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	Comments on: Hopkins&#8217; kingfishers and dragonflies	</title>
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	<link>https://thenewneo.com/2023/06/10/hopkins-kingfishers-and-dragonflies/</link>
	<description>A blog about political change, among other things</description>
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		<title>
		By: neo		</title>
		<link>https://thenewneo.com/2023/06/10/hopkins-kingfishers-and-dragonflies/#comment-2683675</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[neo]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 11 Jun 2023 17:50:52 +0000</pubDate>
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					<description><![CDATA[Jim in Alaska:

The terrible sonnets are amazingly good.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Jim in Alaska:</p>
<p>The terrible sonnets are amazingly good.</p>
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		<title>
		By: Jim in Alaska		</title>
		<link>https://thenewneo.com/2023/06/10/hopkins-kingfishers-and-dragonflies/#comment-2683665</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Jim in Alaska]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 11 Jun 2023 16:32:20 +0000</pubDate>
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					<description><![CDATA[Among his Terrible Sonnets, many  consider his best to be;

I wake and feel the fell of dark, not day.
What hours, O what black hours we have spent
This night! what sights you, heart, saw; ways you went!
And more must, in yet longer light&#039;s delay.
   With witness I speak this. But where I say
Hours I mean years, mean life. And my lament
Is cries countless, cries like dead letters sent
To dearest him that lives alas! away.

   I am gall, I am heartburn. God&#039;s most deep decree
Bitter would have me taste: my taste was me;
Bones built in me, flesh filled, blood brimmed the curse.
   Selfyeast of spirit a dull dough sours. I see
The lost are like this, and their scourge to be
As I am mine, their sweating selves; but worse.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Among his Terrible Sonnets, many  consider his best to be;</p>
<p>I wake and feel the fell of dark, not day.<br />
What hours, O what black hours we have spent<br />
This night! what sights you, heart, saw; ways you went!<br />
And more must, in yet longer light&#8217;s delay.<br />
   With witness I speak this. But where I say<br />
Hours I mean years, mean life. And my lament<br />
Is cries countless, cries like dead letters sent<br />
To dearest him that lives alas! away.</p>
<p>   I am gall, I am heartburn. God&#8217;s most deep decree<br />
Bitter would have me taste: my taste was me;<br />
Bones built in me, flesh filled, blood brimmed the curse.<br />
   Selfyeast of spirit a dull dough sours. I see<br />
The lost are like this, and their scourge to be<br />
As I am mine, their sweating selves; but worse.</p>
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		<item>
		<title>
		By: Hubert		</title>
		<link>https://thenewneo.com/2023/06/10/hopkins-kingfishers-and-dragonflies/#comment-2683589</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Hubert]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 11 Jun 2023 00:03:45 +0000</pubDate>
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					<description><![CDATA[Robert Lowell&#039;s answer to Hopkins&#039; kingfisher: &quot;Colloquy in Black Rock&quot;, first published in The Sewanee Review in 1944:

https://www.thesewaneereview.com/articles/robert-lowell-colloquy-in-black-rock

The last stanza (in a slightly revised version from Lowell&#039;s second book, &quot;Lord Weary&#039;s Castle&quot;):

Christ walks on the black water. In Black Mud
Darts the kingfisher. On Corpus Christi, heart,
Over the drum-beat of St. Stephen&#039;s choir
I hear him, Stupor Mundi, and the mud
Flies from his hunching wings and beak--my heart,
The blue kingfisher dives on you in fire.

Black Rock is a neighborhood in Bridgeport, Connecticut. Not far from you, PA+Cat.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Robert Lowell&#8217;s answer to Hopkins&#8217; kingfisher: &#8220;Colloquy in Black Rock&#8221;, first published in The Sewanee Review in 1944:</p>
<p><a href="https://www.thesewaneereview.com/articles/robert-lowell-colloquy-in-black-rock" rel="nofollow ugc">https://www.thesewaneereview.com/articles/robert-lowell-colloquy-in-black-rock</a></p>
<p>The last stanza (in a slightly revised version from Lowell&#8217;s second book, &#8220;Lord Weary&#8217;s Castle&#8221;):</p>
<p>Christ walks on the black water. In Black Mud<br />
Darts the kingfisher. On Corpus Christi, heart,<br />
Over the drum-beat of St. Stephen&#8217;s choir<br />
I hear him, Stupor Mundi, and the mud<br />
Flies from his hunching wings and beak&#8211;my heart,<br />
The blue kingfisher dives on you in fire.</p>
<p>Black Rock is a neighborhood in Bridgeport, Connecticut. Not far from you, PA+Cat.</p>
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		<title>
		By: Mrs Whatsit		</title>
		<link>https://thenewneo.com/2023/06/10/hopkins-kingfishers-and-dragonflies/#comment-2683586</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Mrs Whatsit]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 10 Jun 2023 23:46:51 +0000</pubDate>
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					<description><![CDATA[And I forgot to add -- there is a 1953 novel entitled Kingfishers Catch Fire, by Rumer Godden, set in India and semi-autobiographical, like almost everything she wrote.  Full of shimmering language something like that of the Hopkins poem.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>And I forgot to add &#8212; there is a 1953 novel entitled Kingfishers Catch Fire, by Rumer Godden, set in India and semi-autobiographical, like almost everything she wrote.  Full of shimmering language something like that of the Hopkins poem.</p>
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		<title>
		By: Mrs Whatsit		</title>
		<link>https://thenewneo.com/2023/06/10/hopkins-kingfishers-and-dragonflies/#comment-2683585</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Mrs Whatsit]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 10 Jun 2023 23:40:39 +0000</pubDate>
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					<description><![CDATA[As [k] (i) ng [f] (i)shers [k]atch [f](i)re, [dr](a)gon[fl] ies [dr](a)w [fl] (a)me

I wish I could use color. Punctuation alone doesn&#039;t do the job.  But I tried. Look at the K sounds in kingfisher, and then look at the I sounds.  And then the DRs and the FLs and the As in the dragonflies. It may seem like a lot of pedantic nonsense, and possibly it is, except I don&#039;t think so.  I think all those echoes in the sounds, and also in how the words look on the page, set up a resonance that we feel as we read or listen, whether or not we register it on the surface.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>As [k] (i) ng [f] (i)shers [k]atch [f](i)re, [dr](a)gon[fl] ies [dr](a)w [fl] (a)me</p>
<p>I wish I could use color. Punctuation alone doesn&#8217;t do the job.  But I tried. Look at the K sounds in kingfisher, and then look at the I sounds.  And then the DRs and the FLs and the As in the dragonflies. It may seem like a lot of pedantic nonsense, and possibly it is, except I don&#8217;t think so.  I think all those echoes in the sounds, and also in how the words look on the page, set up a resonance that we feel as we read or listen, whether or not we register it on the surface.</p>
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		<title>
		By: PA+Cat		</title>
		<link>https://thenewneo.com/2023/06/10/hopkins-kingfishers-and-dragonflies/#comment-2683564</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[PA+Cat]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 10 Jun 2023 22:26:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://neoneocon.com/?p=26754#comment-2683564</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[One of my favorite Hopkins poems is &quot;Spring and Fall,&quot; which he inscribed &quot;to a young child&quot;:

&lt;i&gt;Márgarét, áre you gríeving
Over Goldengrove unleaving?
Leáves like the things of man, you
With your fresh thoughts care for, can you?
Ah! ás the heart grows older
It will come to such sights colder
By and by, nor spare a sigh
Though worlds of wanwood leafmeal lie;
And yet you wíll weep and know why.
Now no matter, child, the name:
Sórrow’s spríngs áre the same.
Nor mouth had, no nor mind, expressed
What heart heard of, ghost guessed:
It ís the blight man was born for,
It is Margaret you mourn for.&lt;/i&gt;

Maybe it&#039;s because of Hopkins&#039; stature as a poet-- I was surprised to find out that he stood only 5&#039; 2&quot;-- short even for the Victorian period. I was not surprised, though, to find that he died in his mid-forties of typhoid fever, just like Prince Albert, Victoria&#039;s husband. Public health still had a long way to go in the late nineteenth century.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>One of my favorite Hopkins poems is &#8220;Spring and Fall,&#8221; which he inscribed &#8220;to a young child&#8221;:</p>
<p><i>Márgarét, áre you gríeving<br />
Over Goldengrove unleaving?<br />
Leáves like the things of man, you<br />
With your fresh thoughts care for, can you?<br />
Ah! ás the heart grows older<br />
It will come to such sights colder<br />
By and by, nor spare a sigh<br />
Though worlds of wanwood leafmeal lie;<br />
And yet you wíll weep and know why.<br />
Now no matter, child, the name:<br />
Sórrow’s spríngs áre the same.<br />
Nor mouth had, no nor mind, expressed<br />
What heart heard of, ghost guessed:<br />
It ís the blight man was born for,<br />
It is Margaret you mourn for.</i></p>
<p>Maybe it&#8217;s because of Hopkins&#8217; stature as a poet&#8211; I was surprised to find out that he stood only 5&#8242; 2&#8243;&#8211; short even for the Victorian period. I was not surprised, though, to find that he died in his mid-forties of typhoid fever, just like Prince Albert, Victoria&#8217;s husband. Public health still had a long way to go in the late nineteenth century.</p>
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		<title>
		By: Mac		</title>
		<link>https://thenewneo.com/2023/06/10/hopkins-kingfishers-and-dragonflies/#comment-2683556</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Mac]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 10 Jun 2023 21:00:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://neoneocon.com/?p=26754#comment-2683556</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[Rev. Daniel S. Hendrickson, SJ

Rev. Gerard Manley Hopkins, SJ

Them Jesuits, always conspiring :-) Creighton is a Jesuit school, as you probably know but others reading this may not.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Rev. Daniel S. Hendrickson, SJ</p>
<p>Rev. Gerard Manley Hopkins, SJ</p>
<p>Them Jesuits, always conspiring 🙂 Creighton is a Jesuit school, as you probably know but others reading this may not.</p>
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		<title>
		By: Cornhead		</title>
		<link>https://thenewneo.com/2023/06/10/hopkins-kingfishers-and-dragonflies/#comment-2683552</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Cornhead]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 10 Jun 2023 20:50:42 +0000</pubDate>
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					<description><![CDATA[The Creighton President wrote his thesis on Hopkins.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The Creighton President wrote his thesis on Hopkins.</p>
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		<title>
		By: Mac		</title>
		<link>https://thenewneo.com/2023/06/10/hopkins-kingfishers-and-dragonflies/#comment-2683547</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Mac]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 10 Jun 2023 20:14:04 +0000</pubDate>
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					<description><![CDATA[Not surprisingly, Hopkins is very highly regarded by literary Catholics and other Christians.  Also by poets and academics, with an influence on the former which is definitely not always for the best. His style is so over the top and distinctive that anything that shows a strong influence from him is pretty obviously imitative and almost inevitably not as good. He was a huge favorite among my literary set back in the &#039;60s. There are at least two Christian literary magazines that take their names from him, &lt;i&gt;Dappled Things&lt;/i&gt; and &lt;i&gt;The Windhover&lt;/i&gt;.

I was for a long time puzzled by the kingfisher&#039;s role in that poem, as the one I know is pretty ordinary in appearance. I think it&#039;s the belted kingfisher. He does catch your eye by his very abrupt darting and a flash of white, but certainly nothing close to what Hopkins apparently saw.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Belted_kingfisher

I was also, like a lot of people, puzzled by &quot;buckle!&quot; in &quot;The Windhover.&quot; I&#039;ve seen a fairly detailed explication of it but don&#039;t remember now. You can assume that Hopkins had something very definite in mind. At first glance one might think his images are impressionistic but they&#039;re the opposite. His notebooks are full of long excruciatingly detailed and precise descriptions of things like clouds.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Not surprisingly, Hopkins is very highly regarded by literary Catholics and other Christians.  Also by poets and academics, with an influence on the former which is definitely not always for the best. His style is so over the top and distinctive that anything that shows a strong influence from him is pretty obviously imitative and almost inevitably not as good. He was a huge favorite among my literary set back in the &#8217;60s. There are at least two Christian literary magazines that take their names from him, <i>Dappled Things</i> and <i>The Windhover</i>.</p>
<p>I was for a long time puzzled by the kingfisher&#8217;s role in that poem, as the one I know is pretty ordinary in appearance. I think it&#8217;s the belted kingfisher. He does catch your eye by his very abrupt darting and a flash of white, but certainly nothing close to what Hopkins apparently saw.</p>
<p><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Belted_kingfisher" rel="nofollow ugc">https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Belted_kingfisher</a></p>
<p>I was also, like a lot of people, puzzled by &#8220;buckle!&#8221; in &#8220;The Windhover.&#8221; I&#8217;ve seen a fairly detailed explication of it but don&#8217;t remember now. You can assume that Hopkins had something very definite in mind. At first glance one might think his images are impressionistic but they&#8217;re the opposite. His notebooks are full of long excruciatingly detailed and precise descriptions of things like clouds.</p>
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		<title>
		By: cb		</title>
		<link>https://thenewneo.com/2023/06/10/hopkins-kingfishers-and-dragonflies/#comment-2683546</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[cb]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 10 Jun 2023 20:08:31 +0000</pubDate>
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					<description><![CDATA[A favorite:  Walt Whitman ~ The Ox-tamer
 
In a far-away northern county in the placid pastoral region,
Lives my farmer friend, the theme of my recitative, a famous
tamer of oxen,
There they bring him the three-year-olds and the four-year-olds to
break them,
He will take the wildest steer in the world and break him and
tame him,
He will go fearless without any whip where the young bullock
chafes up and down the yard,
The bullock&#039;s head tosses restless high in the air with raging eyes,
Yet see you! how soon his rage subsides—how soon this tamer
tames him;
See you! on the farms hereabout a hundred oxen young and old,
and he is the man who has tamed them,
They all know him, all are affectionate to him;
See you! some are such beautiful animals, so lofty looking;
Some are buff-color&#039;d, some mottled, one has a white line running
along his back, some are brindled,
Some have wide flaring horns (a good sign)—see you! the
bright hides,
See, the two with stars on their foreheads—see, the round bodies
and broad backs,
How straight and square they stand on their legs—what fine
sagacious eyes!
How they watch their tamer—they wish him near them—how
they turn to look after him!
What yearning expression! how uneasy they are when he moves
away from them;
Now I marvel what it can be he appears to them, (books, politics,
poems, depart—all else departs,)
I confess I envy only his fascination—my silent, illiterate friend,
Whom a hundred oxen love there in his life on farms,
In the northern county far, in the placid pastoral region.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>A favorite:  Walt Whitman ~ The Ox-tamer</p>
<p>In a far-away northern county in the placid pastoral region,<br />
Lives my farmer friend, the theme of my recitative, a famous<br />
tamer of oxen,<br />
There they bring him the three-year-olds and the four-year-olds to<br />
break them,<br />
He will take the wildest steer in the world and break him and<br />
tame him,<br />
He will go fearless without any whip where the young bullock<br />
chafes up and down the yard,<br />
The bullock&#8217;s head tosses restless high in the air with raging eyes,<br />
Yet see you! how soon his rage subsides—how soon this tamer<br />
tames him;<br />
See you! on the farms hereabout a hundred oxen young and old,<br />
and he is the man who has tamed them,<br />
They all know him, all are affectionate to him;<br />
See you! some are such beautiful animals, so lofty looking;<br />
Some are buff-color&#8217;d, some mottled, one has a white line running<br />
along his back, some are brindled,<br />
Some have wide flaring horns (a good sign)—see you! the<br />
bright hides,<br />
See, the two with stars on their foreheads—see, the round bodies<br />
and broad backs,<br />
How straight and square they stand on their legs—what fine<br />
sagacious eyes!<br />
How they watch their tamer—they wish him near them—how<br />
they turn to look after him!<br />
What yearning expression! how uneasy they are when he moves<br />
away from them;<br />
Now I marvel what it can be he appears to them, (books, politics,<br />
poems, depart—all else departs,)<br />
I confess I envy only his fascination—my silent, illiterate friend,<br />
Whom a hundred oxen love there in his life on farms,<br />
In the northern county far, in the placid pastoral region.</p>
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