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	Comments on: The feminization of the university	</title>
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	<link>https://thenewneo.com/2023/03/06/the-feminization-of-the-university/</link>
	<description>A blog about political change, among other things</description>
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		<title>
		By: David Foster		</title>
		<link>https://thenewneo.com/2023/03/06/the-feminization-of-the-university/#comment-2670231</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[David Foster]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 09 Mar 2023 14:00:55 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://www.thenewneo.com/?p=124444#comment-2670231</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[Steve Malunn...&quot;He was encouraged to publish his thesis, his response: “are you crazy, if I did I would never get a job in academia.”

A few years ago, it was revealed that the senior PR executive at Boeing had...more than 2 decades earlier, when he was a Navy pilot...published a paper arguing against the use of women as combat pilots.

He was forced out of his job.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Steve Malunn&#8230;&#8221;He was encouraged to publish his thesis, his response: “are you crazy, if I did I would never get a job in academia.”</p>
<p>A few years ago, it was revealed that the senior PR executive at Boeing had&#8230;more than 2 decades earlier, when he was a Navy pilot&#8230;published a paper arguing against the use of women as combat pilots.</p>
<p>He was forced out of his job.</p>
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		<title>
		By: Steve Malynn		</title>
		<link>https://thenewneo.com/2023/03/06/the-feminization-of-the-university/#comment-2670230</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Steve Malynn]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 09 Mar 2023 13:56:55 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://www.thenewneo.com/?p=124444#comment-2670230</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[25+ years ago a fellow Marine retired and completed his PhD in management, his dissertation topic compared leadership styles of women and men executives. 

He was encouraged to publish his thesis, his response: &quot;are you crazy, if I did I would never get a job in academia.&quot;

His data showed female executives tended more political, vicious and likely to undermine co-workers, as they worked towards promotion. Perhaps necessary up to that time (1990s), but not constructive traits. 

He did go on to work at UVa, in the administration, not as a prof.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>25+ years ago a fellow Marine retired and completed his PhD in management, his dissertation topic compared leadership styles of women and men executives. </p>
<p>He was encouraged to publish his thesis, his response: &#8220;are you crazy, if I did I would never get a job in academia.&#8221;</p>
<p>His data showed female executives tended more political, vicious and likely to undermine co-workers, as they worked towards promotion. Perhaps necessary up to that time (1990s), but not constructive traits. </p>
<p>He did go on to work at UVa, in the administration, not as a prof.</p>
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		<title>
		By: Barry Meislin		</title>
		<link>https://thenewneo.com/2023/03/06/the-feminization-of-the-university/#comment-2670049</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Barry Meislin]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 08 Mar 2023 14:11:20 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://www.thenewneo.com/?p=124444#comment-2670049</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[...except that walking &quot;off the cliff together&quot; seems to be the goal.

BTW, I very much like the concept of &quot;progressor&quot;. 
(You may have---if inadvertently---coined an ingenious job title! And college major!!)

...One perfectly suited for today&#039;s &quot;woke-work/study/living/coercing&quot; environment (and also perfect for walking off cliffs...but not before causing as much damage as possible....).]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8230;except that walking &#8220;off the cliff together&#8221; seems to be the goal.</p>
<p>BTW, I very much like the concept of &#8220;progressor&#8221;.<br />
(You may have&#8212;if inadvertently&#8212;coined an ingenious job title! And college major!!)</p>
<p>&#8230;One perfectly suited for today&#8217;s &#8220;woke-work/study/living/coercing&#8221; environment (and also perfect for walking off cliffs&#8230;but not before causing as much damage as possible&#8230;.).</p>
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		<title>
		By: David Foster		</title>
		<link>https://thenewneo.com/2023/03/06/the-feminization-of-the-university/#comment-2670045</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[David Foster]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 08 Mar 2023 13:05:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://www.thenewneo.com/?p=124444#comment-2670045</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[AesopFan...years ago, I was at a company management training program where we had several interesting outside speakers, one of whom was a psych progessor of the Jungian persuasion. He talked about personality types, and how natural it feels to hire people who are like you..and: You must resist this tendency, or you will all have the same blind spots and will happily all walk off the cliff together.

This is a kind of &#039;diversity&#039; that is pretty much totally ignored in today&#039;s Diversity discussions.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>AesopFan&#8230;years ago, I was at a company management training program where we had several interesting outside speakers, one of whom was a psych progessor of the Jungian persuasion. He talked about personality types, and how natural it feels to hire people who are like you..and: You must resist this tendency, or you will all have the same blind spots and will happily all walk off the cliff together.</p>
<p>This is a kind of &#8216;diversity&#8217; that is pretty much totally ignored in today&#8217;s Diversity discussions.</p>
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		<title>
		By: AesopFan		</title>
		<link>https://thenewneo.com/2023/03/06/the-feminization-of-the-university/#comment-2670006</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[AesopFan]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 08 Mar 2023 04:29:23 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://www.thenewneo.com/?p=124444#comment-2670006</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[About 30 years ago, I got interested in the various methods of determining and analyzing personality types, such as the Myers-Briggs Type Inventory and its variants, and other systems.
https://www.myersbriggs.org/my-mbti-personality-type/mbti-basics/

I don&#039;t buy into the underlying Jungian jargon, but I do think he and his successors sorted out the major personality preferences accurately enough to be useful. It&#039;s used a lot in career counseling; not as a hard-and-fast rule in the sense that &quot;Type X could never be happy in Job Y&quot; but helping to identify where you might actually be more comfortable working.
https://careerassessmentsite.com/myers-briggs-test/mbti-personality-types/careers/istj/

We and all the boys &quot;typed&quot; ourselves, and it helped in defusing conflicts for them to remember &quot;oh yeah, he&#039;s the Extrovert&quot; or having the Thinking types (a majority of our crew) consciously adjusting to work with the Feeling brother (and vice versa) -- instead of just believing something was wrong with&lt;em&gt; them &lt;/em&gt; (or the other guys).

What was most helpful to me was learning that all personality traits (and their 4-part types) are exhibited by both men and women, but their distributions for the sexes (there are only two) are not the same.

https://www.slayerment.com/mbti-gender

I am an ISTJ, which is much more prevalent among men, but not unknown among women.
FWIW, I would &lt;em&gt;much&lt;/em&gt; rather work with Sgt Mom&#039;s NCOs than the officers&#039; wives&#039; club, but over the years I have learned how to do both, mostly by treating groups that function differently than I would as a field exercise in anthropological observation.

My children believe I should have been either a drill sergeant or the Mother Superior of a medieval abbey.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>About 30 years ago, I got interested in the various methods of determining and analyzing personality types, such as the Myers-Briggs Type Inventory and its variants, and other systems.<br />
<a href="https://www.myersbriggs.org/my-mbti-personality-type/mbti-basics/" rel="nofollow ugc">https://www.myersbriggs.org/my-mbti-personality-type/mbti-basics/</a></p>
<p>I don&#8217;t buy into the underlying Jungian jargon, but I do think he and his successors sorted out the major personality preferences accurately enough to be useful. It&#8217;s used a lot in career counseling; not as a hard-and-fast rule in the sense that &#8220;Type X could never be happy in Job Y&#8221; but helping to identify where you might actually be more comfortable working.<br />
<a href="https://careerassessmentsite.com/myers-briggs-test/mbti-personality-types/careers/istj/" rel="nofollow ugc">https://careerassessmentsite.com/myers-briggs-test/mbti-personality-types/careers/istj/</a></p>
<p>We and all the boys &#8220;typed&#8221; ourselves, and it helped in defusing conflicts for them to remember &#8220;oh yeah, he&#8217;s the Extrovert&#8221; or having the Thinking types (a majority of our crew) consciously adjusting to work with the Feeling brother (and vice versa) &#8212; instead of just believing something was wrong with<em> them </em> (or the other guys).</p>
<p>What was most helpful to me was learning that all personality traits (and their 4-part types) are exhibited by both men and women, but their distributions for the sexes (there are only two) are not the same.</p>
<p><a href="https://www.slayerment.com/mbti-gender" rel="nofollow ugc">https://www.slayerment.com/mbti-gender</a></p>
<p>I am an ISTJ, which is much more prevalent among men, but not unknown among women.<br />
FWIW, I would <em>much</em> rather work with Sgt Mom&#8217;s NCOs than the officers&#8217; wives&#8217; club, but over the years I have learned how to do both, mostly by treating groups that function differently than I would as a field exercise in anthropological observation.</p>
<p>My children believe I should have been either a drill sergeant or the Mother Superior of a medieval abbey.</p>
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		<title>
		By: TommyJay		</title>
		<link>https://thenewneo.com/2023/03/06/the-feminization-of-the-university/#comment-2670004</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[TommyJay]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 08 Mar 2023 04:02:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://www.thenewneo.com/?p=124444#comment-2670004</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[Bruce Hayden &#038; Richard Aubrey,

Interesting points.  I hadn&#039;t heard of Richard&#039;s point.

Bruce&#039;s points are a slightly different tangent to mine.  I think women&#039;s groups can be more cliquish than men&#039;s.  Things like a husband&#039;s military rank is just one of many things that can factor into being included or excluded in a clique.  I get Bruce&#039;s point about male hierarchy.  Perhaps because my environment was an academic one, I didn&#039;t see that much.

To overgeneralize my earlier point, both men and women can lose control of their egos, and it tends to manifest differently.  Cliquish behavior is a particularly unhelpful(?) manifestation. 

On yet another tangent, I really like the pro&#039;s vs. con&#039;s style of analysis even though it is supposed to be poor editorial or op-ed practice.  In a group problem solving environment, I&#039;m not sure.  I can see the advantages, but also that it could diffuse the focus and slow the process.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Bruce Hayden &amp; Richard Aubrey,</p>
<p>Interesting points.  I hadn&#8217;t heard of Richard&#8217;s point.</p>
<p>Bruce&#8217;s points are a slightly different tangent to mine.  I think women&#8217;s groups can be more cliquish than men&#8217;s.  Things like a husband&#8217;s military rank is just one of many things that can factor into being included or excluded in a clique.  I get Bruce&#8217;s point about male hierarchy.  Perhaps because my environment was an academic one, I didn&#8217;t see that much.</p>
<p>To overgeneralize my earlier point, both men and women can lose control of their egos, and it tends to manifest differently.  Cliquish behavior is a particularly unhelpful(?) manifestation. </p>
<p>On yet another tangent, I really like the pro&#8217;s vs. con&#8217;s style of analysis even though it is supposed to be poor editorial or op-ed practice.  In a group problem solving environment, I&#8217;m not sure.  I can see the advantages, but also that it could diffuse the focus and slow the process.</p>
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		<title>
		By: TommyJay		</title>
		<link>https://thenewneo.com/2023/03/06/the-feminization-of-the-university/#comment-2670000</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[TommyJay]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 08 Mar 2023 03:38:50 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://www.thenewneo.com/?p=124444#comment-2670000</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[&lt;i&gt;... the greatest educational institution in American history was the US Army Air Corps as it taught 200,000 men to fly in three years.&lt;/i&gt;

If I understand the reference correctly, there were also a large group of women in the US and UK who flew the fighters and bombers from the point of manufacture to remote hubs or distribution points.  In the US, some of those hubs were places where extensive retrofitting was done either for the Pacific theater or the European theater.  According to a documentary I saw, while it wasn&#039;t combat, it wasn&#039;t a trivial job either.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><i>&#8230; the greatest educational institution in American history was the US Army Air Corps as it taught 200,000 men to fly in three years.</i></p>
<p>If I understand the reference correctly, there were also a large group of women in the US and UK who flew the fighters and bombers from the point of manufacture to remote hubs or distribution points.  In the US, some of those hubs were places where extensive retrofitting was done either for the Pacific theater or the European theater.  According to a documentary I saw, while it wasn&#8217;t combat, it wasn&#8217;t a trivial job either.</p>
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		<title>
		By: David Foster		</title>
		<link>https://thenewneo.com/2023/03/06/the-feminization-of-the-university/#comment-2669957</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[David Foster]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 07 Mar 2023 22:42:51 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://www.thenewneo.com/?p=124444#comment-2669957</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[Also during WWII, there was a program called &#039;Training Within Industry&#039; to help people learn to work effectively in a variety of manufacturing jobs:

https://www.lean.org/lexicon-terms/training-within-industry-twi/]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Also during WWII, there was a program called &#8216;Training Within Industry&#8217; to help people learn to work effectively in a variety of manufacturing jobs:</p>
<p><a href="https://www.lean.org/lexicon-terms/training-within-industry-twi/" rel="nofollow ugc">https://www.lean.org/lexicon-terms/training-within-industry-twi/</a></p>
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		<title>
		By: David Foster		</title>
		<link>https://thenewneo.com/2023/03/06/the-feminization-of-the-university/#comment-2669956</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[David Foster]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 07 Mar 2023 22:38:48 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://www.thenewneo.com/?p=124444#comment-2669956</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[Here&#039;s some info as to how the Air Corps training program worked:

https://www.nationalmuseum.af.mil/Visit/Museum-Exhibits/Fact-Sheets/Display/Article/196138/aaf-training-during-wwii/

Note that the primary training was done by contracted civilian flight instructors.  A little surprising that there were enough of them.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Here&#8217;s some info as to how the Air Corps training program worked:</p>
<p><a href="https://www.nationalmuseum.af.mil/Visit/Museum-Exhibits/Fact-Sheets/Display/Article/196138/aaf-training-during-wwii/" rel="nofollow ugc">https://www.nationalmuseum.af.mil/Visit/Museum-Exhibits/Fact-Sheets/Display/Article/196138/aaf-training-during-wwii/</a></p>
<p>Note that the primary training was done by contracted civilian flight instructors.  A little surprising that there were enough of them.</p>
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		<title>
		By: Gringo		</title>
		<link>https://thenewneo.com/2023/03/06/the-feminization-of-the-university/#comment-2669950</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Gringo]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 07 Mar 2023 22:21:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://www.thenewneo.com/?p=124444#comment-2669950</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[Mike K
&lt;blockquote&gt; One time, later in the period, I mentioned in a faculty meeting that the greatest educational institution in American history was the US Army Air Corps as it taught 200,000 men to fly in three years. That was not a popular sentiment in the female faculty.&lt;/blockquote&gt;

Such as Ted Williams, who became a pilot- and by most measures an outstanding one- without any college. Those tests picked out his talent. Ted may have been a stubborn so-and-so, but he wasn&#039;t stupid, and those tests detected that. I can think of other examples of the armed forces tests picking out talent among my relatives that would have otherwise not been noticed.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Mike K</p>
<blockquote><p> One time, later in the period, I mentioned in a faculty meeting that the greatest educational institution in American history was the US Army Air Corps as it taught 200,000 men to fly in three years. That was not a popular sentiment in the female faculty.</p></blockquote>
<p>Such as Ted Williams, who became a pilot- and by most measures an outstanding one- without any college. Those tests picked out his talent. Ted may have been a stubborn so-and-so, but he wasn&#8217;t stupid, and those tests detected that. I can think of other examples of the armed forces tests picking out talent among my relatives that would have otherwise not been noticed.</p>
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