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	Comments on: Open thread 11/26/2025	</title>
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	<link>https://thenewneo.com/2025/11/26/open-thread-11-26-2025/</link>
	<description>A blog about political change, among other things</description>
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		<title>
		By: R2L		</title>
		<link>https://thenewneo.com/2025/11/26/open-thread-11-26-2025/#comment-2832106</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[R2L]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 29 Nov 2025 03:23:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://thenewneo.com/?p=145791#comment-2832106</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[But AesopFan, this is America, and we always strive to be greater, so next year you might need to find a 10 foot tall inflatable turkey, right ?  :-) 
[and thank you for all of the outstanding research and commentary that you provide here.]]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>But AesopFan, this is America, and we always strive to be greater, so next year you might need to find a 10 foot tall inflatable turkey, right ?  🙂<br />
[and thank you for all of the outstanding research and commentary that you provide here.]</p>
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		<title>
		By: AesopFan		</title>
		<link>https://thenewneo.com/2025/11/26/open-thread-11-26-2025/#comment-2832020</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[AesopFan]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 28 Nov 2025 06:09:10 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://thenewneo.com/?p=145791#comment-2832020</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[David Foster&#039;s post at CB was followed by two comments with links to articles on gratitude.

Those were very good, so I am bumping them:
https://x.com/robkhenderson/status/1488642830876749825
&quot;Surprisingly, living in a culture with higher levels of life expectancy, education, average national income was associated with lower gratitude...people...might take the plentiful educational opportunities and long-life expectancy for granted&quot;
https://psyarxiv.com/6ktmu/

The study he cites at that link is here, if the above doesn&#039;t work:
https://osf.io/preprints/psyarxiv/6ktmu_v1 

Even better is this post from an Aussie immigrant (legal, I&#039;m sure) on how the view of Americans in Australia, and other nations, is so badly skewed: no one appreciates our native-born trait of helpfulness, and thankfulness.

https://www.zerohedge.com/geopolitical/day-i-understood-american-spirit
&lt;blockquote&gt;Authored by Kay Rubacek via The Epoch Times,

I didn’t grow up with Thanksgiving. I grew up in Australia, a place that prides itself on being relaxed and irreverent, where national icons range from crocodile wrestlers to movie stars with casual, sun-soaked charisma.

Our culture is fun-loving and independent, summed up in the phrase, “she’ll be right, mate.” It means: don’t fuss, don’t interfere, everyone handles their own problems. It isn’t unkindness; it’s distance. You stay in your lane; others stay in theirs.

Thanksgiving wasn’t part of my world. What I grew up with was a steady, unquestioned criticism of Americans. In art school in Sydney, we were encouraged to enjoy American movies and brands while criticizing Americans as arrogant or self-important. &lt;b&gt;It was such an accepted narrative that no one seemed to ask where it had even come from.&lt;/b&gt;

In 2010, when I told friends I was moving my young family to the United States, more than one warned me, almost nervously, “Be careful, you might become like an American.”

I didn’t know what they meant. Why would becoming like an American be a threat?

It wasn’t until years later—after researching the Chinese Communist Party’s global soft-power campaigns and the broader network of anti-American messaging pushed by modern ideological actors—&lt;b&gt;that I understood how much of the world’s casual disdain for Americans had been cultivated.&lt;/b&gt;

If you can weaken the idea of America, you weaken the country. And much of the world has absorbed that message without ever meeting the people it is supposed to condemn.

But everything I had been taught about Americans dissolved as soon as I arrived in New York.

[AE: sadly, she might not say the same thing if moving there today!]

My first weeks in Manhattan were exhilaratingly loud, fast, and disorienting, as one would expect. I carried a huge paper map (this was before smartphones with a built-in GPS were universal), turning it around helplessly at street corners. And every single time, someone stopped. “Where do you need to go?” They weren’t looking for conversation. They were already halfway down the block before I finished saying thank you. But they couldn’t walk past someone who clearly needed help
....

&lt;b&gt;What surprised me most, though, was how naturally Americans practice gratitude.&lt;/b&gt; I didn’t understand its cultural weight until Thanksgiving.

Growing up, Christmas was my favorite holiday, but after coming to America, Thanksgiving very soon became the day I loved most. There is no pressure to buy gifts; no commercial frenzy. Just a meal, some company, and the simple act of acknowledging what is good.

It took me time to recognize how rare this is. Most nations unify through ancestry, monarchy, grievance, or shared struggle. America unifies through something else entirely: a civic ritual of gratitude. &lt;b&gt;Gratitude is not just a personal virtue here—it is part of the national identity. And that identity, I’ve come to believe, is one of America’s greatest strengths.&lt;/b&gt;

As I traveled through more than half the states, I saw enormous diversity—cultural, political, economic—but also a consistent thread of generosity and warmth. Americans can be insulated from the geopolitical hostility that targets their nation, and that may be quite a good thing. Many don’t realize how deeply anti-American narratives have been embedded worldwide. But on the ground (and leaving political divides aside), I have encountered more kindness here than in any other country I’ve ever lived in or visited.

I didn’t move to the United States expecting to stay permanently. I didn’t know what kind of life it would offer my children. But slowly, through these everyday experiences, I began to see what makes America truly different. And Thanksgiving embodies it.

It is not about the Pilgrims, or food, or travel logistics. It is the annual reminder that American identity is built on gratitude: gratitude for freedom, for opportunity, for community, and for the chance to begin again. It asks for nothing but humility. It invites everyone, regardless of background, into a shared moment of thanks.

As an immigrant, that matters deeply to me. &lt;b&gt;Gratitude softens division; it tempers cynicism. It reminds us that liberty is not automatic. And it teaches children—my children—that life’s value isn’t measured only by achievement but by appreciation.&lt;/b&gt;

Fifteen years ago, I came to the United States, unsure of how long we would stay. Today, when I sit at a Thanksgiving table, I understand something that I never saw from a distance:&lt;b&gt; gratitude is the strong force that holds this country together.&lt;/b&gt; It is what makes America generous. It is what makes America resilient. And it is what makes America home.

I didn’t come to America for Thanksgiving. But Thanksgiving is one of the reasons I stayed.
&lt;/blockquote&gt;

As I noted above, had she come to NYC this year instead of 2010, her experience could be very different. The &quot;Cultural Difference&quot; paper suggests one reason that ingratitude has increased in some parts of America, &lt;b&gt;&quot;with the rise in life expectancy, education, and average national income&quot;&lt;/b&gt;. 

I haven&#039;t read the paper itself yet, so I don&#039;t know if they put any zip codes to those connections, but I would venture to posit one of Kamala&#039;s beloved Venn diagrams showing a large overlap with Democrat-voting areas, as those residents include AWFLs, and The Resistance fortifying Our Democracy.

Ingratitude among illegal or quasi-legal immigrants imported &lt;em&gt;en masse&lt;/em&gt; may be due to other reasons; however, some thought might be given as to whether those three qualities (bolded above) are relative rather than absolute.

Ms. Rubacek&#039;s conclusion, &quot;gratitude is the strong force that holds this country together,&quot; is very perceptive, I think. If true, it also goes a long way toward explaining why socialism (as usually presented) is tempting on the surface: the appeal of &quot;helping others&quot; generally accompanies thankfulness for one&#039;s own blessings; and shunned once its mechanics (as usually practiced) are fully understood: it is an ideology of envy, not of equity.

Envy by its nature embodies ingratitude.

Quoting her again: &quot;It took me time to recognize how rare this is. Most nations unify through ancestry, monarchy, grievance, or shared struggle. &lt;b&gt;America unifies through something else entirely: a civic ritual of gratitude. &lt;/b&gt;Gratitude is not just a personal virtue here—it is part of the national identity. And that identity, I’ve come to believe, is one of America’s greatest strengths.&quot;

I will continue displaying my six-foot tall inflatable Turkey with the Pilgrim hat because I am grateful for everything they represent.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>David Foster&#8217;s post at CB was followed by two comments with links to articles on gratitude.</p>
<p>Those were very good, so I am bumping them:<br />
<a href="https://x.com/robkhenderson/status/1488642830876749825" rel="nofollow ugc">https://x.com/robkhenderson/status/1488642830876749825</a><br />
&#8220;Surprisingly, living in a culture with higher levels of life expectancy, education, average national income was associated with lower gratitude&#8230;people&#8230;might take the plentiful educational opportunities and long-life expectancy for granted&#8221;<br />
<a href="https://psyarxiv.com/6ktmu/" rel="nofollow ugc">https://psyarxiv.com/6ktmu/</a></p>
<p>The study he cites at that link is here, if the above doesn&#8217;t work:<br />
<a href="https://osf.io/preprints/psyarxiv/6ktmu_v1" rel="nofollow ugc">https://osf.io/preprints/psyarxiv/6ktmu_v1</a> </p>
<p>Even better is this post from an Aussie immigrant (legal, I&#8217;m sure) on how the view of Americans in Australia, and other nations, is so badly skewed: no one appreciates our native-born trait of helpfulness, and thankfulness.</p>
<p><a href="https://www.zerohedge.com/geopolitical/day-i-understood-american-spirit" rel="nofollow ugc">https://www.zerohedge.com/geopolitical/day-i-understood-american-spirit</a></p>
<blockquote><p>Authored by Kay Rubacek via The Epoch Times,</p>
<p>I didn’t grow up with Thanksgiving. I grew up in Australia, a place that prides itself on being relaxed and irreverent, where national icons range from crocodile wrestlers to movie stars with casual, sun-soaked charisma.</p>
<p>Our culture is fun-loving and independent, summed up in the phrase, “she’ll be right, mate.” It means: don’t fuss, don’t interfere, everyone handles their own problems. It isn’t unkindness; it’s distance. You stay in your lane; others stay in theirs.</p>
<p>Thanksgiving wasn’t part of my world. What I grew up with was a steady, unquestioned criticism of Americans. In art school in Sydney, we were encouraged to enjoy American movies and brands while criticizing Americans as arrogant or self-important. <b>It was such an accepted narrative that no one seemed to ask where it had even come from.</b></p>
<p>In 2010, when I told friends I was moving my young family to the United States, more than one warned me, almost nervously, “Be careful, you might become like an American.”</p>
<p>I didn’t know what they meant. Why would becoming like an American be a threat?</p>
<p>It wasn’t until years later—after researching the Chinese Communist Party’s global soft-power campaigns and the broader network of anti-American messaging pushed by modern ideological actors—<b>that I understood how much of the world’s casual disdain for Americans had been cultivated.</b></p>
<p>If you can weaken the idea of America, you weaken the country. And much of the world has absorbed that message without ever meeting the people it is supposed to condemn.</p>
<p>But everything I had been taught about Americans dissolved as soon as I arrived in New York.</p>
<p>[AE: sadly, she might not say the same thing if moving there today!]</p>
<p>My first weeks in Manhattan were exhilaratingly loud, fast, and disorienting, as one would expect. I carried a huge paper map (this was before smartphones with a built-in GPS were universal), turning it around helplessly at street corners. And every single time, someone stopped. “Where do you need to go?” They weren’t looking for conversation. They were already halfway down the block before I finished saying thank you. But they couldn’t walk past someone who clearly needed help<br />
&#8230;.</p>
<p><b>What surprised me most, though, was how naturally Americans practice gratitude.</b> I didn’t understand its cultural weight until Thanksgiving.</p>
<p>Growing up, Christmas was my favorite holiday, but after coming to America, Thanksgiving very soon became the day I loved most. There is no pressure to buy gifts; no commercial frenzy. Just a meal, some company, and the simple act of acknowledging what is good.</p>
<p>It took me time to recognize how rare this is. Most nations unify through ancestry, monarchy, grievance, or shared struggle. America unifies through something else entirely: a civic ritual of gratitude. <b>Gratitude is not just a personal virtue here—it is part of the national identity. And that identity, I’ve come to believe, is one of America’s greatest strengths.</b></p>
<p>As I traveled through more than half the states, I saw enormous diversity—cultural, political, economic—but also a consistent thread of generosity and warmth. Americans can be insulated from the geopolitical hostility that targets their nation, and that may be quite a good thing. Many don’t realize how deeply anti-American narratives have been embedded worldwide. But on the ground (and leaving political divides aside), I have encountered more kindness here than in any other country I’ve ever lived in or visited.</p>
<p>I didn’t move to the United States expecting to stay permanently. I didn’t know what kind of life it would offer my children. But slowly, through these everyday experiences, I began to see what makes America truly different. And Thanksgiving embodies it.</p>
<p>It is not about the Pilgrims, or food, or travel logistics. It is the annual reminder that American identity is built on gratitude: gratitude for freedom, for opportunity, for community, and for the chance to begin again. It asks for nothing but humility. It invites everyone, regardless of background, into a shared moment of thanks.</p>
<p>As an immigrant, that matters deeply to me. <b>Gratitude softens division; it tempers cynicism. It reminds us that liberty is not automatic. And it teaches children—my children—that life’s value isn’t measured only by achievement but by appreciation.</b></p>
<p>Fifteen years ago, I came to the United States, unsure of how long we would stay. Today, when I sit at a Thanksgiving table, I understand something that I never saw from a distance:<b> gratitude is the strong force that holds this country together.</b> It is what makes America generous. It is what makes America resilient. And it is what makes America home.</p>
<p>I didn’t come to America for Thanksgiving. But Thanksgiving is one of the reasons I stayed.
</p></blockquote>
<p>As I noted above, had she come to NYC this year instead of 2010, her experience could be very different. The &#8220;Cultural Difference&#8221; paper suggests one reason that ingratitude has increased in some parts of America, <b>&#8220;with the rise in life expectancy, education, and average national income&#8221;</b>. </p>
<p>I haven&#8217;t read the paper itself yet, so I don&#8217;t know if they put any zip codes to those connections, but I would venture to posit one of Kamala&#8217;s beloved Venn diagrams showing a large overlap with Democrat-voting areas, as those residents include AWFLs, and The Resistance fortifying Our Democracy.</p>
<p>Ingratitude among illegal or quasi-legal immigrants imported <em>en masse</em> may be due to other reasons; however, some thought might be given as to whether those three qualities (bolded above) are relative rather than absolute.</p>
<p>Ms. Rubacek&#8217;s conclusion, &#8220;gratitude is the strong force that holds this country together,&#8221; is very perceptive, I think. If true, it also goes a long way toward explaining why socialism (as usually presented) is tempting on the surface: the appeal of &#8220;helping others&#8221; generally accompanies thankfulness for one&#8217;s own blessings; and shunned once its mechanics (as usually practiced) are fully understood: it is an ideology of envy, not of equity.</p>
<p>Envy by its nature embodies ingratitude.</p>
<p>Quoting her again: &#8220;It took me time to recognize how rare this is. Most nations unify through ancestry, monarchy, grievance, or shared struggle. <b>America unifies through something else entirely: a civic ritual of gratitude. </b>Gratitude is not just a personal virtue here—it is part of the national identity. And that identity, I’ve come to believe, is one of America’s greatest strengths.&#8221;</p>
<p>I will continue displaying my six-foot tall inflatable Turkey with the Pilgrim hat because I am grateful for everything they represent.</p>
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		<title>
		By: Mrs Whatsit		</title>
		<link>https://thenewneo.com/2025/11/26/open-thread-11-26-2025/#comment-2831924</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Mrs Whatsit]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 27 Nov 2025 14:08:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://thenewneo.com/?p=145791#comment-2831924</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[One of the things I&#039;m thankful for this Thanksgiving is Neo and the many years of thought, effort and skill she has invested to create this small online world for her readers and commenters.  And I&#039;m also thankful for the commenters, who form a virtual community I&#039;m glad to be part of. Thank you, and we all hope you have a warm and lovely day. 

Mr. W and I will spend the day with our eldest son, daughter-in-law and their two children. They&#039;re too far away for casual visiting so we drove a long way through holiday traffic jams yesterday to get here. We&#039;re both feeling very thankful indeed for everything that brought us here over so many years.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>One of the things I&#8217;m thankful for this Thanksgiving is Neo and the many years of thought, effort and skill she has invested to create this small online world for her readers and commenters.  And I&#8217;m also thankful for the commenters, who form a virtual community I&#8217;m glad to be part of. Thank you, and we all hope you have a warm and lovely day. </p>
<p>Mr. W and I will spend the day with our eldest son, daughter-in-law and their two children. They&#8217;re too far away for casual visiting so we drove a long way through holiday traffic jams yesterday to get here. We&#8217;re both feeling very thankful indeed for everything that brought us here over so many years.</p>
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		<title>
		By: Rufus T. Firefly		</title>
		<link>https://thenewneo.com/2025/11/26/open-thread-11-26-2025/#comment-2831922</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Rufus T. Firefly]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 27 Nov 2025 13:53:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://thenewneo.com/?p=145791#comment-2831922</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[Happy Anniversary, Sharon W.!]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Happy Anniversary, Sharon W.!</p>
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		<title>
		By: FOAF		</title>
		<link>https://thenewneo.com/2025/11/26/open-thread-11-26-2025/#comment-2831911</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[FOAF]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 27 Nov 2025 07:40:03 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://thenewneo.com/?p=145791#comment-2831911</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[physicsguy, in 2016 we visited the Big Island.  At that time they allowed visitors to an overlook right by the Kilauea crater and we saw some small lava bursts that I was able to capture on my phone camera.  Those were likely a precursor to the large eruption in 2018.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>physicsguy, in 2016 we visited the Big Island.  At that time they allowed visitors to an overlook right by the Kilauea crater and we saw some small lava bursts that I was able to capture on my phone camera.  Those were likely a precursor to the large eruption in 2018.</p>
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		<title>
		By: Molly Brown		</title>
		<link>https://thenewneo.com/2025/11/26/open-thread-11-26-2025/#comment-2831901</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Molly Brown]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 27 Nov 2025 04:27:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://thenewneo.com/?p=145791#comment-2831901</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[Sharon,
I spent many Thanksgivings in Huntington Beach with my in laws.  Miss them still.
Are you driving up the 1 to Carmel?  Beautiful drive.
After all the comments I think I am going to have to try Julia&#039;s Beef Bourguignon again.  It must be 30 years since last time!]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Sharon,<br />
I spent many Thanksgivings in Huntington Beach with my in laws.  Miss them still.<br />
Are you driving up the 1 to Carmel?  Beautiful drive.<br />
After all the comments I think I am going to have to try Julia&#8217;s Beef Bourguignon again.  It must be 30 years since last time!</p>
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		<title>
		By: R2L		</title>
		<link>https://thenewneo.com/2025/11/26/open-thread-11-26-2025/#comment-2831898</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[R2L]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 27 Nov 2025 03:50:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://thenewneo.com/?p=145791#comment-2831898</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[om: &quot;When I watched it I was saddened thinking about all the wildlife wiped out. Natural processes.&quot;
But just what is the current crop of greenery planted in if not previous lava flows?
Come back in 50,000 years and all will be well?

Huxley: &quot; I understand it’s better on the second day.&quot;  Then it must be really good on the 22nd day!!   :-) 

Great Thanksgiving to the Neo world denizens.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>om: &#8220;When I watched it I was saddened thinking about all the wildlife wiped out. Natural processes.&#8221;<br />
But just what is the current crop of greenery planted in if not previous lava flows?<br />
Come back in 50,000 years and all will be well?</p>
<p>Huxley: &#8221; I understand it’s better on the second day.&#8221;  Then it must be really good on the 22nd day!!   🙂 </p>
<p>Great Thanksgiving to the Neo world denizens.</p>
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		<title>
		By: Sharon W		</title>
		<link>https://thenewneo.com/2025/11/26/open-thread-11-26-2025/#comment-2831884</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Sharon W]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 27 Nov 2025 00:25:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://thenewneo.com/?p=145791#comment-2831884</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[Huxley, we&#039;ve made Julia&#039;s Boeuf Bourguignon a couple times. It is a fantastic recipe, worth the time and expense. Bon appetit!

We will be enjoying the day with our son&#039;s in-laws in Huntington Beach and then as usual, Friday up in Carmel for &quot;leftovers day&quot; with the 2 northern California families. Everyone loves to cook, so it&#039;s always delicious. My Mom thought it was brilliant that we got married on Thanksgiving Day--&quot;always guaranteed a party!&quot;]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Huxley, we&#8217;ve made Julia&#8217;s Boeuf Bourguignon a couple times. It is a fantastic recipe, worth the time and expense. Bon appetit!</p>
<p>We will be enjoying the day with our son&#8217;s in-laws in Huntington Beach and then as usual, Friday up in Carmel for &#8220;leftovers day&#8221; with the 2 northern California families. Everyone loves to cook, so it&#8217;s always delicious. My Mom thought it was brilliant that we got married on Thanksgiving Day&#8211;&#8220;always guaranteed a party!&#8221;</p>
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		<title>
		By: Art Deco		</title>
		<link>https://thenewneo.com/2025/11/26/open-thread-11-26-2025/#comment-2831878</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Art Deco]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 26 Nov 2025 23:56:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://thenewneo.com/?p=145791#comment-2831878</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[https://cathedral.org/wp-content/uploads/2025/11/Cheney-Richard_R1-wPB.pdf
==
This is the program for Richard Cheney&#039;s funeral.  Not speaking at the service, and not on the list of his relations are (1) his sister and (2) his brother.  Not on the list of &#039;honorary pallbearers&#039; are (1) his brother and (2) Lynne Cheney&#039;s surviving brother. Well, maybe they don&#039;t travel anymore.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><a href="https://cathedral.org/wp-content/uploads/2025/11/Cheney-Richard_R1-wPB.pdf" rel="nofollow ugc">https://cathedral.org/wp-content/uploads/2025/11/Cheney-Richard_R1-wPB.pdf</a><br />
==<br />
This is the program for Richard Cheney&#8217;s funeral.  Not speaking at the service, and not on the list of his relations are (1) his sister and (2) his brother.  Not on the list of &#8216;honorary pallbearers&#8217; are (1) his brother and (2) Lynne Cheney&#8217;s surviving brother. Well, maybe they don&#8217;t travel anymore.</p>
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		<title>
		By: physicsguy		</title>
		<link>https://thenewneo.com/2025/11/26/open-thread-11-26-2025/#comment-2831868</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[physicsguy]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 26 Nov 2025 22:34:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://thenewneo.com/?p=145791#comment-2831868</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[One Kilauea link:

https://youtu.be/-KFCg8fojng?si=YCJmos31ggOWyp2M]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>One Kilauea link:</p>
<p><a href="https://youtu.be/-KFCg8fojng?si=YCJmos31ggOWyp2M" rel="nofollow ugc">https://youtu.be/-KFCg8fojng?si=YCJmos31ggOWyp2M</a></p>
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