Somewhat confusing messages from Judge Sullivan in the Flynn hearing
Judge Sullivan had a lot to say today in the Flynn sentencing hearing, but it’s not easy to sort out what it meant.
As an example of what I’m talking about, please read this post by Ace and compare it to this by Kemberlee Kaye at Legal Insurrection. The same facts but a different story is told by each.
In trying to sort out just how bad this was for Flynn, I’m going to fall back on a rule I apply to questions of SCOTUS justices during hearings: it’s very difficult to tell what a judge or justice is going to do from the things that judge says to lawyers and/or defendants. Reading the judicial tea leaves sounds easy but it often leads you down a false trail.
In the case of Judge Sullivan and Flynn, though, I think indications are that what’s happening is that Sullivan is puzzled as to why Flynn would plead guilty if he’s not guilty. That’s quite a contradiction. Here’s what I mean:
Judge Sullivan said he had some "concerns" based on Flynn's pre-sentencing filing. ”I cannot recall any incident in which the court has accepted a plea of guilty from someone who maintained he was not guilty and I don’t intend to start today.”
— Darren Samuelsohn (@dsamuelsohn) December 18, 2018
However, since Flynn is determined to plead guilty (why that is the case, we’re not sure, except he may want to get this over with rather than risk a trial), then Judge Sullivan may feel that he must penalize Flynn fairly harshly because he considers the crime of a public official lying to the FBI a serious one. That’s my takeaway from the proceedings so far.
See also this post at Powerline, which points out that Judge Sullivan has delayed the sentencing, in all probability to allow Flynn to offer more information on his dealings with Turkey (which I am pretty sure have nothing to do with Trump) and thus get himself more leniency. There is also the possibility that Trump will end up pardoning Flynn.
What I haver seen thus far is that the judge made those comments (which of course have the media enthralled) about treason when he thought Flynn had been working for Turkey while a Trump official. He then took a short recess and came back to court saying it was NOT an accusation but just a question . I think he checked the dates.
All retired military get these jobs for extra income. A friend of mine who was a retired Marine Corps fighter pilot spent some time in Saudi Arabia teaching them how to fly F 18s. The Saudis have been hiring retired State officials for years to keep influence. They know that State will treat them better as many count on Saudi jobs when they retire.
Rush Limbaugh was going on about the other issue, which is whether Sullivan wanted him to revoke his plea.
Of course the retired military have to have something to sell.
Good thing the judge caught his own mistake lest the public saw him as an incompetent partisan loser.
A surgeon friend of mine, many years ago, went to Saudi Arabia for a year to work in a hospital. He netted $250,000 and that was 40 years ago when that was real money.
They way I read it was that Flynn’s sentencing memo suggested he was entrapped. If he was entrapped, then he’s not guilty. Judge Sullivan took this seriously and demanded to see the 302s.
But the 302s showed the opposite. The FBI gave him multiple chances to correct the record, and on top of that, he lied to the VP and others. It also appeared the Mueller was going very soft on Flynn, giving him a pass on the Turkey lies. Flynn returns the favor with false suggestions of FBI wrongdoing…something Sullivan takes very seriously.
To Sullivan, Flynn is essentially a Tawana Brawley case…someone who misuses a legitimate civil rights issue for their own gain. With that he unloaded on Flynn.
“But the 302s showed the opposite. The FBI gave him multiple chances to correct the record, and on top of that, he lied to the VP and others. ”
what hogwash
Herr Müllers gestapo agents dont videotape their interrogations, but take notes and then “write up “their recollections” the way Eichmann wrote up his recollections at Wannsee. Makes it east for teutonic nazis like Herr Müller , doesn’t it? G-d blues the Russians for destroying Herr Müllers Reich.
“Judge Sullivan may feel that he must penalize Flynn fairly harshly because he considers the crime of a public official lying to the FBI a serious one. That’s my takeaway from the proceedings so far.” neo
Whereas the original 302 is ‘missing’? With the one provided having been created’ 7 MONTHS after the interview was conducted… plus having huge portions redacted… This smells to high heaven and the judge ignoring the FBI thumbing their nose at him speaks volumes about this judge’s lack of integrity.
Then accusing Flynn of treason? That reveals Sullivan’s mindset. That kind of egregious error brings into question implicit bias on this judge’s part.
But the 302s showed the opposite. The FBI gave him multiple chances to correct the record, and on top of that, he lied to the VP and others.
It’s nice to see Hillary voters can use the internet top spread their fantasies.
The “lie” to the VP was actually a true statement. The VP was responding to the lies published by WaPo from leaks by the FBI.
Much more important is the history between Flynn and McCabe.
I cannot speculate about Judge Sullivan’s intent with regards to his seemingly inconsistent comments. But when he says this:
“I cannot recall any incident in which the court has accepted a plea of guilty from someone who maintained he was not guilty and I don’t intend to start today.”
It really makes me wonder. That’s pretty much an Alford Plea, and they happen every day. That wasn’t their original intent (see North Carolina v. Alford) but that is the way many of them work in this day and age. And many judges are all too willing to accept the Alford Plea if the Defendant wants to just gets things settled without a trial, even if it is apparent that the Defendant truly believes themselves to be innocent of the charges.
The Judge offered Flynn several opportunities to recant his confession. I know that it sounds “crazy” but my feeling is that Muller, et al, told Flynn recant and your son is on the chopping block. Just good old Blackmail.
“crazy” but my feeling is that Muller, et al, told Flynn recant and your son is on the chopping block. Just good old Blackmail.
when dealing with nazis like Herr müller its not crazy
Well, that was disappointing. I try not to get my hopes up in these murky times, but I was encouraged by John Hinderaker yesterday:
I think there is a significant chance that Judge Sullivan may refuse to accept General Flynn’s guilty plea and instead issue an opinion blasting Bob Mueller for prosecutorial misconduct. If that happens, Mueller will ride off into the sunset in the ignominy he so richly deserves.
https://www.powerlineblog.com/archives/2018/12/will-the-mueller-switch-project-collapse.php
I do wonder how much horse-trading and wheeler-dealering, not to mention cloak-and-daggering goes on behind the scenes today.
If Flynn keeps is nose clean there is every reason to expect that Trump will pardon him.
That’s why Flynn is ‘laying down.’
The legal fees required on his part are crazy high, already.
Flynn is not FINANCIALLY in a position to go to trial… not really.
Trump should not have to pardon Flynn. The government’s case against Flynn is so corrupt that no objective judge can, in good conscience find him guilty. Clearly Sullivan realizes that. Flynn’s insistence on a guilty plea ties his hands. Sullivan is having trouble accepting the degree of depravity exhibited by Mueller in pursuit of a political agenda. Flynn’s defense lawyers are either incompetent, unlikely but possible or Flynn has reined them in, fearing reprisals by Mueller against Flynn’s son.
A good man and dedicated patriot… destroyed by traitors.
When I first read the judge’s response (or rather outburst), I was astounded.
It seems, after the dust has settled a bit, that the judge is either very, very confused…or he’s setting Mueller up for a bruising.
(Truth to tell, however, the first is on the bizarre end of the spectrum—given all the publicity that has been generated by this travesty of a case—and the latter tends towards the fantasy/wishful-thinking end…)
To be continued, no doubt….
Here’s a link to a NYTs roundup of the Flynn/Kislyak imbroglio.
https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2017/02/14/us/politics/flynn-call-russia-timeline.html?action=click&module=RelatedCoverage&pgtype=Article®ion=Footer
Flynn had a business which he began after retiring in 2014.
“Mr. Flynn opened the Flynn Intel Group in October 2014, two months after he was forced out as director of the Defense Intelligence Agency.”……………….”In the interview in October, Mr. Flynn offered only a vague description of the firm. He said he had clients in Japan and the Middle East and that he worked on cyber training, aviation operations and energy business.” ………. “Mr. Flynn, a retired Army lieutenant general, registered as a lobbyist last year but did not file papers with the Justice Department registering as a foreign agent, providing a fuller understanding of his role, until Tuesday. While he did not work directly for the Turkish government, the firm that hired him, Inovo, is owned by a Turkish-American businessman with links to leaders in Ankara and asked him to work on an issue important to the government.”
Read the whole thing here: https://www.nytimes.com/2017/03/10/us/politics/michael-flynn-turkey.html
Flynn was trying to make some money from his military experience. His firm was hired by Inovo to investigate Fethullah Gulen, a Turkish cleric who lives in Pennsylvania and was blamed by Erdogan for helping instigate a failed coup. That all happened before he was appointed to the Trump administration. He didn’t register as a foreign lobbyist because Inovo did not officially represent the Turkish government. But he later registered just to be legal. Something not unusual or unheard of in D.C.
His son was his chief of staff at Flynn Intel. So, he was put under Mueller’s microscope. “……, it could also be that Mueller’s focus on Flynn Jr. is an attempt to coerce his father’s cooperation in the investigation, legal experts have said. This possibility may be especially significant given that Flynn declined a new request on Tuesday to testify before the Senate Intelligence Committee.”
Read it all here: https://www.businessinsider.com/michael-flynn-jr-subject-trump-russia-investigation-2017-9
I looked these up to refresh my memory of what had gone down from December -January of 2016/17 and beyond.
That Mueller is controlling Flynn through threats to his son seems quite plausible. The man is ruined financially and is trying to limit the damage going forward.
Sullivan clearly erred on the treason comments- it is pretty clear after his retraction that he was confused about the dates Flynn worked as a lobbyist/investigator for the Turkish government.
However, his comment about not taking a false plea is more interesting. Now, this doesn’t appear to be a true Alford plea- Flynn appears to have asserted his innocence based on entrapment (a good argument can be made that is exactly what happened).
However, from the hearing today, I think Sullivan is trouble by more than just this issue- he is questioning Flynn taking this particular plea in order to skate on the FARA violations- a completely separate issue. Typically, in such an investigation, Flynn would have had to plead to one of the FARA charges, and then been given leniency for cooperation, and such a pleading would result in some prison time based on the sentencing guidelines. However, Flynn isn’t pleading to FARA violations, isn’t being indicted and tried on such violations, and will be a witness against the other individuals his cooperation has already caused to be indicted. I think this is what set the judge off today- he is being asked to accept a dodgy plea to lying to the FBI rather than accept a more proper plea on the FARA violations which are what Mueller has held over Flynn’s head all this time. The questioning about whether or not Flynn has immunity on the FARA charges goes directly to this issue.
In short, I don’t think Sullivan wants to accept the plea deal Flynn was offered, and kicked the can down the road for 3 months. He doesn’t think the plea deal serves justice properly- the plea isn’t correctly linked to the more serious legal problems Flynn is in, and it provides a sentence recommendation that doesn’t correctly link to the things Flynn is accused of in regards to FARA.
There were comments that Sullivan has it in for Flynn, but I don’t see that at this hearing. If he really had it in for Flynn, he would have accepted the plea and sent Flynn to prison for a year. He didn’t do that.
An interesting wrinkle
https://libertyunyielding.com/2018/12/18/judge-orders-original-flynn-302-made-public-in-redacted-version-as-usual-it-exposes-what-the-fbi-was-doing/
“Remember, those phone calls didn’t involve any Russians. They were solely between the American members of the Trump transition team. Presumably, they were under surveillance because of the FISA warrant obtained on Carter Page, which enabled the FBI to perform surveillance of the Trump team because of the “two-hop” rule – even though Page had nothing at all to do with the Trump transition.
Flynn had no obligation, and not even any reason, to speak to the FBI agents as if they must know he had spoken to the transition team seniors at particular times. He had no reason to think that consciousness of having done so would be a token of bona fides that they might be looking for. As far as Flynn knew, he was only answering questions about what he remembered regarding conversations with Russians, particularly Kislyak.
Moreover, as a senior team member himself, Flynn would think specifically in terms of not discussing the deliberations of seniors on the team. As far as he knew, the FBI interview was friendly, and was about counterintelligence questions – which meant it was not about deliberations within the Trump team. There was nothing the slightest bit unresponsive about Flynn’s omitting discussion of what Mike Pence or any other senior team official said to him, or vice versa.
Nothing in the 302 indicates that he was asked if he spoke to the senior members of the transition team, or if he got instructions from them, or on what dates such communications occurred.
If he had been asked that – well, I can’t answer for Flynn, but I would certainly have smelled a rat, if I were in his position. My going-in assumption would be that such communications were privileged, and I would want to consult with the president’s counsel before giving answers about it. In fact, I assume the FBI agents were well aware that would be the obvious reaction.
So what stands out to me like a throbbing sore thumb here is a set of passages in Mueller’s charging document: paragraphs 3.c, 3.e, and 3.h; and paragraph 4.b.
Those paragraphs, with their specificity, make it clear that the FBI had the Trump transition team under surveillance.
..
Others made the point on Monday that there’s nothing actionable to be made of anything Flynn said he couldn’t remember. With no underlying crime, it couldn’t be obstruction of justice for Flynn to have had flawed recollections, or even to have lied by omission. And Mueller alleges no underlying crime.
…
But the real “money” point exposed from Monday’s work is that Mueller couldn’t have made his entrapment case if he hadn’t known everything that was said to and by Flynn in communications with the Trump team. To make his case against Flynn, Mueller had to assemble a structured timeline that depended on the Trump team itself being under surveillance by the FBI.
And Mueller had what he needed for that.”
There were comments that Sullivan has it in for Flynn, but I don’t see that at this hearing. If he really had it in for Flynn, he would have accepted the plea and sent Flynn to prison for a year. He didn’t do that.
Fair enough but, if all the FARA violations were prosecuted, half of DC would be in court. I see no sign that Mueller is after the Podesta brothers, for example.
Examples of the double standards on FARA.
Plus there have been seven prosecutions since 1938 until now. Three convictions. In 80 years.
Flynn is obviously in a “can’t win” situation. If he recants his plea, then Mueller’s Marauders could take him to trial, or threaten to, and suck his finances completely dry; assuming there is anything left at this point.
It is painfully obvious that if the federal authorities get you in their sights you will be punished one way or another. It is also obvious that it doesn’t take any illegal action on an individual’s part to attract their notice. As with Flynn, working on the wrong side of the political divide is justification.
It will be interesting to see if Sullivan is sanctioned somehow for his tirade which, sadly, was based on his own ignorance of salient facts. Judges are accountable to someone, aren’t they?
Accusing Flynn of FARA violations is easily disproven. As Yancey points out, Inovo does not officially represent the Turkish gov. So legally, FARA laws don’t apply. Of course getting to that court ruling would be monetarily, equally ruinous.
Secondly, given Flynn’s outspoken views on the Muslim/Islamic threat, it’s ludicrous to imagine he’d assist Erdogan in any substantial way. Erdogan’s paranoid accusations against Gulen led to the Turks offering Flynn money to use his connections to uncovering any intel the US might have implicating Gulen. Flynn probably knew it would be a futile effort but taking Erdogan’s money through his “cutout” was no doubt appealing.
Mueller’s rumored threat of prosecuting Flynn’s son is likely based on a threat to charge Flynn’s son with FARA violations. Mueller knows that Flynn knows that regardless of how bogus the charges, legal bills would financially destroy Flynn’s son…
What an utter POS is Herr Mueller. He doesn’t care how many innocent lives he destroys, justifying it with the end sought; stopping Trump.