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	<title>
	Comments on: Bret Stephens and Paul Krugman of The NY Times give a  double master class in how to admit to being wrong while remaining deeply, deeply wrong	</title>
	<atom:link href="https://thenewneo.com/2022/07/23/bret-stephens-and-paul-krugman-of-the-ny-times-give-a-double-master-class-in-how-to-admit-to-being-wrong-while-remaining-deeply-deeply-wrong/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>https://thenewneo.com/2022/07/23/bret-stephens-and-paul-krugman-of-the-ny-times-give-a-double-master-class-in-how-to-admit-to-being-wrong-while-remaining-deeply-deeply-wrong/</link>
	<description>A blog about political change, among other things</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Tue, 26 Jul 2022 17:10:03 +0000</lastBuildDate>
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		<title>
		By: M Smith		</title>
		<link>https://thenewneo.com/2022/07/23/bret-stephens-and-paul-krugman-of-the-ny-times-give-a-double-master-class-in-how-to-admit-to-being-wrong-while-remaining-deeply-deeply-wrong/#comment-2634450</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[M Smith]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 26 Jul 2022 17:10:03 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://www.thenewneo.com/?p=118926#comment-2634450</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[&quot;Groupthink&quot; was an idea developed decades ago to explain US decision-making on Vietnam and the Bay of Pigs fiasco.

&lt;i&gt;Type I: Overestimations of the group — its power and morality

Illusions of invulnerability creating excessive optimism and encouraging risk taking.
Unquestioned belief in the morality of the group, causing members to ignore the consequences of their actions.

Type II: Closed-mindedness

Rationalizing warnings that might challenge the group&#039;s assumptions.
Stereotyping those who are opposed to the group as weak, evil, biased, spiteful, impotent, or stupid.

Type III: Pressures toward uniformity

Self-censorship of ideas that deviate from the apparent group consensus.
Illusions of unanimity among group members, silence is viewed as agreement.
Direct pressure to conform placed on any member who questions the group, couched in terms of &quot;disloyalty&quot;
Mindguards— self-appointed members who shield the group from dissenting information.&lt;/i&gt;

It&#039;s still around now.  Isn&#039;t it what people were voting for when they voted for Biden and &quot;normal&quot; politics?  The party left criticizes Biden for what they think was too moderate and consensus-oriented an approach.  What really made them angry is that their form of groupthink didn&#039;t prevail over the groupthink of the more Establishment, not so radical Democrats.   Say what you will about the chaos of the Trump years, groupthink wasn&#039;t a problem then.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;Groupthink&#8221; was an idea developed decades ago to explain US decision-making on Vietnam and the Bay of Pigs fiasco.</p>
<p><i>Type I: Overestimations of the group — its power and morality</p>
<p>Illusions of invulnerability creating excessive optimism and encouraging risk taking.<br />
Unquestioned belief in the morality of the group, causing members to ignore the consequences of their actions.</p>
<p>Type II: Closed-mindedness</p>
<p>Rationalizing warnings that might challenge the group&#8217;s assumptions.<br />
Stereotyping those who are opposed to the group as weak, evil, biased, spiteful, impotent, or stupid.</p>
<p>Type III: Pressures toward uniformity</p>
<p>Self-censorship of ideas that deviate from the apparent group consensus.<br />
Illusions of unanimity among group members, silence is viewed as agreement.<br />
Direct pressure to conform placed on any member who questions the group, couched in terms of &#8220;disloyalty&#8221;<br />
Mindguards— self-appointed members who shield the group from dissenting information.</i></p>
<p>It&#8217;s still around now.  Isn&#8217;t it what people were voting for when they voted for Biden and &#8220;normal&#8221; politics?  The party left criticizes Biden for what they think was too moderate and consensus-oriented an approach.  What really made them angry is that their form of groupthink didn&#8217;t prevail over the groupthink of the more Establishment, not so radical Democrats.   Say what you will about the chaos of the Trump years, groupthink wasn&#8217;t a problem then.</p>
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		<title>
		By: Half asleep at the wheel		</title>
		<link>https://thenewneo.com/2022/07/23/bret-stephens-and-paul-krugman-of-the-ny-times-give-a-double-master-class-in-how-to-admit-to-being-wrong-while-remaining-deeply-deeply-wrong/#comment-2634333</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Half asleep at the wheel]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 25 Jul 2022 21:31:34 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://www.thenewneo.com/?p=118926#comment-2634333</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[To paraphrase Bret Stephens: &quot;When I looked at [Stephens], I saw a bigoted blowhard making one ignorant argument after another.&quot;]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>To paraphrase Bret Stephens: &#8220;When I looked at [Stephens], I saw a bigoted blowhard making one ignorant argument after another.&#8221;</p>
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		<title>
		By: Barry Meislin		</title>
		<link>https://thenewneo.com/2022/07/23/bret-stephens-and-paul-krugman-of-the-ny-times-give-a-double-master-class-in-how-to-admit-to-being-wrong-while-remaining-deeply-deeply-wrong/#comment-2634279</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Barry Meislin]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 25 Jul 2022 17:31:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://www.thenewneo.com/?p=118926#comment-2634279</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[Seems they&#039;re all so eager to out-evil the other...
But this guy has delusions of power that are a bit off the deep end...
Scary...
(Hallucinations &#039;R Us?)
- - - - - - - - - - 
And wouldn&#039;t you know it, it&#039;s time for another...REDEFINITION OF TERMS!
Just as Vaccination was dutifully redefined by a desperate CDC (because reality kinda got in the way and wasn&#039;t terribly cooperative); and then &quot;Woman&quot; had to be redefined (at least at first for the benefit of frustrated, mediocre male athletes who couldn&#039;t seem to win any medals); and then practically everything else had to be redefined to be more consistent with Leftist &quot;reality&quot; (AKA insanity)...&quot;Biden&quot; has---SURPRISE!!---decided  that the time is ripe to redefine &quot;Recession&quot;...
&quot;Delusional Biden Admin Front-Runs Recessionary GDP Print... By Redefining Recession&quot;---
https://www.zerohedge.com/political/delusional-biden-admin-front-runs-recessionary-gdp-print-redefining-recession

If &quot;Biden&quot; is in Wonderland than it behooves us all to be.
If &quot;Biden&quot; is naked, then the only logical thing to do is make clothing illegal....
Etc.

One may well wonder what they&#039;ll do when the depression hits....
(Probably have to haul out the &quot;Things-have-never-been-better&quot; tap dance routine and make it mandatory across the land...the idea being that if people are busy tap-dancing 24/7 they won&#039;t notice that the economy has tanked. It&#039;s not original---I stole the idea from Krugman.)]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Seems they&#8217;re all so eager to out-evil the other&#8230;<br />
But this guy has delusions of power that are a bit off the deep end&#8230;<br />
Scary&#8230;<br />
(Hallucinations &#8216;R Us?)<br />
&#8211; &#8211; &#8211; &#8211; &#8211; &#8211; &#8211; &#8211; &#8211; &#8211;<br />
And wouldn&#8217;t you know it, it&#8217;s time for another&#8230;REDEFINITION OF TERMS!<br />
Just as Vaccination was dutifully redefined by a desperate CDC (because reality kinda got in the way and wasn&#8217;t terribly cooperative); and then &#8220;Woman&#8221; had to be redefined (at least at first for the benefit of frustrated, mediocre male athletes who couldn&#8217;t seem to win any medals); and then practically everything else had to be redefined to be more consistent with Leftist &#8220;reality&#8221; (AKA insanity)&#8230;&#8221;Biden&#8221; has&#8212;SURPRISE!!&#8212;decided  that the time is ripe to redefine &#8220;Recession&#8221;&#8230;<br />
&#8220;Delusional Biden Admin Front-Runs Recessionary GDP Print&#8230; By Redefining Recession&#8221;&#8212;<br />
<a href="https://www.zerohedge.com/political/delusional-biden-admin-front-runs-recessionary-gdp-print-redefining-recession" rel="nofollow ugc">https://www.zerohedge.com/political/delusional-biden-admin-front-runs-recessionary-gdp-print-redefining-recession</a></p>
<p>If &#8220;Biden&#8221; is in Wonderland than it behooves us all to be.<br />
If &#8220;Biden&#8221; is naked, then the only logical thing to do is make clothing illegal&#8230;.<br />
Etc.</p>
<p>One may well wonder what they&#8217;ll do when the depression hits&#8230;.<br />
(Probably have to haul out the &#8220;Things-have-never-been-better&#8221; tap dance routine and make it mandatory across the land&#8230;the idea being that if people are busy tap-dancing 24/7 they won&#8217;t notice that the economy has tanked. It&#8217;s not original&#8212;I stole the idea from Krugman.)</p>
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		<title>
		By: om		</title>
		<link>https://thenewneo.com/2022/07/23/bret-stephens-and-paul-krugman-of-the-ny-times-give-a-double-master-class-in-how-to-admit-to-being-wrong-while-remaining-deeply-deeply-wrong/#comment-2634276</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[om]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 25 Jul 2022 17:11:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://www.thenewneo.com/?p=118926#comment-2634276</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[Thanks Barry:

This guy makes Klaus Schwab look like a piker, a dilatente in the court of the Good Idea Fairies.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thanks Barry:</p>
<p>This guy makes Klaus Schwab look like a piker, a dilatente in the court of the Good Idea Fairies.</p>
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		<title>
		By: Barry Meislin		</title>
		<link>https://thenewneo.com/2022/07/23/bret-stephens-and-paul-krugman-of-the-ny-times-give-a-double-master-class-in-how-to-admit-to-being-wrong-while-remaining-deeply-deeply-wrong/#comment-2634273</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Barry Meislin]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 25 Jul 2022 16:50:09 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://www.thenewneo.com/?p=118926#comment-2634273</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[Oh no. Not another NYT icon....
&quot;The Economist Plotting the Brave New World Order;
&quot;NYT darling Herman Daly has plans for you.&quot;---
https://spectator.org/herman-daly-new-world-order/
H/T Blazingcatfur blog.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Oh no. Not another NYT icon&#8230;.<br />
&#8220;The Economist Plotting the Brave New World Order;<br />
&#8220;NYT darling Herman Daly has plans for you.&#8221;&#8212;<br />
<a href="https://spectator.org/herman-daly-new-world-order/" rel="nofollow ugc">https://spectator.org/herman-daly-new-world-order/</a><br />
H/T Blazingcatfur blog.</p>
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		<title>
		By: Reformed Trombonist		</title>
		<link>https://thenewneo.com/2022/07/23/bret-stephens-and-paul-krugman-of-the-ny-times-give-a-double-master-class-in-how-to-admit-to-being-wrong-while-remaining-deeply-deeply-wrong/#comment-2634265</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Reformed Trombonist]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 25 Jul 2022 15:13:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://www.thenewneo.com/?p=118926#comment-2634265</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[Excellent summary, Neo, particularly the discussion of the insufferable Stephens.

Admittedly, it&#039;s like shooting fish in a barrel, but you did it with a nuclear-tipped torpedo.  So well-deserved.

As both an old guy and an old-fashioned guy, I still have a sense of shame.  So, if I were in Stephens&#039; shoes and happened to read your column, I would resign from the NY Times and try to do something with my life.

Forty years ago, when I was in the Air Force, one of the more raunchy expressions that my fellow enlisted folks used when talking about what they&#039;d do after separating, went like this:  &quot;I&#039;m going to get a job cleaning the restrooms at the bus station with my tongue until I get my self-respect back.&quot;

That might be a good place for Stephens to start.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Excellent summary, Neo, particularly the discussion of the insufferable Stephens.</p>
<p>Admittedly, it&#8217;s like shooting fish in a barrel, but you did it with a nuclear-tipped torpedo.  So well-deserved.</p>
<p>As both an old guy and an old-fashioned guy, I still have a sense of shame.  So, if I were in Stephens&#8217; shoes and happened to read your column, I would resign from the NY Times and try to do something with my life.</p>
<p>Forty years ago, when I was in the Air Force, one of the more raunchy expressions that my fellow enlisted folks used when talking about what they&#8217;d do after separating, went like this:  &#8220;I&#8217;m going to get a job cleaning the restrooms at the bus station with my tongue until I get my self-respect back.&#8221;</p>
<p>That might be a good place for Stephens to start.</p>
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		<title>
		By: LeClerc		</title>
		<link>https://thenewneo.com/2022/07/23/bret-stephens-and-paul-krugman-of-the-ny-times-give-a-double-master-class-in-how-to-admit-to-being-wrong-while-remaining-deeply-deeply-wrong/#comment-2634264</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[LeClerc]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 25 Jul 2022 15:01:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://www.thenewneo.com/?p=118926#comment-2634264</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[Stephens and Krugman and Goldberg and Brooks and Blow all toil on A.G. Sulzberger&#039;s thought plantation.

The crops are blighted.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Stephens and Krugman and Goldberg and Brooks and Blow all toil on A.G. Sulzberger&#8217;s thought plantation.</p>
<p>The crops are blighted.</p>
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		<title>
		By: ObloodyHell		</title>
		<link>https://thenewneo.com/2022/07/23/bret-stephens-and-paul-krugman-of-the-ny-times-give-a-double-master-class-in-how-to-admit-to-being-wrong-while-remaining-deeply-deeply-wrong/#comment-2634259</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[ObloodyHell]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 25 Jul 2022 14:36:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://www.thenewneo.com/?p=118926#comment-2634259</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[}}} &lt;i&gt;A big piece of the plan was one-time checks to taxpayers, which we argued would be largely saved rather than spent; another big piece was aid to state and local governments, which we thought would be spent only gradually, over several years.&lt;/i&gt;

&lt;b&gt;What the man just did is admit that he&#039;s a complete, total, fucking imbecile, whose &quot;advice&quot; should be scoffed at by drunken homeless bums.&lt;/b&gt;

&quot;Hey, have some free money!&quot; ?? 

Yeah, no one&#039;s going to spend THAT. Particularly not governments. What planet are you from, you lackwit idiot, that that has not ALWAYS been the nature of the people around you?]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>}}} <i>A big piece of the plan was one-time checks to taxpayers, which we argued would be largely saved rather than spent; another big piece was aid to state and local governments, which we thought would be spent only gradually, over several years.</i></p>
<p><b>What the man just did is admit that he&#8217;s a complete, total, fucking imbecile, whose &#8220;advice&#8221; should be scoffed at by drunken homeless bums.</b></p>
<p>&#8220;Hey, have some free money!&#8221; ?? </p>
<p>Yeah, no one&#8217;s going to spend THAT. Particularly not governments. What planet are you from, you lackwit idiot, that that has not ALWAYS been the nature of the people around you?</p>
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		<title>
		By: om		</title>
		<link>https://thenewneo.com/2022/07/23/bret-stephens-and-paul-krugman-of-the-ny-times-give-a-double-master-class-in-how-to-admit-to-being-wrong-while-remaining-deeply-deeply-wrong/#comment-2634258</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[om]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 25 Jul 2022 14:28:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://www.thenewneo.com/?p=118926#comment-2634258</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[deadroddy:

Not everyone lives paycheck to paycheck in this country, even though the Feds are idiots.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>deadroddy:</p>
<p>Not everyone lives paycheck to paycheck in this country, even though the Feds are idiots.</p>
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		<title>
		By: deadrody		</title>
		<link>https://thenewneo.com/2022/07/23/bret-stephens-and-paul-krugman-of-the-ny-times-give-a-double-master-class-in-how-to-admit-to-being-wrong-while-remaining-deeply-deeply-wrong/#comment-2634252</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[deadrody]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 25 Jul 2022 12:41:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://www.thenewneo.com/?p=118926#comment-2634252</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[Well, the answer is right there in the beginning.  Anyone who believes that one time stimulus checks would go into savings, rather than being spent is an absolute IDIOT.  I don&#039;t know on what planet that might be true, but it sure as hell isn&#039;t on this one.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Well, the answer is right there in the beginning.  Anyone who believes that one time stimulus checks would go into savings, rather than being spent is an absolute IDIOT.  I don&#8217;t know on what planet that might be true, but it sure as hell isn&#8217;t on this one.</p>
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