest weapon of choice are Czech made grenades (not something you buy at a US gunshop).
Also at the border, I have never had my documents checked or my car searched going into Mexico, but always on the way into the USA (at such garden spots as Mexicali, Juarez, Reynosa, and Matamoros)
The whole issue of US legal guns going into Mexico was always done for PR purposes.
If the rednecks cling to their guns, why would they ship them off to Mexico? I have the feeling that the whole administration operates on the basis of the received wisdom from their druggy college years. BTW, did you read that Kevin Jennings is leaving? Another fine example of the superior wisdom of The Won!
“The central question is, just what in the hell was the administration trying to accomplish here? Was this operation simply a colossally bad idea in pursuit of really stemming the (dramatically overstated) flow of guns to Mexico, or was it part of a larger [passage of gun control legislation] agenda?”
A budding conspiracy theory? 😉
ATF(E) has conducted a series of blotched, stupid from the start, and sometimes sinister operations over the years. This “fast and furious” operation is just the latest travesty from an organization that should have been disbanded after Ruby Ridge. Let’s see what the congressional investigation uncovers. Is a fellow named Holder is involved in deadly fiasco?
When you eliminate the impossible, whatever remains, however improbable, must be the truth. h/t SH.
Either the ATF believes the claimed purpose–track guns to help bring down the cartels–or it doesn’t.
Considering how stupid the idea is, it’s impossible they can believe it. Whatever else remains–it’s a scam to put pressure on the gun lobby–must be the truth.
Considering that…
1. Holder and (most likely Obama) were involved, and they’re both for strict gun control.
2. The operation coincided with Obama & Mexico both crowing about the amount of guns purchased in US being used to commit crime in Mexico.
3. The solution proposed by Obama and Calderon was more gun control.
…it seems pretty obvious that Gunwalker was in part, or in its entirety, a means to enact greater gun control. That they did this knowing this operation would surely lead to more gun-related crime, including having these guns used against Border Patrol, is disturbing.
Soviet leaders try to make history to justify their actions in the minds of the people they screw with so as to negate a response directed towards them..
so, if you cant find discrimination, make up some science and that will allow you to discriminate, while the people then say, what was not moral, is now moral
its common among despotic type mentalities…
and sociopathic…
you orchestrate to manipulate…
its the game that is allowed when morals comes off the table or are denied. lying, disinformation, manupulation, etc are normal and good and waht one should do.
so from their framework, Lestate ce mois..
what they want, is the state
and so, the game is how to justify it among the little people..
the mentality is completely removed from the mentality of an employee… which is waht they are in our system before those innocents clubs cahnged them and created a layer of real protocols to sit inside the gutted constitution and rights..
when southerners werent racist enough (as a whole), they manufactured more of it… so of course their children then became what they thought existed…
when blacks and jewish people got along in brooklyn, they planted a bomb..
the point is that one has to facilitate
and when empiricism is off the table for equality, as it negates equality (its hegelian opposition), then honesty, facts, debate, etc are also off the table.
ie… feminism was doing a bigger thing than the innocents ever realized…
you negate empiricism for equality
you negate all that comes from it, everywhere
just as you break the rule of law in contracts
you break the rule of law everywhere
[they are about to get “equal pay for equal work” after they managed to have 247 laws requiring quotas, changed the burden of innocence, created a secret court system, and such against the non Volk]
of course.. given history, such conspiracy to create a situation to sell something to the public is common
in ignorance of history, and listening to the MSM (and fearing Vanderleun), there isnt any such thing as conspiracy, never happens, etc..
PC demands that we ignore all signs of conspiracy, either to be good pets… or because we fear Vanderleun zombies attacking… etc..
meanwhile…
outside of war, all nations that fell fell to conspiracy.
nuclear arms negates war..
that logically leaves only two options
give up… and
switch to conspiracy, manipulation, lies, etc
since they never give up (which is why genocide is historically common), the latter is the game
and so, the job of the people was to ferrit the crap out, keep empiricism, honor, morals, etc.
without them, we are BLIND to sociopathic rule and manipulation…
imagine a state run by a collection of colluding sub clinical sociopaths…
and suddenly all that happens and has such facts to it, snaps into perspective and makes sense.
cargo cult.. manipulation over debate… fakery and fluff over substance… etc..
its the only way to reconcile a great leader who murders millions of his own, inhumanely (rather than humanely), really really trying to do the best for the people (of whom so many they murdered)?
so why would people who have declared in hints and such to the others on their team they have not connected with… that they are of that ilk, like those ideas, and so on…
be what they arent other than for the con?
Neo-
“Fast and Furious” aka “Gunwalker” was much more, much worse, than a bad idea.
It was government(ATF/DOJ)-directed and sanctioned violation of its own laws and resisting the remonstrations of ATF agents and the legitimate gun dealers who sought to adhere to the law. It goes to the highest levels in DOJ.
This is the Dept. of JUSTICE at issue here. The primary law enforcement arm of our Federal government.
The thesis provided as rationale is preposterous: ATF was going to trace these guns to crimes-murders-committed in Mexico . After those crimes were committed. For the purpose of showing the guns came from AZ gun dealers.
This is about much more than a “bad idea”. It is the essence of our Leftist Progressive Liberal Democrat (choose one or more!) ends justifying the means. It should be very frightening to all Americans. Some of us have known about this for months, but the news was stifled until Issa held his hearing.
Another example of murder by the law you have not heard of: Google Jose Guerena. Happened weeks ago.
This is yet another story that we can thank the blogosphere for pushing and keeping alive. I, too, first heard of it months ago.
While I’m fond of the saying, “Never attribute to malice that which can be explained by incompetence”, I think we need to make an exception when a government is controlled by doctrinaire leftists. Malice and lust for power are the Occam’s Razor explanations in such cases. I don’t see how this can be explained by anything other than an attempt to impose ever more intrusive gun laws. As Don Carlos said, “the end justifies the means” with this crowd.
For the many people who have never fired a gun and have no intention of owning one: This does concern you. You may not have a gun, but chances are that you’re safer because some of your neighbors do. (Of course, that depends on what kind of people your neighbors are.) But assuming that your neighbors are in general peaceful, law-abiding people, you’re better off with them owning guns. Criminals casing your neighborhood have no idea who is armed and who is not, which tends to moderate their behavior. Crime is almost always worse in areas that have strict gun laws which make it difficult for ordinary people to legally own guns.
But more than that, the Second Amendment has nothing to do with crime prevention or hunting. The Founders knew that an armed citizenry is the last line of defense against a tyrannical government. A government of power-crazed tyrants who succeed in disarming their citizens has free rein to do literally anything to them. Anything.
this forum has a rather good ongoing discussion on this topic:
http://www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=1&f=5&t=1145029
Libby says, “That they did this knowing this operation would surely lead to more gun-related crime, including having these guns used against Border Patrol, is disturbing.”
If true, all involved were an accomplice to murder. That’s more than disturbing.
rickl says,
“The Founders knew that an armed citizenry is the last line of defense against a tyrannical government. A government of power-crazed tyrants who succeed in disarming their citizens has free rein to do literally anything to them. Anything.”
All enemies, foreign and domestic.
BTW, write your representative and senators and tell them you demand a thorough investigation. Then write BHO and tell him you expect full cooperation and disclosure from the DOJ. Send the message via USPS, e-mail, and telephone. Keep bombarding them. Let them know you are watching. I’m glad I can say one of my senators, Grassley, is calling for an independent investigation. (Calling Ken Starr, calling Ken Starr.)
Anyone with eyes can see Obama Admin officials created deaths as leverage for expanding gun control. W/o deaths, Obama Admin officials had no leverage.
Giant scandal. Make Believe Media semi-blackout. Left blogs lie, obscure, ink up the water. Right blogs, talk radio, and Fox News drive the story.
???
What gunwalker scandal???
I am ashamed to say that I have not heard of this. I basically follow CNN and just checked their website, but have not found anything either on their splash page or in doing search for the term.
I have been busy the last two days and have not seen the news, but …
Thanks for letting me know.
In the case of Guerena, I cant imagine the noise of 71 shots (!!!) being fired down a 36 – 42″ wide hallway in a home. Unless the home was as big that belonging to Bill Gates, or was the Biltore Estate outside Asheville, the only reason I can think of to make the emergency med crew wait an hour before being allowed in to treat him, is to make sure he was dead first. Of course, I didn’t need to SAY the obvious, did I?
Somewhere, Janet Reno must be wearing a huge shit-eating grin 😀
Its making laws subordinate to protocols and committee (soviet) rules
soviet [ˈsəʊvɪət ˈsɒv-]
n
1. (Government, Politics & Diplomacy) (in the former Soviet Union) an elected government council at the local, regional, and national levels, which culminated in the Supreme Soviet
2. (Historical Terms) (in prerevolutionary Russia) a local revolutionary council
power is delegated to councils that then make up protocols to be followed, even if they are unconstitutional.
as i said, the definition of the word soviet tells you a whole lot as to the organizational structure of the system, a system of interlocking administrative councils with delegated powers.
Using that definition, anyone see anything like that?
is it any wonder that the first academically designed administrative state would be a network of councils with autonomy powers?
its a great system, in that every part of the system, is like a lizards tail. the delegation of powers means that the whole can never be responsible no matter what it does. if something turns out bad, then they sacrifice the local power.. if it turns out good, they pretend that they caused it.
so why did the ATF do this?
the local powers overstepped the boundaries of the social structure enough to cause problems…
so they are going to be sacrificed for the body politic..
while the ones making policy rules for lower councils, go free of blame…
its one of the reasons why the old system made delegation of powers unconstitutional… in that way, the whole and the individuals responsible can be held accountable. this new method that confuses you, and that people make up answers for (as they have never seen such operate), has an infinite number of sacrificial lambs to place. and as such, each is a social experiment… they act, does the body react… if it does too much, the mosquito is squatted, the action is noted, and then its tried again with a new mosquito..
eventually, the goal is attained right under the peoples noses while they watch… (and beat up those who try to reveal it).
Time to give up relying on the Commie News Network as your information ‘source’, don’t you think?
There’s no more fertile soil for totalitarianism than an uninformed electorate, whether being ‘uninformed’ is a result of the media lying by commission or omission.