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	Comments on: Tomorrow it will have been 21 years since 9/11	</title>
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	<link>https://thenewneo.com/2022/09/10/its-been-21-years-since-9-11/</link>
	<description>A blog about political change, among other things</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Wed, 14 Sep 2022 04:16:42 +0000</lastBuildDate>
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		<title>
		By: HC68		</title>
		<link>https://thenewneo.com/2022/09/10/its-been-21-years-since-9-11/#comment-2642678</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[HC68]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 14 Sep 2022 04:16:42 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://www.thenewneo.com/?p=120402#comment-2642678</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[One interesting thing I&#039;ve noticed about 911 is how deeply many of the hard core idealogues in both American parties and political alignments _don&#039;t want to talk about it_ .  They have different, almost opposite reasons, but the same reaction.

The left hates to talk about it because it screws up their vision of one world, one culture, one secular system.  John Lennon&#039;s _Imagine_ is their unspoken anthem, and 911 makes a mockery of it.

A lot of right-wing commentators hate it because it screws up their vision where America goes back to being just one ordinary country, bring the troops home and mind our own business.  So they try to pretend it didn&#039;t happen or was a one-off freak.

I&#039;ve lost count of how many right-wing commentators talk about Iraq and Afghanistan as if they were a whim, as if we went there on some idealistic crusade to spread democracy for its own sake.  Often they&#039;ll write lengthy pieces decrying the war efforts in both places without even _mentioning_ 911, or the fact that the attacks were planned and launched from Afghanistan, or that we were already embroiled in Iraq before 911 and bin Laden himself said that he saw our fumbling with Saddam (and in Ethiopia as well) as proof of our weakness of will.

911 is really, really inconvenient for a lot of people.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>One interesting thing I&#8217;ve noticed about 911 is how deeply many of the hard core idealogues in both American parties and political alignments _don&#8217;t want to talk about it_ .  They have different, almost opposite reasons, but the same reaction.</p>
<p>The left hates to talk about it because it screws up their vision of one world, one culture, one secular system.  John Lennon&#8217;s _Imagine_ is their unspoken anthem, and 911 makes a mockery of it.</p>
<p>A lot of right-wing commentators hate it because it screws up their vision where America goes back to being just one ordinary country, bring the troops home and mind our own business.  So they try to pretend it didn&#8217;t happen or was a one-off freak.</p>
<p>I&#8217;ve lost count of how many right-wing commentators talk about Iraq and Afghanistan as if they were a whim, as if we went there on some idealistic crusade to spread democracy for its own sake.  Often they&#8217;ll write lengthy pieces decrying the war efforts in both places without even _mentioning_ 911, or the fact that the attacks were planned and launched from Afghanistan, or that we were already embroiled in Iraq before 911 and bin Laden himself said that he saw our fumbling with Saddam (and in Ethiopia as well) as proof of our weakness of will.</p>
<p>911 is really, really inconvenient for a lot of people.</p>
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		<item>
		<title>
		By: HC68		</title>
		<link>https://thenewneo.com/2022/09/10/its-been-21-years-since-9-11/#comment-2642675</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[HC68]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 14 Sep 2022 04:06:04 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://www.thenewneo.com/?p=120402#comment-2642675</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[JJ wrote:

_1. Become so strong militarily that you are unbeatable. (I’d always thought that was a good idea, but the left never did.)
2.Make defensive alliances with other democracies but insist that they carry their fair share of the load.
3. Engage in free trade with any nation, but only if it’s free and reciprocal.
4. Be firm with your adversaries. Don’t let them cheat you, steal from you, or bully you.
5. Don’t meddle in other countries’ affairs.
6. If you have to use military force, don’t hold back. Fight to win in as short a time as possible. (Obama fought ISIS for three years with many restrictive rules of engagement. Trump let the Special Ops loose and beat ISIS in eight months.)
7. Our borders must be secure. Illegal immigration is a cancer on our society. We are a nation of immigrants, but we have a procedure for coming here legally. It must be enforced.
8. All major political decisions must be made by putting the interests and welfare of the USA first._

Most of that was always part of basic, sincere conservatism, as opposed to the elite version espoused by the GOP politicians and big business types over the last 30 years.  Unfortunately, there are two big issues with it.

The first is that the elite class that provides the personnel for the top of both parties, the business world, and the academic world is internationalist at a cultural level.  It&#039;s the same dominant elite in both parties, and indeed in most Western countries.  The same West-wide elite class that loathes and hates Trump in the USA struggled for years to block Brexit in the UK (and still tries to undercut British independence now).  That same West-wide elite class (maybe 20% of the total population) is super-secular, wants to reduce Christianity to nothing more than a personal trope irrelevant to the government and society, wants borders dissolved, finds patriotism embarrassing or worse, and struggles constantly to maintain control.

The other big issue is that the world has shrunk down to less than 1 day wide due to modern travel and communications.  Under those circumstances, &#039;don&#039;t meddle in other countries&#039; affairs&#039; is simply _impossible_.

The world is like a group of people, maybe a few families of nations, jammed inescapably into a single big house.  They _can&#039;t_ stay out of each other&#039;s hair.

Likewise, the &#039;don&#039;t hold back in war&#039; often isn&#039;t possible.  The nuclear bomb changed the rules, so war tends to turn into just the sort of limited engagements Americans _loathe_ , but at the same time can&#039;t necessarily stay out of.

Trump correctly recognized that it&#039;s good for America to have a civil relationship (not necessarily friendly, just civil) with Russia and other nuclear powers, for just that reason.

But the simple facts of life mean that in a nuclear age, warfare is often by proxy, often unavoidable, and usually must be waged with limited means to avoid escalation.  Also, sometimes you can&#039;t do what seems natural because of nasty side effects.

After 911, a lot of people were calling for America to destroy Mecca, for ex.  Bush, to his credit, refused, and rightly.  Bombing Mecca would have set the world on fire.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>JJ wrote:</p>
<p>_1. Become so strong militarily that you are unbeatable. (I’d always thought that was a good idea, but the left never did.)<br />
2.Make defensive alliances with other democracies but insist that they carry their fair share of the load.<br />
3. Engage in free trade with any nation, but only if it’s free and reciprocal.<br />
4. Be firm with your adversaries. Don’t let them cheat you, steal from you, or bully you.<br />
5. Don’t meddle in other countries’ affairs.<br />
6. If you have to use military force, don’t hold back. Fight to win in as short a time as possible. (Obama fought ISIS for three years with many restrictive rules of engagement. Trump let the Special Ops loose and beat ISIS in eight months.)<br />
7. Our borders must be secure. Illegal immigration is a cancer on our society. We are a nation of immigrants, but we have a procedure for coming here legally. It must be enforced.<br />
8. All major political decisions must be made by putting the interests and welfare of the USA first._</p>
<p>Most of that was always part of basic, sincere conservatism, as opposed to the elite version espoused by the GOP politicians and big business types over the last 30 years.  Unfortunately, there are two big issues with it.</p>
<p>The first is that the elite class that provides the personnel for the top of both parties, the business world, and the academic world is internationalist at a cultural level.  It&#8217;s the same dominant elite in both parties, and indeed in most Western countries.  The same West-wide elite class that loathes and hates Trump in the USA struggled for years to block Brexit in the UK (and still tries to undercut British independence now).  That same West-wide elite class (maybe 20% of the total population) is super-secular, wants to reduce Christianity to nothing more than a personal trope irrelevant to the government and society, wants borders dissolved, finds patriotism embarrassing or worse, and struggles constantly to maintain control.</p>
<p>The other big issue is that the world has shrunk down to less than 1 day wide due to modern travel and communications.  Under those circumstances, &#8216;don&#8217;t meddle in other countries&#8217; affairs&#8217; is simply _impossible_.</p>
<p>The world is like a group of people, maybe a few families of nations, jammed inescapably into a single big house.  They _can&#8217;t_ stay out of each other&#8217;s hair.</p>
<p>Likewise, the &#8216;don&#8217;t hold back in war&#8217; often isn&#8217;t possible.  The nuclear bomb changed the rules, so war tends to turn into just the sort of limited engagements Americans _loathe_ , but at the same time can&#8217;t necessarily stay out of.</p>
<p>Trump correctly recognized that it&#8217;s good for America to have a civil relationship (not necessarily friendly, just civil) with Russia and other nuclear powers, for just that reason.</p>
<p>But the simple facts of life mean that in a nuclear age, warfare is often by proxy, often unavoidable, and usually must be waged with limited means to avoid escalation.  Also, sometimes you can&#8217;t do what seems natural because of nasty side effects.</p>
<p>After 911, a lot of people were calling for America to destroy Mecca, for ex.  Bush, to his credit, refused, and rightly.  Bombing Mecca would have set the world on fire.</p>
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		<title>
		By: miguel cervantes		</title>
		<link>https://thenewneo.com/2022/09/10/its-been-21-years-since-9-11/#comment-2642432</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[miguel cervantes]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 12 Sep 2022 16:36:02 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://www.thenewneo.com/?p=120402#comment-2642432</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[it&#039;s that joke, about it&#039;s always crowded, no one goes there,

CAIR is the political wing of Wahhabism, and Deobandism, the indian branch, so like the NAACP they certify who is truly moslem, and who is not,]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>it&#8217;s that joke, about it&#8217;s always crowded, no one goes there,</p>
<p>CAIR is the political wing of Wahhabism, and Deobandism, the indian branch, so like the NAACP they certify who is truly moslem, and who is not,</p>
]]></content:encoded>
		
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		<title>
		By: Richard Aubrey		</title>
		<link>https://thenewneo.com/2022/09/10/its-been-21-years-since-9-11/#comment-2642430</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Richard Aubrey]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 12 Sep 2022 16:31:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://www.thenewneo.com/?p=120402#comment-2642430</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[Miguel.  I get that.  Point is, if wahabism is so bad we have to separate it from &quot;Islam&quot; in order to convince outselves &quot;Islam&quot; is peaceful, then what does it mean that there are as many as one functioning Wahabi mosque.
And, since we&#039;ve made this distinction to the detriment of the Wahabi, shouldn&#039;t we be keeping a really close eye on the Wahabi mosque attendees?  I crack myself up. NASCAR attendees are more of a threat--see the current Establishment--than any Moslem anybody can think of.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Miguel.  I get that.  Point is, if wahabism is so bad we have to separate it from &#8220;Islam&#8221; in order to convince outselves &#8220;Islam&#8221; is peaceful, then what does it mean that there are as many as one functioning Wahabi mosque.<br />
And, since we&#8217;ve made this distinction to the detriment of the Wahabi, shouldn&#8217;t we be keeping a really close eye on the Wahabi mosque attendees?  I crack myself up. NASCAR attendees are more of a threat&#8211;see the current Establishment&#8211;than any Moslem anybody can think of.</p>
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		<title>
		By: Miguel cervantes		</title>
		<link>https://thenewneo.com/2022/09/10/its-been-21-years-since-9-11/#comment-2642406</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Miguel cervantes]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 12 Sep 2022 12:56:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://www.thenewneo.com/?p=120402#comment-2642406</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[Theres a novel by a young woman saudi novel raja alem sarab this one is about the grand mosque siege by the leader of an ikwan tribe and a french paratrooper who helped break it its about the mindset that drove the hijackers]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Theres a novel by a young woman saudi novel raja alem sarab this one is about the grand mosque siege by the leader of an ikwan tribe and a french paratrooper who helped break it its about the mindset that drove the hijackers</p>
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		<title>
		By: Miguel cervantes		</title>
		<link>https://thenewneo.com/2022/09/10/its-been-21-years-since-9-11/#comment-2642405</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Miguel cervantes]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 12 Sep 2022 12:51:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://www.thenewneo.com/?p=120402#comment-2642405</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[Non wahabi mosques are like main line churches here]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Non wahabi mosques are like main line churches here</p>
]]></content:encoded>
		
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		<title>
		By: Richard Aubrey		</title>
		<link>https://thenewneo.com/2022/09/10/its-been-21-years-since-9-11/#comment-2642399</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Richard Aubrey]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 12 Sep 2022 11:14:55 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://www.thenewneo.com/?p=120402#comment-2642399</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[Problem with the moderate Muslim issue/mantra  is how come Wahabi mosques have any attendance?
Speaking of the US, of course.  Are we allowed to notice?]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Problem with the moderate Muslim issue/mantra  is how come Wahabi mosques have any attendance?<br />
Speaking of the US, of course.  Are we allowed to notice?</p>
]]></content:encoded>
		
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		<title>
		By: miguel cervantes		</title>
		<link>https://thenewneo.com/2022/09/10/its-been-21-years-since-9-11/#comment-2642368</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[miguel cervantes]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 11 Sep 2022 21:50:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://www.thenewneo.com/?p=120402#comment-2642368</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[as usual, the question is more complex then we realize, wahhabism is the state faith in the kingdom, and yet the royals, are yet considered munafakim (hypocrites) for not being privately devout, members of the government abroad like the islamic affairs ministry, did support the hijackers, not a few of them had done work for the regime overseas in the balkans and the caucasus, the last ikwan rising was due to the excessive wealth derived from the post embargo oil boom, then the market collapsed in order to crush Russian oil production]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>as usual, the question is more complex then we realize, wahhabism is the state faith in the kingdom, and yet the royals, are yet considered munafakim (hypocrites) for not being privately devout, members of the government abroad like the islamic affairs ministry, did support the hijackers, not a few of them had done work for the regime overseas in the balkans and the caucasus, the last ikwan rising was due to the excessive wealth derived from the post embargo oil boom, then the market collapsed in order to crush Russian oil production</p>
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		<title>
		By: Barry Meislin		</title>
		<link>https://thenewneo.com/2022/09/10/its-been-21-years-since-9-11/#comment-2642358</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Barry Meislin]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 11 Sep 2022 18:55:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://www.thenewneo.com/?p=120402#comment-2642358</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[&quot;A world without trust&quot;.
THIS is what the &quot;Biden&quot; administration has been so assiduously---energetically and single-mindedly---endeavoring to &quot;create&quot;...

...A world with manifold and massive crises...

With, unfortunately, great success.
https://www.zerohedge.com/markets/us-creating-shortage-dollars-just-russia-creating-shortage-oil-gas-and-grain]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;A world without trust&#8221;.<br />
THIS is what the &#8220;Biden&#8221; administration has been so assiduously&#8212;energetically and single-mindedly&#8212;endeavoring to &#8220;create&#8221;&#8230;</p>
<p>&#8230;A world with manifold and massive crises&#8230;</p>
<p>With, unfortunately, great success.<br />
<a href="https://www.zerohedge.com/markets/us-creating-shortage-dollars-just-russia-creating-shortage-oil-gas-and-grain" rel="nofollow ugc">https://www.zerohedge.com/markets/us-creating-shortage-dollars-just-russia-creating-shortage-oil-gas-and-grain</a></p>
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		<title>
		By: Barry Meislin		</title>
		<link>https://thenewneo.com/2022/09/10/its-been-21-years-since-9-11/#comment-2642356</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Barry Meislin]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 11 Sep 2022 18:35:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://www.thenewneo.com/?p=120402#comment-2642356</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[Related (alas)...
&quot;The Forgetting of 9/11;
&quot;How did this coordinated mass murder become so irrelevant?&quot;---
https://instapundit.com/541965/

The article describes how the events of 9/11 are &quot;INCONVENIENT&quot; to remember simply because they CAN&#039;T be reconciled with the official &quot;NARRATIVE&quot;...and so they are either conveniently forgotten or mangled beyond recognition.

Though, as noted in the comments above, by the majority---YES, the SILENT MAJORITY---of Americans...and despite the BEST EFFORTS of the Democratic Party and its running dogs in the media, infotech and academia...9/11 will NEVER be forgotten.

Thanks, expat, for reminding us of the Queen&#039;s remarkable decision to begin the Changing of the Guard with by having the Star Spangled Banner played.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Related (alas)&#8230;<br />
&#8220;The Forgetting of 9/11;<br />
&#8220;How did this coordinated mass murder become so irrelevant?&#8221;&#8212;<br />
<a href="https://instapundit.com/541965/" rel="nofollow ugc">https://instapundit.com/541965/</a></p>
<p>The article describes how the events of 9/11 are &#8220;INCONVENIENT&#8221; to remember simply because they CAN&#8217;T be reconciled with the official &#8220;NARRATIVE&#8221;&#8230;and so they are either conveniently forgotten or mangled beyond recognition.</p>
<p>Though, as noted in the comments above, by the majority&#8212;YES, the SILENT MAJORITY&#8212;of Americans&#8230;and despite the BEST EFFORTS of the Democratic Party and its running dogs in the media, infotech and academia&#8230;9/11 will NEVER be forgotten.</p>
<p>Thanks, expat, for reminding us of the Queen&#8217;s remarkable decision to begin the Changing of the Guard with by having the Star Spangled Banner played.</p>
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