Back in 2017, the regime sent a bomber to attack an ncri conference in paris this was at the same time that john kerry was meeting with iranian officials

They have a tenuous relationship with the monarchist crew headed by pahlevi most recently in los angeles

The enemy of my enemy is not always a friend but sometimes there is a tactical understanding like zarquawi tramsiting to kurdistan on the way to the dulaimi heartland

After the fall of the taliban figures like seif al adel (who is currently operational chief for al queda)settled in iran, as prelude to the attack on the kingdom

He really came unarmed to this match didnt he

Those Iranian Shias funded Hamas – a branch of the Sunni Muslim Brotherhood – for decades. You don’t know jackshit, troll Cyrus.

Since I noticed that the aforementioned excerpt from the letter from Osama Bin Laden to “Brother Karim” in 2007 regarding the issues of diplomacy, threats, and aid to and from Iran was mangled due to the crudeness of copy/pasting from phone, I will take the liberty of re-linking and re-formatting the relevant part.

https://www.dni.gov/files/documents/ubl2016/english/Letter%20to%20Karim.pdf

Honorable brother Karim, may God protect him. Peace and mercy of God may be upon you. Hope you and all who are with you are in a
good cheer, and for God to bring us all together to achieve his
will on earth and to win the afterlife.

1- I received your honorable message that was ended abruptly
without an ending, signature, and date. I wonder what the cause
was for this error; but thank God for including the good news
and glad tidings. I ask God to grant us speedy victory and
empowerment.

2- I have a few remarks concerning the matter of your threats to
Iran, and I hope that you and your brothers will accommodate it:

A- You did not consult with us on that serious issue that
affects the general welfare of all of us. </iWe expected you would
consult with us for these important matters, for as you are
aware, Iran is our main artery for funds, personnel, and
communication, as well as the matter of hostages.

B- I don’t understand why you have announced your threats. You
could have executed without being threatening; for threats are a
tough test for your ability to deliver. And now, the passing of
the grace period without carrying out your threats effects the
believability of your words, and your threats will be
meaningless. I am not trying to provoke you to carry out your
threats. On the contrary, I am against being threatening,
period. However, I am discussing the matter of “threat
announcing” for it is politically a losing proposition for you.

G- Another matter that I need you to discuss with your brothers,
which is the information received indicating that some of the
individuals that you are depending on to carry out the threats
are not organized or infiltrated. So please re-evaluate the
matter.

D- The summary of my opinion on the subject is:

1- There is no need to fight with Iran, unless you are forced to
because of the great harm caused by them, and unless you are
able to inflect (ED: SIC) them with harm. Hence, if you are not in the
position to deliver either, then my advice is to refrain from
attacking them; and devote your total resource to the
fortification of the (ed: Muslim) nation, and the fight against the crusaders
and the apostates. It is also my opinion about the other fronts
such as Lebanon and the likes.

2- If you decide on confronting Iran and feel you are able to
hurt them, it is my opinion that you do not announce your
intentions and threats, instead deliver your strikes in silence,
leaving indications or announce that you are responsible for the
act, and to protect your reputation in case your plans were not
successful. Bear in mind that the negotiation with Iran is
easier if the incurred damages are great. This is my opinion and
God knows the correct course of action.

3- Another issue that is closely related to the previous one’ is
the taking of Iranian hostages for negotiation. I suggest
starting the negation on exchanging the person that I have asked
to receive the file on his statements, which I have not received
yet, or any other person, for our captives, specifically the
ones sentenced to death or to a long term incarceration in their
countries.

4- Regarding the issue of not attacking the dissenter by her
name; the issue is under discussion among the brethren and I,
and my position is the collective decision for the group and not
just my own. We associated the matter with receiving hostages
from them for it will give us great latitude in confronting
them. In general the discussion is still progressively ongoing.
The other issue is the attack on my brothers with Abu al-
((Yazid)), and with you. These statements represent and bind us.
Hence I was not tasked with it, but it is the opinion of the
brothers that I handle the matter indirectly observing the
developments. That was the collective opinion of your brothers,
and God knows what’s right.

This I think gives a good summary of the nature of the “Friendship” between the Wahhabi Sunni Fanatics in Al Qaeda and the Shiite Twelver Fanatics of the Iranian Regime. Not much in the way of friendship and punctuated by mutual suspicion and loathing and thus prone to periodic threats and attacks that could be reined in by both sides when they saw each other as being of use to their wider cause. In particular Osama is chewing out “Brother Karim” for openly threatening Iran at a time when Iran is a crucial artery for the Al Qaeda war efforts in Afghanistan and Iraq, and is opposed to fighting them at all at the given time, but that if such a thing is to be done it should be done without prior announcement, with great devastation, and for the purposes of taking hostages for negotiation, and above all that Karim is not to make idle public threats without following through.

This largely gels with what we have from other sources, including the Southern District Court of NYC.

https://web.archive.org/web/20150413223620/http://information.iran911case.com/Havlish_Findings_of_Fact_and_Conclusions_of_Law_Signed_12-22-11.pdf

I particularly point you to the section starting on Page 15 and going on down from the subheader “Bridging of the the Sunni-Shia Divide”, which all but directly anticipates your “Hurr durr Dey Must be Such Great Friends!” and skins it alive, pointing out that these scumbags may not like each other but they can be practical and ruthless enough to overlook that when it suits their interests at a given time, and also talks about the mechanisms of how this actually played a role in 9/11.

But what would OSAMA BIN LADEN, supreme leader of Al Qaeda, know about his organization’s alternating cooperation and hostility with Iran??

I will accept your apology when it is offered, but tell you not to test my time or patience with trolling or dishonest sophistry. If you are unwilling to do the research on the relevant matters or educate yourself on basics such as how and why Sunni terrorists and Shiite terrorists might stop killing each other and plan to kill others, not only can I not help you but frankly you probably should refrain from commenting on the topic until that changes.

I have great interest in things like the rise and fall of Nestorian Christianity in China and the Hexi Corridor, in Hui culture, and in the history of Kaifeng, but there was absolutely zero reason to bring up any of them here like you did.

There was absolutely no valid or justifiable reason for you to do so, and you used them as a dishonest, poorly informed appeal to contempt and appeal to ignorance serving to conflate fascinating but irrelevant topics with the well documented, painfully ugly history of Al Qaeda and the Islamic Republic of Iran’s frenemy relationship, something that helped kill dozens of thousands of people including hundreds upon hundreds of Americans, and which was found as such in that bastion of anti-Shiite, anti-Muslim, right-wing bigotry the Southern District Court of New York City.

So in any case, you had things the opposite way around. Had “Chnya” been guilty of a fraction of the things Iran’s dictatorship is in regards to 9/11, that would create an entirely justifiable reason for me to want to bomb them. Fortunately, of all of the CCP’s many crimes I have no reason to believe those are ones of them.

Now are you going to address the evidence? Or are you going to be a troll?

Turtler something tells me that should you suddenly develop an insatiable urge to bomb Chyna tomorrow, you’d be saying:

“Also a little bit of context since we now know beyond any possible doubt that China’s dictatorship played a significant role in helping AQ carry out the 9/11 attacks…”

Something tells me you have absolutely nothing to rebut this point of Fact with, which is why you have to corncob and obfuscate with this drivel that does nothing to address this FACT.

Are you in any way aware of what the Abbottabad documents say about the frenemy relationship between Al Qaeda and Iran and how this dovetailed into 9/11, as detailed in material seized from OBL’a compound in the eponymous locale when he was killed? If not, the. You are not qualified to speak on this matter.

If you have, that raises the question of why the devil you are not addressing these points of Fact and how and why they might push the Mayor of New York City at the time of 9/11 and who had to go through the fires of the aftermath might come to view MEK as the lesser evil for entirely justified reasons.

And if you are not for some reason aware; here is some of the baseline source material:

https://www.dni.gov/index.php/features/1532-bin-laden-bookshelf-features

And a convenient tool for searching:

https://pt.icct.nl/sites/default/files/2023-03/PT%20Vol%20XVII%2C%20I%20March%202023%20RN3%20ep_2.pdf

Some brief summaries of the matter:

https://2017-2021.state.gov/the-iran-al-qaida-axis/

https://ctc.westpoint.edu/marriage-of-convenience-the-evolution-of-iran-and-al-qaidas-tactical-cooperation/

And a particular choice excerpt from the archives:

https://www.dni.gov/files/documents/ubl2016/english/Letter%20to%20Karim.pdf

Note that while Osama never entirely rules out the possibility of strikes on Iran or forbids them altogether, he DOES clearly say he sees no need to fight them at the moment, that any hostage taking is to be done with great care in the lead up to negotiations, and that any attacks should be done unannounced. This is because, as OBL says:

2- I have a few remarks concerning the matter of your threats toIran, and I hope that you and your brothers will accommodate it:A- You did not consult with us on that serious issue thataffects the general welfare of all of us. We expected you wouldconsult with us for these important matters, for as you areaware, Iran is our main artery for funds, personnel, andcommunication, as well as the matter of hostages.B- I don’t understand why you have announced your threats. Youcould have executed without being threatening; for threats are atough test for your ability to deliver. And now, the passing ofthe grace period without carrying out your threats effects thebelievability of your words, and your threats will bemeaningless. I am not trying to provoke you to carry out yourthreats. On the contrary, I am against being threatening,period. However, I am discussing the matter of “threatannouncing” for it is politically a losing proposition for you.

There is more I can dig up and may yet do so if I feel inclined to bury your particular flavor of nonsense even deeper. But one example from the pen of OBL himself should be illustrative.

However, suffice it to say that I do not for a second think that as awful, evil, and thoroughly hostile as the Peoples’ Republic of Chyna is, that it had anything like the knowing, proximate, and with malice aforethought involvement in 9/11 that the Islamic Republic of Iran did, and frankly had the PRC been guilty of such involvement it would be a direct cause of me wishing to bomb it, and mentioning of such evidence would be more than justified as context, wall of text or no.

And while some would point out that the Iranian Regime and Al Qaeda were hardly bosom buddies given their great suspicion and mutual hatred of each others existence and that they were – to quote a certain headline – “More enemies than Allies”, that does nothing to change the fact that they were as willing to conspire together to kill us as they were to kill each other, and it does nothing to alleviate the Mullahcracy’s guilt. Which is why the verdict finding Iran had partial responsibility for 9/11 was found in a court of law under Obama’s Presidency, and while Obama rejected enforcement of that judgment it has never been overturned.

https://www.investigativeproject.org/3356/court-finds-iran-aided-9-11-attacks

Perhaps you could produce a wall of text proving either this, that, or the other?

Ask and ye shall receive, This time.

But continue to waste my time and fail to use the resources at your disposal and I will start becoming significantly less accommodating and significantly more inclined to conclude you are a troll. Consider this a friendly warning.

Those Iranian Shias being such good friends of Wahabbi fanatics, you know.

You mean like said Wahhabi fanatics during the midpoint of the Iraq War found succor in the territory of bot Shiite Iran and the “secular” Alawite Baathist dominated Iranian ally of Syria? Yes. Though “friends” had remarkably little to do with any of it, as shown by things like Iranian spec ops attacking Taliban held territory in Afghanistan in 2001 and how the same Al Qaeda in Iraq that was getting more funding and support from the Iran-Syria “Axis of Resistance” than it was from its own mother organization chafed when Iran arrested several AQ envoys – including relatives of OBL- in 2003-6 and ultimately turned in their former Shiite and Alawite “friends” in the Arab Spring, becoming the core of ISIS.

Alliances founded on mutual hatred and convenience are fragile and fickle things, but they can be no less potent or important for all that. Osama did not detail a relationship of love or trust with Iran. He did detail a relationship of convenience and mutual opportunism in jihad against the US in the lead up to 9/11 and many times before and after it, which was selectively betrayed by both sides at various times.

Midwit fools and liars like ignoring this fact and several others, acting as if the sectarian, ideological, or ethnic divides between the mostly Arab Sunni Wahhabis in AQ and the mixed Shiite and Alawite Persian dominated “Resistance Bloc” were insurmountable before wagging fingers at those of us with a better grasp of history and the evidence before laughing at why we could believe such a thing.

Without ever addressing the primary source documents or basic facts like how the Sudanese Madhists briefly made common cause with Christian Ethiopia before betraying and invading it or why Catholic France hosted an Pittman fleet at Marseilles and funded Protestants fighting the Habsburgs. And both probably featured far greater ideological and theological distance than the Sunni Wahhabi AQ has from the Shiite Twelvers in control of Iran. Not that I expect you to know that.

Maybe you could throw the Hui, the Nestorian Stele of Xi’an and the Jews of Kaifeng while you’re at it.

I can happily discuss all of those things, but none of those matter an absolute fuck compared to Osama Bin Laden identifying Iran as their main thoroughfare for resources and reinforcements during the height of the Iraq War surge or the Iranians purposefully helping AQ leadership and other operatives – including may 9/11 hijackers – travel internationally undetected by refusing to detain or even document them unless it served the Mullahcracy’s interests to do so.

And for the record I spoke about the decline of the Churches or the East during the High Medieval period last month and the Kaifeng Jews last week. Test me at your peril.

Where *do* you get off?

With the history as documented, something you seem to show absolutely minimal understanding of.

If you are actually interested in discussing the matter of Iranian terrorist groups and history and their relevance to New York City and evaluations of Rudy Giuliani honestly and in good faith, then we can proceed with evidence.

Otherwise you are simply wasting the time and effort of anybody bothering to discuss the matter with you and seem to be doing nothing more than petty sniping at a man who deserves far better than your drive bys.

“Also a little bit of context since we now know beyond any possible doubt that China’s dictatorship played a significant role in helping AQ carry out the 9/11 attacks…”

Perhaps you could produce a wall of text proving either this, that, or the other?

Those Iranian Shias being such good friends of Wahabbi fanatics, you know. Maybe you could throw the Hui, the Nestorian Stele of Xi’an and the Jews of Kaifeng while you’re at it.

Where *do* you get off?

update on Giulianis’ condition

I not only remember his fantastic leadership on 9-11; but, even before that he did so much to clean up the city. I was in disbelief when I was in the city on Halloween and the stores along there were handing out candy/treats to kids for trick or treating. How could anyone believe the turn around from sleazy-never-to-be-walked-through area to family friendly tourist spot? I was there because a friend from out of town wanted to go and I said no, it wasn’t safe. My friend convinced me otherwise.

I hope he recovers well!

Perhaps it is disgusting, but it is still vastly less disgusting than what every single person to hold the office of Mayor of NYC has done since. And as far as MEK goes, it has given me little reason to love it, but all told it is still less despicable than a host of groups we have given support to and I’d much rather the Iranian terror group give money to a US pol than the other way around. Especially since even at their worst MEK were a Marxist terror org wanting to instal a kind of NatBol Iranian “Proletarian Dictatorship” in Iran. The current management of the Iranian goverment wants to end the world as it exists through apocalyptic strife – preferably nuclear – to bring about the rise of the Mahdi, and which probably is responsible for the deaths of more Iranians and Americans every year than MEK has in its entire history.

Also a little bit of context since we now know beyond any possible doubt that Iran’s dictatorship played a significant role in helping AQ carry out the 9/11 attacks that caused Rudy such enduring health issues and so many funeral appearances. So I imagine that would push the envelope a bit.

In any case, sometimes the enemy of my enemy is my friend or at least our SOB.

@ Davemay – and thank you for your tribute to Rudy. That he was so connected to the other heroes of 9/11 is not a surprise, although I don’t remember reading about him attending their funerals. I suspect that didn’t make it into the news outside of the City.

@ miguel > “This kind of plague on his hometown must agrieve the heart”
Nicely phrased.