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	Comments on: Proud Boys convicted of seditious conspiracy	</title>
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	<link>https://thenewneo.com/2023/05/04/proud-boys-convicted-of-seditious-conspiracy/</link>
	<description>A blog about political change, among other things</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Sat, 06 May 2023 03:57:35 +0000</lastBuildDate>
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		<title>
		By: Leo Amery		</title>
		<link>https://thenewneo.com/2023/05/04/proud-boys-convicted-of-seditious-conspiracy/#comment-2678547</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Leo Amery]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 06 May 2023 03:57:35 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://www.thenewneo.com/?p=125669#comment-2678547</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[&quot;The more I see it, the more I am convinced DC needs to be stripped of what local government and population it has. This disgusts me, and I imagine it is partially an intentional move.&quot;

The case was tried in the District court of the District of Columbia i.e. had no connection to DC local govt.

&quot;Yes, the overriding motivation was always to get rid of the Donald. And the beat goes on.&quot;

Worth noting that the presiding judge who refused to move the trial elsewhere, one Timothy Kelly is a) a 14 year member of the Federalist Society and b) a Big Don nominee. 

But---&quot;Kelly spent a decade as a federal prosecutor, serving first as an Assistant United States Attorney in the District of Columbia and then as a trial attorney in the Public Integrity Section of the Department of Justice&#039;s Criminal Division.&quot; (from the Wikipedia entry on Kelly)

Once a corner cutting prosecutor (the Public Integrity Section is a tipoff) always a corner cutting prosecutor.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;The more I see it, the more I am convinced DC needs to be stripped of what local government and population it has. This disgusts me, and I imagine it is partially an intentional move.&#8221;</p>
<p>The case was tried in the District court of the District of Columbia i.e. had no connection to DC local govt.</p>
<p>&#8220;Yes, the overriding motivation was always to get rid of the Donald. And the beat goes on.&#8221;</p>
<p>Worth noting that the presiding judge who refused to move the trial elsewhere, one Timothy Kelly is a) a 14 year member of the Federalist Society and b) a Big Don nominee. </p>
<p>But&#8212;&#8220;Kelly spent a decade as a federal prosecutor, serving first as an Assistant United States Attorney in the District of Columbia and then as a trial attorney in the Public Integrity Section of the Department of Justice&#8217;s Criminal Division.&#8221; (from the Wikipedia entry on Kelly)</p>
<p>Once a corner cutting prosecutor (the Public Integrity Section is a tipoff) always a corner cutting prosecutor.</p>
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		<title>
		By: Cicero		</title>
		<link>https://thenewneo.com/2023/05/04/proud-boys-convicted-of-seditious-conspiracy/#comment-2678484</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Cicero]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 05 May 2023 20:59:48 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://www.thenewneo.com/?p=125669#comment-2678484</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[The Biden government WANTED TO incarcerate the restless, the demonstrators who entered the Capitol building of our Republic, and did, for a year in solitary for a misdemeanor, before trial. Plus inexcusably shot one person to death; the Capitol cop shooter was exonerated. He was not tried. Now we have the show trials, all found guilty, sentencing pending.
That barriers and the Nat&#039;l Guard were not in place, were refused (!) before Jan.6, shows clearly this was a setup by the Biden administration.

This is no longer America. It is more like Nicaragua. And an apparent majority is OK with this. Want a banana?
I&#039;m keeping my head down.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The Biden government WANTED TO incarcerate the restless, the demonstrators who entered the Capitol building of our Republic, and did, for a year in solitary for a misdemeanor, before trial. Plus inexcusably shot one person to death; the Capitol cop shooter was exonerated. He was not tried. Now we have the show trials, all found guilty, sentencing pending.<br />
That barriers and the Nat&#8217;l Guard were not in place, were refused (!) before Jan.6, shows clearly this was a setup by the Biden administration.</p>
<p>This is no longer America. It is more like Nicaragua. And an apparent majority is OK with this. Want a banana?<br />
I&#8217;m keeping my head down.</p>
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		<title>
		By: Turtler		</title>
		<link>https://thenewneo.com/2023/05/04/proud-boys-convicted-of-seditious-conspiracy/#comment-2678477</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Turtler]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 05 May 2023 20:09:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://www.thenewneo.com/?p=125669#comment-2678477</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[@Abraxas

&lt;blockquote&gt; I remember Birchers years ago arguing that centralization of government in DC would make a Communist revolution in the capital into a takeover of the whole country, in the same way that Lenin’s Petrograd revolution meant a change of government for Russia. Of course the October Revolution was followed by a bloody civil war, but somehow seizing St. Petersburg and Moscow made them legitimate in many Russian’s eyes) .&lt;/blockquote&gt;

The differences I see with Paris and Moscow/St. Petersburg is that they (ESPECIALLY the Russian examples) were built up as powerful, centralized, authoritarian states, and their capital cities tended to be powerful and populous fairly soon after they started being constructed (though &quot;Peter&quot; was rather synthetic because it was built from the ground up to be a capital).In France&#039;s case this was somewhat modified by feudal and commercial development and the need to keep the nobility, clergy, and &quot;the Mob&quot; at least somewhat placated with the iron hand kept in a velvet glove.

(Dumas actually gives a decent overview of this sort of stuff, even if his work is largely historical fiction.)

Similar sort of happened in Russia but it took a DRASTIC U-Turn due to the Mongols (among other things), with an even more suffocating, powerful, autocratic despot (literally) arising, whom even the most powerful nobility had to address while referring to themselves as &quot;your slaves.&quot; Helped by burning down and purging a lot of cities that tried to compete.

When the Tsar of Moscow conquered parts of the Baltic Coast and decided to build a new &quot;Western&quot; Capital, power moved there (even if Moscow never entirely lost its prestige, population, or importance).

That along with the traditions of utterly authoritarian centralized power meant that when that power faltered and then fell apart (as happened in the Time of Troubles and during WWI) utter chaos ensued. There was a provisional republic helped along by the remnants of the military and bureaucratic elite that tried to cobble together some kind of democratic system, but it would&#039;ve been a trying task even during peacetime, and without the Bolsheviks (with lots of German funds and guns) trying to play.

The US was literally built different even more foundationally than France, as a union of colonies/states used to self-government and forced to depend on themselves. Centralization (especially since the Civil War and particularly the 1960s) has hurt that but there are still robust state level organizations and a civic community on the grassroots. That&#039;s probably done more to explain why AT THE MOMENT a hard Commie Takeover in DC wouldn&#039;t lead to the rest of the US Falling.

At least yet.

Likewise, it&#039;s also worth noting that Paris came to prominence in part due to its Count Odo rebelling against an ineffective Frankish leader after being forced to fight the Vikings off alone.

But they obviously want to centralize power, and our Federalist inheritance cannot be abused forever and still be a viable shield.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@Abraxas</p>
<blockquote><p> I remember Birchers years ago arguing that centralization of government in DC would make a Communist revolution in the capital into a takeover of the whole country, in the same way that Lenin’s Petrograd revolution meant a change of government for Russia. Of course the October Revolution was followed by a bloody civil war, but somehow seizing St. Petersburg and Moscow made them legitimate in many Russian’s eyes) .</p></blockquote>
<p>The differences I see with Paris and Moscow/St. Petersburg is that they (ESPECIALLY the Russian examples) were built up as powerful, centralized, authoritarian states, and their capital cities tended to be powerful and populous fairly soon after they started being constructed (though &#8220;Peter&#8221; was rather synthetic because it was built from the ground up to be a capital).In France&#8217;s case this was somewhat modified by feudal and commercial development and the need to keep the nobility, clergy, and &#8220;the Mob&#8221; at least somewhat placated with the iron hand kept in a velvet glove.</p>
<p>(Dumas actually gives a decent overview of this sort of stuff, even if his work is largely historical fiction.)</p>
<p>Similar sort of happened in Russia but it took a DRASTIC U-Turn due to the Mongols (among other things), with an even more suffocating, powerful, autocratic despot (literally) arising, whom even the most powerful nobility had to address while referring to themselves as &#8220;your slaves.&#8221; Helped by burning down and purging a lot of cities that tried to compete.</p>
<p>When the Tsar of Moscow conquered parts of the Baltic Coast and decided to build a new &#8220;Western&#8221; Capital, power moved there (even if Moscow never entirely lost its prestige, population, or importance).</p>
<p>That along with the traditions of utterly authoritarian centralized power meant that when that power faltered and then fell apart (as happened in the Time of Troubles and during WWI) utter chaos ensued. There was a provisional republic helped along by the remnants of the military and bureaucratic elite that tried to cobble together some kind of democratic system, but it would&#8217;ve been a trying task even during peacetime, and without the Bolsheviks (with lots of German funds and guns) trying to play.</p>
<p>The US was literally built different even more foundationally than France, as a union of colonies/states used to self-government and forced to depend on themselves. Centralization (especially since the Civil War and particularly the 1960s) has hurt that but there are still robust state level organizations and a civic community on the grassroots. That&#8217;s probably done more to explain why AT THE MOMENT a hard Commie Takeover in DC wouldn&#8217;t lead to the rest of the US Falling.</p>
<p>At least yet.</p>
<p>Likewise, it&#8217;s also worth noting that Paris came to prominence in part due to its Count Odo rebelling against an ineffective Frankish leader after being forced to fight the Vikings off alone.</p>
<p>But they obviously want to centralize power, and our Federalist inheritance cannot be abused forever and still be a viable shield.</p>
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		<title>
		By: Turtler		</title>
		<link>https://thenewneo.com/2023/05/04/proud-boys-convicted-of-seditious-conspiracy/#comment-2678474</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Turtler]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 05 May 2023 19:58:22 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://www.thenewneo.com/?p=125669#comment-2678474</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[The more I see it, the more I am convinced DC needs to be stripped of what local government and population it has. This disgusts me, and I imagine it is partially an intentional move.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The more I see it, the more I am convinced DC needs to be stripped of what local government and population it has. This disgusts me, and I imagine it is partially an intentional move.</p>
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		<title>
		By: Abraxas		</title>
		<link>https://thenewneo.com/2023/05/04/proud-boys-convicted-of-seditious-conspiracy/#comment-2678445</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Abraxas]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 05 May 2023 15:57:20 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://www.thenewneo.com/?p=125669#comment-2678445</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[Could an appeal arguing that these trials should have been moved from DC, where a fair trial was impossible, succeed?

I remember Birchers years ago arguing that centralization of government in DC would make a Communist revolution in the capital into a takeover of the whole country, in the same way that Lenin&#039;s Petrograd revolution meant a change of government for Russia. Of course the October Revolution was followed by a bloody civil war, but somehow seizing St. Petersburg and Moscow made them legitimate in many Russian&#039;s eyes) .  

January 6th wasn&#039;t going to overthrow anything, but the French and their neighbors were always concerned that disturbances in Paris would mean revolution in the country.  &quot;When Paris sneezes, Europe catches a cold.&quot; The Democrats may have tapped into some people&#039;s primal fears, but it&#039;s getting hard to tell real fears from feelings that people take on because they feel they are expected to.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Could an appeal arguing that these trials should have been moved from DC, where a fair trial was impossible, succeed?</p>
<p>I remember Birchers years ago arguing that centralization of government in DC would make a Communist revolution in the capital into a takeover of the whole country, in the same way that Lenin&#8217;s Petrograd revolution meant a change of government for Russia. Of course the October Revolution was followed by a bloody civil war, but somehow seizing St. Petersburg and Moscow made them legitimate in many Russian&#8217;s eyes) .  </p>
<p>January 6th wasn&#8217;t going to overthrow anything, but the French and their neighbors were always concerned that disturbances in Paris would mean revolution in the country.  &#8220;When Paris sneezes, Europe catches a cold.&#8221; The Democrats may have tapped into some people&#8217;s primal fears, but it&#8217;s getting hard to tell real fears from feelings that people take on because they feel they are expected to.</p>
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		<title>
		By: miguel cervantes		</title>
		<link>https://thenewneo.com/2023/05/04/proud-boys-convicted-of-seditious-conspiracy/#comment-2678438</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[miguel cervantes]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 05 May 2023 12:39:20 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://www.thenewneo.com/?p=125669#comment-2678438</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[no the election was stolen because the state legislatures did not do their duty, and now we find ourselves in this dumpsterfire, because the court was intimidated from challenging the fraud,]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>no the election was stolen because the state legislatures did not do their duty, and now we find ourselves in this dumpsterfire, because the court was intimidated from challenging the fraud,</p>
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		<title>
		By: JFM		</title>
		<link>https://thenewneo.com/2023/05/04/proud-boys-convicted-of-seditious-conspiracy/#comment-2678437</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[JFM]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 05 May 2023 12:29:45 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://www.thenewneo.com/?p=125669#comment-2678437</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[I had a discussion a while back with a friend (who is very much a Leftist) about the J6 riot. I asked him what did he think about the “attack on democracy “ and all that.  He thought it would give time to Trump to get a recount. I asked him where in the Constitution it allowed that. He had no answer. I told him nothing would have happened. For the love of God, the British burned down down the Capital! Did American democracy die? I think the people who thought this was an attempt to overthrow our government somehow believe that American democracy flows from Washington D.C. and nowhere else. This is what happens when people have no idea how our system of government works.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I had a discussion a while back with a friend (who is very much a Leftist) about the J6 riot. I asked him what did he think about the “attack on democracy “ and all that.  He thought it would give time to Trump to get a recount. I asked him where in the Constitution it allowed that. He had no answer. I told him nothing would have happened. For the love of God, the British burned down down the Capital! Did American democracy die? I think the people who thought this was an attempt to overthrow our government somehow believe that American democracy flows from Washington D.C. and nowhere else. This is what happens when people have no idea how our system of government works.</p>
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		<title>
		By: stan		</title>
		<link>https://thenewneo.com/2023/05/04/proud-boys-convicted-of-seditious-conspiracy/#comment-2678436</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[stan]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 05 May 2023 11:52:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://www.thenewneo.com/?p=125669#comment-2678436</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[&quot;how successful the left has been&quot;

No, how vicious and corrupt the left has been. 

They&#039;ve only been &#039;successful&#039; if the goal is advancing the nation closer to a shooting civil war.

There isn&#039;t any legitimate way for them to argue that these persecutions are good for the country. When Republicans start using them on Democrats they&#039;ll scream. And thereby admit just how sick and disgusting they are.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;how successful the left has been&#8221;</p>
<p>No, how vicious and corrupt the left has been. </p>
<p>They&#8217;ve only been &#8216;successful&#8217; if the goal is advancing the nation closer to a shooting civil war.</p>
<p>There isn&#8217;t any legitimate way for them to argue that these persecutions are good for the country. When Republicans start using them on Democrats they&#8217;ll scream. And thereby admit just how sick and disgusting they are.</p>
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		<title>
		By: JJ		</title>
		<link>https://thenewneo.com/2023/05/04/proud-boys-convicted-of-seditious-conspiracy/#comment-2678431</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[JJ]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 05 May 2023 03:06:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://www.thenewneo.com/?p=125669#comment-2678431</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[Neo, thanks for the thumbs up.  Yes, the overriding motivation was always to get rid of the Donald. And the beat goes on.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Neo, thanks for the thumbs up.  Yes, the overriding motivation was always to get rid of the Donald. And the beat goes on.</p>
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		<title>
		By: SCOTTtheBADGER		</title>
		<link>https://thenewneo.com/2023/05/04/proud-boys-convicted-of-seditious-conspiracy/#comment-2678427</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[SCOTTtheBADGER]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 05 May 2023 02:02:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://www.thenewneo.com/?p=125669#comment-2678427</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[The Left likes claim that &quot; the adults are in charge &quot;, when they are in power. It looks to me more as if the 16 year old girls are in charge.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The Left likes claim that &#8221; the adults are in charge &#8220;, when they are in power. It looks to me more as if the 16 year old girls are in charge.</p>
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