Meditation on a bumper sticker
And, speaking of friends—
Here’s a bumper sticker seen yesterday on a parked car in my very liberal town:
Someone’s idea, no doubt, of humor, based on the slogan “Friends don’t let friends drive drunk.”
But it doesn’t seem all that funny to me, not by a longshot. Although it’s ostensibly being said tongue-in-cheek, there’s a certain hardnosed sentiment behind it, one I’ve encountered way too many times. It’s a sentiment that–although espoused by a person who no doubt would identify him/herself as a liberal–embodies the opposite of traditional liberal thought.
What an interesting idea of friendship, that it must march in lockstep, belief matching belief. What an interesting idea of Republicanism; that it’s something pernicious and dangerous, something from which friends must be protected. What an interesting idea of voting; that it’s something you “let” or “don’t let” someone do.
Yes, I know: lighten up, neo, it’s just a joke. But jokes take certain forms for certain reasons; underneath, they express serious ideas that drive people. What is this particular idea? At heart, it’s one of thought control, intolerance, and demonizing of the opposition.
And now–out I go to be with some friends. And I think I’ll “let” them vote however they please.
“You’re mistaken. It happens quite frequently over here.”
Just goes to show you how “nuanced and perceptive” the Euros really are, not to be able to tell a Canadian from an American…
…but what I meant was, none of us here at Neo’s would ever mistake you for an American.
As I blogged the other day in my post A Toxic mix of malcontents:
You’d be upset, too, had you awaken from dreams of glory and omnipotence only to find yourself on the wrong side of history. As Victor Davis Hanson wrote two years back re our own “cynical American reporters and played-out professors who laugh at the idea of civilization”:
There is a great divide unfolding between the engine of history and the dumbfounded spectators who are apparently furious at what is going on before their eyes.
Neo, if it makes you feel any better, I have seen a T-shirt with the same sentiment, except in place of “Republican” it said “Democrat.” That was probably a good 10 years ago, however. At the time, it struck me as being really funny, but also, at the time, political hysteria had not yet reached the current level.
I think the difficulty we face today is that the seething anti-Bush hatred coming from the left causes all attempts at humor to fall flat. Perhaps we suspect that these things aren’t really jokes at all, but that the bearer of the bumper sticker would really like to “take away your keys” if you don’t have the correct opinion.
I’m always amused when I happen to get behind someone driving a rustbucket– its always a rustbucket–that’s plastered with way too many bumperstickers; the one time I put one sticker on my bumper was the my last, since these damn stickers are so hard to completely remove-listen to the voice of experience. Maybe 80-90% of the time the bumperstickers have a lefty theme–“Save the Whales, A Woman’s Right To Choose, Bushitler, Give Peace A Chance” or the bumpersticker you are talking about. The cars that are a couple of steps lower than a rustbucket are the ones I see that are usually plastered with Christian religious bumper stickers with additional writing on the sides and windows of the car plus a large plackard affixed to the roof of the car.
Workingmen seem to like plastering their beat-up trucks with bumperstickers like “Keep Honking, I’m Reloading” and “Driver Keeps Only Three Clips in Car”,or a personal favorite, “If You Don’t Like The Way This Driver is Driving CALL 1-800 EAT….” a few have been obscene plays on words; I’ve suspected that “Larry the Cable Guy” might be behind a lot of them.
I’ve noticed, too, that for some people who drive very well-kept and usually expensive cars, the more colored pseudo-ribbons they stick on their car the more, what, concerned?,compassionate?, righteous?, superior?, right-thinking they think they are? Much has been written about the car giving people inside it a feeling of power and isolation from their actions–thus road rage. Could it be that people who would not shout these slogans in public feel that putting them on their bumper somehow insulates them from the possible negative reations to the slogans they choose?
The bumper sticker that almost caused me to have an accident was one that read, “Jesus Is Coming and Boy, Is He Pissed.”
Neo, don’t lighten up. As usual you are correct. It’s one thing to slather the rustbucket with bumper stickers that are clever or straightforward, and another to advertise oneself as an overvbearing blowhard, as does the owner of the featured bumper sticker.
Snowonpine, I’m behind those stickers you identified, not Larry the Cable Guy. He may have something to do with it since my daughter got me Larry the Cable Guy pajamas for father’s day. Buahahahaha!
Yup, the bumper stickers are out there — and I’ve worried from time to time that my sense of humor was slipping. It’s good to know that I’m not the only one.
One that did make me laugh, along the same lines as the one Neo found objectionable, was this one.
On the other hand, I still chuckle to myself a bit at the “Howard Dean” stickers and the “let’s not elect him in 2004 either” stickers. Perhaps it’s wrong of me, but I have difficulty taking such people seriously.
respectfully,
Gosh, my reaction is different, and perhaps that only reveals how pathetically low my expectations of open-mindedness are. I have friends who actually display that bumper sticker (the “friends don’t let friends vote republican” one) on their bedroom mirror (interesting placement)and when I saw it I actually found it reassuring. After all, the idea is that people who MIGHT consider voting Republican are still categorized as friends, and not to be cast into utter darkness.
neo-neocon,
I’m waiting to see you condemn the right-wing t-shirts at the following website, which seem to be inviting people to kill MSM journalists:
http://www.thoseshirts.com/rope.html
Yes, I know: “Lighten up, Nate, it’s just a joke.” But jokes take certain forms for certain reasons; underneath, they express serious ideas that drive people. What is this particular idea? At heart, it’s one of thought control, intolerance, and demonizing of the opposition.
Some of the political T-shirts and bumper stickers are cute – in the moment I see them and get a giggle or frown I get out of them. I think it’d be pretty dopey to wear a political slogan on a T-shirt and actually go outside with it on. As a Leftist, when I was much younger, I had many auto-adornments to shock and insult people like; a tampon that had been dipped in red paint hanging around my rear view mirror, a doll nailed to a piece of wood with a crude sign, “Baby on Board”, and the bumper sticker I made that read, “I’m the proud parent of a jr. member of the Islamic Resistance Front”. People driving behind you are just people trying to get some where — irritating them with nonsense is just childish.
Nate:
Neo can condemn, or fail to condemn, anything she likes. Please don’t try to put words in someone else’s mouth; it’s not polite.
There have indeed been tasteless posters, bumper stickers, and so on, on both sides of the aisle. That which offends me might get a belly laugh from you, and vice versa, even if we’re of the same political persuasion. One man’s meat is another man’s person, and so on.
Michelle Malkin pointed out, at the height of the 2004 campaign, the sorts of merchandise available on the left side of the aisle; some of it was pretty disgusting. Personally, I find that much more objectionable than the “rope — journalist — some assembly required” business… but again, as I say, your mileage may vary.
respectfully,
I find a lot of this stuff pretty funny, on both sides. However, I live in a town where the the flag I flew just after 9/11 was desecrated and my car keyed with a vile suggestion. So, while I don’t keep my views any secret, I won’t give anonymous cowards any opportunity nor will I wear clothing that might inflame the marginal to act out.
It also sounds like like Nate’s hyperventilation is a little forced; obligatory comments thread theatre.
I don’t know… I’ve always felt that, if someone’s political philosophy’s short enough to fit on a bumper sticker and still be legible from a safe distance, then that someone’s not thinking through their stance very well.
This applies to sentiments from both the left and the right. Nate, your point is legitimate, but realize that Neo’s simply pointing out the example she’s personally seen and riffing on that. It’s not like she’s saying “Liberal bumper stickers with pithy slogans are wrong, Conservative t-shirts with pithy statements are right”, so it’s not really a sin of omission as much as it’s simply a discussion of something personally experienced. Was she obligated to look up ugly examples from the political right? Since this is an opinion blog, I’d say “no”. She’s not trying to be balanced, she’s merely expanding on a criticism she’s discussed before, which was the issue of groupthink among her liberal friends. The lack of any similar critique regarding equally hollow and unthinking statements from the right isn’t necessarily a sign of hypocrisy. It’s merely that she chose to discuss an example of that from the left, that’s all.
What an interesting idea of friendship, that it must march in lockstep, belief matching belief.
My best friend has succumbed to believing in the 9/11 conspiracy theories. Loose Change is his gospel. Yesterday, he informed that Barbara Bush’s mother, Pauline Robinson Pierce, had an affair with the devil-worshiping cult-figure Aleister Crowley right about the time Barbara was conceived. The hint of a demon seed somehow explaining Bush’s evilness.
I can’t bear it, I’m fighting him all the way. I guess I do subscribe to the view that a friends don’t let friends believe in absurd conspiracy theories. I so desperately want to walk him back.
My favourite bumpersticker of all time –
God made a few people perfect.
The rest are all right handed
prob, Three points, top of the key.
Years ago A Planned Parenthood chapter put out a bumper sticker that they were forced by the national organization to recall. It said:
Support Planned Parenthood
Don’t Litter
don’t litter — that’s funny!
Of course, another difference between the one Nate points out and Neo’s is popularity. That’s the first time I’ve seen the shirt or it applied to jounralist (usually applied to some sort of criminal). The voting sticker is quite common. I run in some VERY right wing circles and – to a person – they would all cringe at that shirt. I bet Neo agrees with what you say about that shirt (I know I do, and I am right wing). I bet I could find some equally offensive shirts on the left and it would prove … nothing.
There are examples on the right he could have chosen that made sense, yet choose to throw a straw man into the fray for shock value.
Though, I tend to find the sticker in question more funny than anything. It’s like the darwin fish with feet – I’m a devout christian yet I have a few of them stuck around the house (vehicle is too expensive to stick stuff on – I do have an NRA and Linux sticker taped to the inside of the back window though). It’s hard to tell if someone just means it as funny or not, in todays political climate we tend to think not.
I use to find these bumper stickers amusing when I lived in a conservative town. Something about being a loud mouth contrarian. Now that I live in a liberal town they just bore me to tears. I want to say alright already, you don’t have to show off your liberal credentials around here– preaching to the choir. The more I think about it, bumper stickers, right or left, just feel like immature responses to serious issues.
snowonpine..a popular bumper sticker around here is “Who would Jesus bomb?” It is usually seen on large, expensive vehicles. The drivers never seem to think that while Jesus might never have bombed anyone, it is also unlikely that he would have pursued a career path likely to have put in the upper-5% income catgory…
I’m with neo; the ideas behind it are not really funny. I bet the person who has it is not really lighthearted when it comes to disagreements.
I don’t like to wear my politics on my shirts or my car. End of story.
I think we’re taking this too seriously.
Put me in the ‘Lighten up’ camp!
I thought it was funny, but then I would think Paris going up in a nuclear fireball would be funny too, so you can’t take my sense of humour as an indication of anything.
What’s funny is I could actually hear the person’s thoughts as they put that slogan on their property. Their thinking that friends don’t let friends vote Republican being funny, is funny to me in a meta way.
Btw, taking things seriously and laughing about it isn’t mutually exclusive with someone like me.
One bumper sticker on a car means the driver has an opinion. More than one means the driver is a kook.
“Getting your news from the media is like getting your philosophy from bumper stickers.” paraphrased
Richard Nixon
Sort of along those lines, how about Mary of Peter, Paul and Mary telling the woman who donated bone marrow to her that she hoped she wasn’t a Republican? That’s not just putting the words on your car, that’s living them!
“I had to have a bone marrow transplant. It’s been a terrible year,” she told me. “I just learned the donor’s name is also Mary. She has two daughters. I have two daughters. See, just in case something goes wrong, you must wait a year before you can communicate with them.
…Mary laughed and added: “The problem was, I’m a lifelong Democrat. I was terrified that if she’s a Republican, I could go into the voting booth and, like Dr. Strangelove, my whole brain could change around. When we finally spoke I asked her about this. There was a pause then she said, ‘But I am a Republican.’ So I said, ‘Well, hell, I guess it’s about time the Republicans did something nice for me.’ ”
I bet the donor got a good chuckle out of that, and as everyone knows, having a good laugh from a shot taken at you is much better than receiving a thank you from a person grateful for your life-saving kindness. It made the surgical procedure where, under anesthesia, the doctors used special, hollow needles to withdraw the liquid marrow from the back of her pelvic bones all worthwhile.
http://www.florida-cracker.net/archives/003228.html
Some people are just parasites.
Apropos of my posting some weeks ago about entertainers not retiring when at the top of their form but holding on long after they should go, IMHO Peter, Paul & Mary fall into this category. They show up on the playbill at the local venue each year and by now they must be wheeling them in in wheelchairs and decanting them onto the stage so they can croak, “Puff the Magic Dragon.” The Beach Boys are another group I think is looong overdue for retirement. But, then, thats just my opinion.
The car in question was not being driven by a man with a projector in the front seat beside him and 3000 copies of “The Inconvenient Truth” in the boot of his car was it?
I used to have a bumper sticker that read “Republicans for J. S. Bach.” It made most people smile and didn’t offend anybody except perhaps people who really hate classical music, but if so, I never heard from them.
Apropos of cars being keyed as a result of a bumper sticker somebody didn’t like, I’ve seen a few Red Sox fans’ cars keyed by Yankees fans and vice versa. Sports loyalties can be as hazardous to your car’s health as political affiliation.
I like Michael’s idea, that one is usually OK, and more than one usually isn’t.
I saw “Republicans for Voldemort” recently, and it occured to me that “cutesyLib” doesn’t have a clue…
Hehe voldemort
We now have to identify ourselves?
Well, apparently not. Can anyone offer any clarification on this new policy? I don’t understand.
tequilamockingbird
Okay, well, whatever. If I can post without identifying myself to some of the wierdos who hang out here, that’s cool.
Neo, I think you’re losing it. With the venomous hatred spouted by Coulter, Limbaugh, et al — and, to be fair, some equally indefensible wingnuts on the opposite side — that mildly humorous (taken at its best) bumper sticker is hardly worth your or anyone’s attention.
Give your head a shake. There are more important issues — like the 50 Iraqis murdered in Baghdad today. But look on the bright side — it’s a good thing the supply of potable water and electricity and the production of oil are nearly up to pre-invasion levels.
Too bad the reconstruction funds are going to expire at the end of 2006 — if not, pre-invasion levels (after the Gulf War I near-total destruction of Iraq’s infrastructure and ten years of murderous sanctions) might even be restored! What a triumph that would be!
On the other hand, look at the enormous success achieved in Afghanistan. After 9-11, with the cooperation of the world in its pocket, the U.S. went after Bin Laden, Mullah Omar, and the Taliban for — oh, six months at least! Then they abandoned the legitimacy of their “WOT” to invade Iraq instead, and now Bin Laden is — well, we don’t know; Mullah Omar is — well, we don’t know; and the Taliban are — well, they seem to be about where the Iraqi insurgents were when Cheney pronounced them to be in their last throes (in other words, in their first throes).
Bumper stickers poking mild fun at Republicans! The nerve! How about a constitutional amendment outlawing such unpatriotic cowardice?
Is tequila talking to himself again? How many times do I have to beat tequila in argumentation anyways before he wises up? Oh wait, Ymar did that, nvm.
Is that what passes for debate here these days?
I believe the saying on that sticker had its origin on a Limbaugh spot. He spoofed an obviously drunk Ted Kennedy blathering away, with the tag line “Friends Don’t Let Friends Vote Democrat.” This would have been at least ten years ago. I recall being mildly amused, but not moved to get one for my own car.
When I saw it again with the ideology switched, I sighed, not for disagreement, but because I prefer people to write their own material.
tequila’s in for a rude shock when he starts to do his thing isn’t he? As I recall it takes him a few comments to work up a froth. Does anybody want to clue him in or shall we just wait for his head to drop into the basket too?
“With the venomous hatred spouted by Coulter, Limbaugh, et al –”
I’ll give you Coulter — she gets nasty — but Rush? I listen to Rush several times a week and he is unfailingly polite. I’d like to hear chapter and verse on this, please.
When younger, I thought the essence of humor was a bumper sticker which read: “More people have been killed in Ted Kennedy’s car than in nuclear power plants”. Now, it’s not so funny. Things change, and my attitude is that politics is (or should be) much more serious than most believe. If we don’t take politics seriously, we get Randy Cunningham, Alcie Hastings, Tom DeLay, Nancy Pelosi and Harry Reid. The times call for statesmen (and women) with substance, not greedy leeches and bubble-headed power freaks.
I’m certain I’m taking politics WAY too seriously. But, on the other hand, I see Iran getting nukes, and then some terrorists, and then Tel Aviv becoming a mushroom cloud.
It’s almost like watching the train hurtling at the broken and already collapsing bridge. Can’t superman, or superblogger, stop the train, or fix the bridge, before it’s too late?
When Harry Potter 5 came out, I wrote a blog post: Islamofascists are Deatheaters. In fact, the HP books are good vs evil, and the cost of fighting evil — as well as the cost of NOT fighting. And, in HP 4 & HP 5, the much higher cost of fighting when the media is against fighting.
The media today is helping recruit terrorists who kill US soldiers and Iraqi civilians — journalists, by their actions, are guilty. Why is there no punishment? I wish the families of more Iraqis and US soldiers would sue the NYT for their support of murder. I’ve also called for a boycott of those who advertise in the NYT.
I think hanging them is excessive, but no punishment is also unjust, their support of evil will only be encouraged. And, so far, it IS being encouraged.
But, it does depend on who is “evil” — Pres. Bush, who brought elections to qfghanistan and Iraq, whose imperfect soldier have acted mostly magnificently, but some poorly, and some of those have been punished. Or is it the Islamofascists, who are masked, hidden, and will cut off the heads, w/o trial, of those who disagree? The Bush-haters think Bush is evil, is Voldemort — so, logically, they support the Islamists, the head slicers (as I called Highlander). But I don’t believe the anti-Bush, anti-war people are honest to themselves about what alternative they actually support. They don’t want to pay the costs of doing what Bush says, but don’t think of the costs of the alternative.
Just as the anti-war Vietnam folk didn’t honestly support N. Viet victory, and 600 000 murders (plus 1.5 mil. in Cambodia) — even though that was the result.
The reality denial will only get worse until the Vietnam policy options and alternatives are honestly discussed, and the anti-war folk accept their support for genocide, in practice.
Senescent wasp: I admit I’ve sometimes been worked up into a froth, but it takes more than you and your ilk to do it.
Have a nice day.
tequilamockingbird
If you can all get so het up over a bumper sticker, i will have to make sure i drop by when a serious issue is discussed.
tequila,
No one’s denying that there’s worthless venom coming from the right. I myself cannot stand Coulter and wish she wasn’t a talking head myself. It’s a legitimate thing to point out that such folks and rhetoric exists, but Neo’s blog has always been observations about the issues she’s seen coming from the left. So the omission isn’t any great sin. It’s merely the topic she chooses to discuss.
Plus, she’s not overreating at all. Her line:
“And I think I’ll “let” them vote however they please”
… is to me a very moderate statement. She’s choosing to be different, and she’s choosing to not interfere with her friends’ freedom. So don’t you think your last line about constitutional amendments is a bit over the top? Yes, I understand it’s hyperbole, but Neo talked about letting people choose their own path. Even rhetorically, I don’t see how someone could equate what she said and your statements “Neo, I think you’re losing it”, and “Bumper stickers poking mild fun at Republicans! The nerve! How about a constitutional amendment outlawing such unpatriotic cowardice?”. To me, that’s an overreaction on your part. You seem to be assuming that Neo – and by extention of being her audience, the rest of us – is being oversenstive to the existence of the bumper sticker. That’s an exaggeration. Her reaction is bemusement, not indignation. So why overstate? Your making more out of her post that what’s there.
Also: Her topic was lockstep thinking, and the notion that someone’s political belief is something to be treated as a problem. Your post started out as a rebuttal but wandered far off topic. Iraq and Afghanistan topics have been discussed elsewhere; that’s not the topic here.
“…to some of the wierdos who hang out here…”.
Lastly: Could you please restrain from calling folks “weirdos”? That’s mild compared to language some before have used, but it’s still condescending. You’re obviously willing to engage and work out arguments, unlike other now banned commenters, so please, don’t stoop to such low tactics. It’s unbecoming, and there’s no need for it.
Late to the party, but I thought I’d share a couple of personal favorite bumperstickers:
“Nuke the Unborn Gay Baby Whales for Jesus”
and
“Are You Following Jesus This Close?”
Lucy: don’t bother.
Damn! I’m having trouble with this new system. Maybe it’ll work itself out with practice. I’ve tried to have two browser windows open so I can pop back and forth between the message I’m writing and the message I’m responding to, and I’ve failed, so here goes anyway.
ElMondoHummus, thank you for your civil and reasonable post.
My quarrel with neo on this particular issue is this: “At heart, it’s one of thought control, intolerance, and demonizing of the opposition”.
And that, I believe, is completely paranoid and way over the top. The bumper sticker is innocuous. Neo’s characterization of it is absurd. (I’m a neo fan, by the way, and though we don’t agree politically, she’s usually a good spokesperson for her side’s viewpoint. I think this is a case where she needs to be pulled up.)
True, I wandered off topic. Nevertheless, I’m not stuck in a straitjacket imposed by neo: If I want to express a point of view, I feel free to do so. And I think the basic argument underlying this entire debate is Bush’s disastrous Iraq war.
My reference to “some of the weirdos who hang out here”: Not all the people who “hang out here” are as obviously reasonable and sincere as you are. I’m not concerned about you; I’m concerned about some of the weirdos who hang out here. And I stand by that remark.
Tom Grey – Liberty Dad:
First of all, please don’t try to draw political parallels with the Harry Potter series. You leave yourself open to derision and ridicule.
Second, your media argument. I don’t know about you, but I believe in my bones that if the NYT had done anything slightly illegal, let alone treasonous, the White House would have had them perp-walked into jail an hour after publication. They didn’t because they couldn’t.
Thirdly, your Bush/Islamofascist argument is ludicrous. Believe me, I’m not an apologist for terrorists. In fact, I wish with every fiber of my being that Bush had devoted three times, five times, ten times — whatever it took to run those rat bastards down in Afghanistan and exterminate them like the vermin they are. Being weak, inexperienced, and totally unqualified for the job, he allowed himself to be manipulated by the strong, charismatic neocons surrounding him into pursuing their political objectives and invading Iraq.
Please give this some thought. It should become obvious that hatred of and disgust for terrorists does not mean that a loyal and sincere American has to support Bush’s disastrous foreign policy.
Don’t get me wrong: I’m not a loyal and sincere American. I’m a Canadian expat working in Europe.
tequilamockingbird
Class factotum: Rush is unfailingly polite? If that’s true, then Fox News is fair and balanced.
I’m thrilled to read that you think Democrats are “hard nosed.” So much better than being regarded as wishy-washy, wouldn’t you say?
Yeah, Hattie. Hooray for hard-nosed Democrats! I just wish more of them would wipe the brown off their noses and condemn the Iraq war.
tequila:
There was never a chance you’d be mistaken for an American.
Stumbley:
You’re mistaken. It happens quite frequently over here.
Class factotum: Rush is unfailingly polite? If that’s true, then Fox News is fair and balanced.
That is true….
“Everyone knows the Clintons have a cat. Socks is the White House cat. But did you know there is a White House dog?” And he puts up a picture of Chelsea Clinton. Chelsea Clinton is 13 years old.
You and I define “unfailingly polite” in different ways.
Today I saw the one that, for sheer prancing pointlessness, is my favorite: “No More Victims Anywhere.” Say what you want, but at least that driver doesn’t labor under a tragic world-view.
tequilamockingbird, keep them in line. This is taking an idiotic bumper sticker way too seriously. I don’t think it’s funny either, but not because it’s scary, it’s just not funny.
Tequila,
You’re right — that shot at Chelsea was mean. Rush should not have done that and he owes Chelsea an apology.
But in the three or four years I have been listening to him, I have not heard him say anything else like that. He criticizes ideas, not people. He is polite to his callers, even when he disagrees with them. He does not make personal attacks. He sticks to the issue.
We all screw up sometime.
Stumbley:
” … none of us here at Neo’s would ever mistake you for an American”.
Why is that, Stumbley? Are my political views not held by any Americans?
class-factotum:
Thank you for that acknowledgement, qualified though it was. One thing about this site is that I have been held up and corrected quite a number of times over the past couple of years, and I have apologized for misstatements or stepping over the line quite a number of times. Practically no one has ever admitted a mistake or apologized to me, though it’s been warranted dozens of times.
Sorry, I can’t agree with you about Rush. I’m not a regular reader by any means, although one of my most-visited sites is the Drudge Report (and I read everything Pat Buchanan writes). I had a dim memory of the Chelsea thing, so I just typed in “Limbaugh Chelsea” and got all the references I needed. Everything Rush has said for the last 15 years or so is readily available. Investigating just a couple of hits made it obvious that I could come up with dozens of examples of “failing politeness”, and with some work I’m confident I could come up with hundreds.
Sorry, Rush ain’t Walter Cronkite.
(Well, I think we both know that; I was referring to politeness).
class-factotum:
“We all screw up sometime.”
Including me, and sometimes on this blog.
It is cause tequila doesn’t talk like an American Democrat or Leftist.
Interesting comment, Ymar. Care to elaborate?