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	Comments on: Open thread 5/17/24	</title>
	<atom:link href="https://thenewneo.com/2024/05/17/open-thread-5-17-24/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>https://thenewneo.com/2024/05/17/open-thread-5-17-24/</link>
	<description>A blog about political change, among other things</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Sun, 19 May 2024 05:05:19 +0000</lastBuildDate>
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		<title>
		By: AesopFan		</title>
		<link>https://thenewneo.com/2024/05/17/open-thread-5-17-24/#comment-2740503</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[AesopFan]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 19 May 2024 05:05:19 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://www.thenewneo.com/?p=134476#comment-2740503</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[@ Chases Eagles  - what a lovely video of the Aurora, and the music was particularly appropriate.
Loved the way the moon set just in the &quot;notch&quot; of the horizon.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@ Chases Eagles  &#8211; what a lovely video of the Aurora, and the music was particularly appropriate.<br />
Loved the way the moon set just in the &#8220;notch&#8221; of the horizon.</p>
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		<title>
		By: Chases Eagles		</title>
		<link>https://thenewneo.com/2024/05/17/open-thread-5-17-24/#comment-2740352</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Chases Eagles]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 18 May 2024 03:57:01 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://www.thenewneo.com/?p=134476#comment-2740352</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[A week ago, I couldn’t see the aurora because it was misty. I went to bed disappointed. I discovered yesterday that my sky camera unintentionally caught this:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A3Eg0Ur-jas]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>A week ago, I couldn’t see the aurora because it was misty. I went to bed disappointed. I discovered yesterday that my sky camera unintentionally caught this:</p>
<p><a href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A3Eg0Ur-jas" rel="nofollow ugc">https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A3Eg0Ur-jas</a></p>
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		<title>
		By: Art Deco		</title>
		<link>https://thenewneo.com/2024/05/17/open-thread-5-17-24/#comment-2740349</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Art Deco]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 18 May 2024 03:43:23 +0000</pubDate>
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					<description><![CDATA[I believe the World Bank reports that Russia was prior to 2022 devoting about 4% of its GDP to their military.  Don&#039;t get much bang for the buck.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I believe the World Bank reports that Russia was prior to 2022 devoting about 4% of its GDP to their military.  Don&#8217;t get much bang for the buck.</p>
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		<title>
		By: om		</title>
		<link>https://thenewneo.com/2024/05/17/open-thread-5-17-24/#comment-2740347</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[om]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 18 May 2024 03:23:39 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://www.thenewneo.com/?p=134476#comment-2740347</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[Niketas:

When did Russia invade Georgia?  When did Russia invade Ukraine? (2008, 2014 (proxies), 2022).

When did Europe really ramp up its spending on defense?  After 2022 IIRC.  I wonder why they would do that.  Can&#039;t be in response to a nation that attacks it&#039;s neighbors like it was wont to do in the last century.  

Can&#039;t ask the Niketas for he hasn&#039;t a clue. 

Time for some AutoCad.  Carry on Niketas.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Niketas:</p>
<p>When did Russia invade Georgia?  When did Russia invade Ukraine? (2008, 2014 (proxies), 2022).</p>
<p>When did Europe really ramp up its spending on defense?  After 2022 IIRC.  I wonder why they would do that.  Can&#8217;t be in response to a nation that attacks it&#8217;s neighbors like it was wont to do in the last century.  </p>
<p>Can&#8217;t ask the Niketas for he hasn&#8217;t a clue. </p>
<p>Time for some AutoCad.  Carry on Niketas.</p>
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		<title>
		By: Niketas Choniates		</title>
		<link>https://thenewneo.com/2024/05/17/open-thread-5-17-24/#comment-2740345</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Niketas Choniates]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 18 May 2024 02:59:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://www.thenewneo.com/?p=134476#comment-2740345</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[@om:&lt;i&gt;What percentage of GDP is Russia spending on its national defense?&lt;/i&gt;

Why don&#039;t you post your numbers and sources instead of asking me to do it? Last time I do your homework.

Europe is spending much more on its military than Russia, because they have a much bigger economy, even though they spend a smaller percentage. Source is SIPRI for both. Try some maths, as the man says.

Europe:&lt;a href=&quot;https://www.euronews.com/2024/04/22/military-spending-in-western-and-central-europe-higher-than-end-of-cold-war-data-shows&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow ugc&quot;&gt;&lt;i&gt;According to new data released by the Stockholm International Peace Research Institute (SIPRI), Europe has seen a widespread surge in military spending since the start of 2022, reaching a total of €552 billion in 2023.&lt;/i&gt;&lt;/a&gt;

Russia:&lt;a href=&quot;https://www.aa.com.tr/en/world/russia-s-military-spending-in-2024-estimated-at-140b-report-shows/3081698&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow ugc&quot;&gt;&lt;i&gt;Russia’s military and war-related spending is projected to rise 29% year-on-year to 12.8 trillion rubles (about $140 billion), an international think tank said on Wednesday, citing new federal budget plans. Russia’s military spending in 2024 will increase to 7.1% of its gross domestic product (GDP), accounting for 35% of total government spending, the Stockholm International Peace Research Institute (SIPRI) said in its report.&lt;/i&gt;&lt;/a&gt;

Europe&#039;s 552 billion euros ($588 billion) for 2023 is greater than the $140 billion Russia aspires to in 2024. Quite a bit greater. Try some maths, as the man says, but also maybe don&#039;t throw out questions you didn&#039;t already look up the answers to.

Any further demands from you for numbers I will ignore. You are free to supply your own numbers and sources--if you have any--if you wish to argue a point from them.

Everyone can see that I supplied sources and data and you did not. :)]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@om:<i>What percentage of GDP is Russia spending on its national defense?</i></p>
<p>Why don&#8217;t you post your numbers and sources instead of asking me to do it? Last time I do your homework.</p>
<p>Europe is spending much more on its military than Russia, because they have a much bigger economy, even though they spend a smaller percentage. Source is SIPRI for both. Try some maths, as the man says.</p>
<p>Europe:<a href="https://www.euronews.com/2024/04/22/military-spending-in-western-and-central-europe-higher-than-end-of-cold-war-data-shows" rel="nofollow ugc"><i>According to new data released by the Stockholm International Peace Research Institute (SIPRI), Europe has seen a widespread surge in military spending since the start of 2022, reaching a total of €552 billion in 2023.</i></a></p>
<p>Russia:<a href="https://www.aa.com.tr/en/world/russia-s-military-spending-in-2024-estimated-at-140b-report-shows/3081698" rel="nofollow ugc"><i>Russia’s military and war-related spending is projected to rise 29% year-on-year to 12.8 trillion rubles (about $140 billion), an international think tank said on Wednesday, citing new federal budget plans. Russia’s military spending in 2024 will increase to 7.1% of its gross domestic product (GDP), accounting for 35% of total government spending, the Stockholm International Peace Research Institute (SIPRI) said in its report.</i></a></p>
<p>Europe&#8217;s 552 billion euros ($588 billion) for 2023 is greater than the $140 billion Russia aspires to in 2024. Quite a bit greater. Try some maths, as the man says, but also maybe don&#8217;t throw out questions you didn&#8217;t already look up the answers to.</p>
<p>Any further demands from you for numbers I will ignore. You are free to supply your own numbers and sources&#8211;if you have any&#8211;if you wish to argue a point from them.</p>
<p>Everyone can see that I supplied sources and data and you did not. 🙂</p>
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		<title>
		By: om		</title>
		<link>https://thenewneo.com/2024/05/17/open-thread-5-17-24/#comment-2740344</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[om]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 18 May 2024 02:44:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://www.thenewneo.com/?p=134476#comment-2740344</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[Why would Unicorns be subject to some hominid&#039;s laws.  They are after all exempt from physics and other such trifles.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Why would Unicorns be subject to some hominid&#8217;s laws.  They are after all exempt from physics and other such trifles.</p>
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		<title>
		By: om		</title>
		<link>https://thenewneo.com/2024/05/17/open-thread-5-17-24/#comment-2740343</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[om]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 18 May 2024 02:40:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://www.thenewneo.com/?p=134476#comment-2740343</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[Niketas:

You apperantly haven&#039;t been paying attention to the state of readiness of the Bundeswehr (airframes, tanks, etc.).  Poland isn&#039;t in that boat, fortunately.  But ignoring things is ignorance or lying, Niketas?

But back to your grand strategic ripost to my snippet of Russian behavior.  Russia invaded Georgia and Ukraine in this century, not the 1980s.  Try math again.  

What percentage of GDP is Russia spending on its national defense?  I&#039;m pretty sure it isn&#039;t the typical European 2-4%.  I&#039;m pretty sure it is double digits.  Try some maths.

Joe McCarthy?  LOL.  Weak, bro.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Niketas:</p>
<p>You apperantly haven&#8217;t been paying attention to the state of readiness of the Bundeswehr (airframes, tanks, etc.).  Poland isn&#8217;t in that boat, fortunately.  But ignoring things is ignorance or lying, Niketas?</p>
<p>But back to your grand strategic ripost to my snippet of Russian behavior.  Russia invaded Georgia and Ukraine in this century, not the 1980s.  Try math again.  </p>
<p>What percentage of GDP is Russia spending on its national defense?  I&#8217;m pretty sure it isn&#8217;t the typical European 2-4%.  I&#8217;m pretty sure it is double digits.  Try some maths.</p>
<p>Joe McCarthy?  LOL.  Weak, bro.</p>
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		<title>
		By: Brian E		</title>
		<link>https://thenewneo.com/2024/05/17/open-thread-5-17-24/#comment-2740342</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Brian E]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 18 May 2024 02:33:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://www.thenewneo.com/?p=134476#comment-2740342</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[Hey Snow on Pine, I think Twilight Zone dealt with that in the episode &quot;To Serve Man&quot;!]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hey Snow on Pine, I think Twilight Zone dealt with that in the episode &#8220;To Serve Man&#8221;!</p>
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		<title>
		By: Snow on Pine		</title>
		<link>https://thenewneo.com/2024/05/17/open-thread-5-17-24/#comment-2740341</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Snow on Pine]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 18 May 2024 02:26:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://www.thenewneo.com/?p=134476#comment-2740341</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[RE:  The supposed nature and behaviors of Non Human Intelligences.

Quite often I see the idea mentioned, the assumption—as if it is an almost certainty—that any far more technologically advanced NHIs, members of any alien civilizations advanced enough to have mastered interstellar travel must, almost of necessity--having attained a much wider and more penetrating knowledge of the Universe--be on a higher intellectual level, must be “Enlightened,” and operating on a higher moral plane than we humans do, thus, must be—vis-a-vis us humans—peaceful and benign in both nature, and behavior.  

To me, once we encounter such NHIs, operating, basing all of your ideas and actions--from the get go—on the basis of this central assumption of  peacefulness, and benignity seems extremely foolhardy in the extreme. 

If Darwin&#039;s “survival of the fittest” is correct, any entity, which rose to be at the apex of any world, did so by climbing the pyramid of life on that planet through struggle against all other forces and competitors, and thus was and is innately, in some sense, an extremely accomplished competitor--if you will--a “predator.”

Can we count on—should  we—assume, “bet the farm,” that such NHI&#039;s attainment of interstellar travel almost inevitably turned them into “Enlightened,” peaceful, and benign entities, moreover, entities “Enlightened,” peaceful, and/or benign as we humans would define and understand these terms. 

I think that the correct approach to such en encounter has to be one of caution, once which assumes such NHIs to be potentially hostile until proven otherwise, and proven so by concrete actions, rather than words.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>RE:  The supposed nature and behaviors of Non Human Intelligences.</p>
<p>Quite often I see the idea mentioned, the assumption—as if it is an almost certainty—that any far more technologically advanced NHIs, members of any alien civilizations advanced enough to have mastered interstellar travel must, almost of necessity&#8211;having attained a much wider and more penetrating knowledge of the Universe&#8211;be on a higher intellectual level, must be “Enlightened,” and operating on a higher moral plane than we humans do, thus, must be—vis-a-vis us humans—peaceful and benign in both nature, and behavior.  </p>
<p>To me, once we encounter such NHIs, operating, basing all of your ideas and actions&#8211;from the get go—on the basis of this central assumption of  peacefulness, and benignity seems extremely foolhardy in the extreme. </p>
<p>If Darwin&#8217;s “survival of the fittest” is correct, any entity, which rose to be at the apex of any world, did so by climbing the pyramid of life on that planet through struggle against all other forces and competitors, and thus was and is innately, in some sense, an extremely accomplished competitor&#8211;if you will&#8211;a “predator.”</p>
<p>Can we count on—should  we—assume, “bet the farm,” that such NHI&#8217;s attainment of interstellar travel almost inevitably turned them into “Enlightened,” peaceful, and benign entities, moreover, entities “Enlightened,” peaceful, and/or benign as we humans would define and understand these terms. </p>
<p>I think that the correct approach to such en encounter has to be one of caution, once which assumes such NHIs to be potentially hostile until proven otherwise, and proven so by concrete actions, rather than words.</p>
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		<title>
		By: Niketas Choniates		</title>
		<link>https://thenewneo.com/2024/05/17/open-thread-5-17-24/#comment-2740340</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Niketas Choniates]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 18 May 2024 01:56:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://www.thenewneo.com/?p=134476#comment-2740340</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[@om lied:&lt;i&gt;how does it work in your grand ideas for Ukraine to invade Russia and push to take Moscow? &lt;/i&gt;

Please stop lying about what I wrote. Everyone can read what I wrote and see that you are lying.

Here&#039;s my actual words: Europe, not Ukraine. &quot;They&quot; and &quot;their&quot; and &quot;them&quot; is Europe.

&lt;blockquote&gt;&lt;b&gt;Europe&lt;/b&gt; can handle anything Putin can throw at them. And they should. Ukraine’s on &lt;b&gt;their&lt;/b&gt; border, not ours. If &lt;b&gt;they’re&lt;/b&gt; worried about Putin, and so concerned about Ukraine, why shouldn’t &lt;b&gt;they&lt;/b&gt; push him back to Moscow? &lt;/blockquote&gt;

I know you can read, so I know your mischaracterization is a deliberate lie. If you want to discuss anything in good faith, stop lying about what I wrote. If you just want to fling feces, you can do that without my engagement.

BTW I notice you got nothing to say about the levels of military spending you challenged me with.

And everyone else notices too. :) Oopsie, as the man says.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@om lied:<i>how does it work in your grand ideas for Ukraine to invade Russia and push to take Moscow? </i></p>
<p>Please stop lying about what I wrote. Everyone can read what I wrote and see that you are lying.</p>
<p>Here&#8217;s my actual words: Europe, not Ukraine. &#8220;They&#8221; and &#8220;their&#8221; and &#8220;them&#8221; is Europe.</p>
<blockquote><p><b>Europe</b> can handle anything Putin can throw at them. And they should. Ukraine’s on <b>their</b> border, not ours. If <b>they’re</b> worried about Putin, and so concerned about Ukraine, why shouldn’t <b>they</b> push him back to Moscow? </p></blockquote>
<p>I know you can read, so I know your mischaracterization is a deliberate lie. If you want to discuss anything in good faith, stop lying about what I wrote. If you just want to fling feces, you can do that without my engagement.</p>
<p>BTW I notice you got nothing to say about the levels of military spending you challenged me with.</p>
<p>And everyone else notices too. 🙂 Oopsie, as the man says.</p>
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