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	Comments on: Open thread 10/19/21	</title>
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	<link>https://thenewneo.com/2021/10/19/open-thread-10-19-21/</link>
	<description>A blog about political change, among other things</description>
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		<title>
		By: Zaphod		</title>
		<link>https://thenewneo.com/2021/10/19/open-thread-10-19-21/#comment-2583821</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Zaphod]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 20 Oct 2021 04:27:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://www.thenewneo.com/?p=111447#comment-2583821</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[&quot;But I&#039;m Free!!!!&quot;

https://media.gab.com/system/media_attachments/files/088/194/235/original/2c0eddea3a2547c9.jpg]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;But I&#8217;m Free!!!!&#8221;</p>
<p><a href="https://media.gab.com/system/media_attachments/files/088/194/235/original/2c0eddea3a2547c9.jpg" rel="nofollow ugc">https://media.gab.com/system/media_attachments/files/088/194/235/original/2c0eddea3a2547c9.jpg</a></p>
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		<title>
		By: AesopFan		</title>
		<link>https://thenewneo.com/2021/10/19/open-thread-10-19-21/#comment-2583820</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[AesopFan]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 20 Oct 2021 04:24:09 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://www.thenewneo.com/?p=111447#comment-2583820</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[@ Bob &#062; &quot;The Left is Evil — and Liberals Keep Voting for Them&quot;

Prager is much more erudite than I am or will ever be, but his argument is at least parallel to what I said on yesterday&#039;s thread (too long to copy in full).

And, as usual, his arguments are muddy if you don&#039;t use the codebook: 
A modern Liberal is really a Progressive, and modern Conservatives are actually the classical liberals; many progressives claim to believe in liberal values, and some of them actually practiced them in the past, whereas former conservatives didn&#039;t always practice some of the values they claimed to believe in.

It&#039;s complicated.

https://www.thenewneo.com/2021/10/18/how-to-run-america/#comment-2583719
&quot;In re the controversy over “intentional” vs “accident / incompetence” –&quot;

Always nice to find out a credible pundit agrees with me!

Also, Kurt Schlichter&#039;s &quot;obit&quot; for General Powell seems to depict him as one of Prager&#039;s &quot;Liberals who enable the Left.&quot;

https://townhall.com/columnists/kurtschlichter/2021/10/19/colin-powell-and-the-crisis-of-the-boomer-elite-n2597632?utm_campaign=rightrailsticky3

&lt;blockquote&gt;Powell became a reliably Democrat-voting Republican, the kind CNN would wheel out every election cycle to explain how actual Republicans are terrible. 
...
Though he was firmly on the side of the woke pronoun people by the end, he was not one of them. He picked up a rifle; they picked a gender. Powell was a serious man who found himself allied with unserious people.
&lt;/blockquote&gt;


(Other assertions in that post have been discussed elsewhere, beginning here.)
https://www.thenewneo.com/2021/10/18/colin-powell-dies-of-covid-complications/#comment-2583661]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@ Bob &gt; &#8220;The Left is Evil — and Liberals Keep Voting for Them&#8221;</p>
<p>Prager is much more erudite than I am or will ever be, but his argument is at least parallel to what I said on yesterday&#8217;s thread (too long to copy in full).</p>
<p>And, as usual, his arguments are muddy if you don&#8217;t use the codebook:<br />
A modern Liberal is really a Progressive, and modern Conservatives are actually the classical liberals; many progressives claim to believe in liberal values, and some of them actually practiced them in the past, whereas former conservatives didn&#8217;t always practice some of the values they claimed to believe in.</p>
<p>It&#8217;s complicated.</p>
<p><a href="https://www.thenewneo.com/2021/10/18/how-to-run-america/#comment-2583719" rel="nofollow ugc">https://www.thenewneo.com/2021/10/18/how-to-run-america/#comment-2583719</a><br />
&#8220;In re the controversy over “intentional” vs “accident / incompetence” –&#8221;</p>
<p>Always nice to find out a credible pundit agrees with me!</p>
<p>Also, Kurt Schlichter&#8217;s &#8220;obit&#8221; for General Powell seems to depict him as one of Prager&#8217;s &#8220;Liberals who enable the Left.&#8221;</p>
<p><a href="https://townhall.com/columnists/kurtschlichter/2021/10/19/colin-powell-and-the-crisis-of-the-boomer-elite-n2597632?utm_campaign=rightrailsticky3" rel="nofollow ugc">https://townhall.com/columnists/kurtschlichter/2021/10/19/colin-powell-and-the-crisis-of-the-boomer-elite-n2597632?utm_campaign=rightrailsticky3</a></p>
<blockquote><p>Powell became a reliably Democrat-voting Republican, the kind CNN would wheel out every election cycle to explain how actual Republicans are terrible.<br />
&#8230;<br />
Though he was firmly on the side of the woke pronoun people by the end, he was not one of them. He picked up a rifle; they picked a gender. Powell was a serious man who found himself allied with unserious people.
</p></blockquote>
<p>(Other assertions in that post have been discussed elsewhere, beginning here.)<br />
<a href="https://www.thenewneo.com/2021/10/18/colin-powell-dies-of-covid-complications/#comment-2583661" rel="nofollow ugc">https://www.thenewneo.com/2021/10/18/colin-powell-dies-of-covid-complications/#comment-2583661</a></p>
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		<title>
		By: AesopFan		</title>
		<link>https://thenewneo.com/2021/10/19/open-thread-10-19-21/#comment-2583815</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[AesopFan]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 20 Oct 2021 03:46:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://www.thenewneo.com/?p=111447#comment-2583815</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[@ JimNorCal - the Zerohedge post is just copying this article; I don&#039;t know why Durden does that, but at least he links the original source.

https://summit.news/2021/10/18/denmark-reveals-cost-of-non-western-immigration-5-billion-per-year/

If you look at Summit&#039;s &quot;you may like&quot; list, however, you can see a partisan slant that Zerohedge kind of glosses over in their one-step-removed coverage (true on almost everything they recycle). 
At least Durden copied the originator&#039;s donation &#038; purchasing links as well.

As to the substance of the post: 

Contrary to the SJW&#039;s go-to complaint, the problem is not skin color and prior nationality per se, and the price of mega-migration applies to more countries than just Denmark, although they may never undertake or publish a study with that finding.

The massive cost is a direct failure of the policy of importing people with little to no modern education, none of the marketable skills needed in a modern industrial nation, and very little cultural or religious correlations to those of the host country.
And then failing to insist on the assimilation of the guests to the host. 

Some of that is ideological (as in believing that one&#039;s own country&#039;s values are not to be preferred over the immigrants&#039;), but mostly it is a practical restriction - too many people coming too close together too fast for it to be done.
But those problems are also policy failures of a different sort.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@ JimNorCal &#8211; the Zerohedge post is just copying this article; I don&#8217;t know why Durden does that, but at least he links the original source.</p>
<p><a href="https://summit.news/2021/10/18/denmark-reveals-cost-of-non-western-immigration-5-billion-per-year/" rel="nofollow ugc">https://summit.news/2021/10/18/denmark-reveals-cost-of-non-western-immigration-5-billion-per-year/</a></p>
<p>If you look at Summit&#8217;s &#8220;you may like&#8221; list, however, you can see a partisan slant that Zerohedge kind of glosses over in their one-step-removed coverage (true on almost everything they recycle).<br />
At least Durden copied the originator&#8217;s donation &amp; purchasing links as well.</p>
<p>As to the substance of the post: </p>
<p>Contrary to the SJW&#8217;s go-to complaint, the problem is not skin color and prior nationality per se, and the price of mega-migration applies to more countries than just Denmark, although they may never undertake or publish a study with that finding.</p>
<p>The massive cost is a direct failure of the policy of importing people with little to no modern education, none of the marketable skills needed in a modern industrial nation, and very little cultural or religious correlations to those of the host country.<br />
And then failing to insist on the assimilation of the guests to the host. </p>
<p>Some of that is ideological (as in believing that one&#8217;s own country&#8217;s values are not to be preferred over the immigrants&#8217;), but mostly it is a practical restriction &#8211; too many people coming too close together too fast for it to be done.<br />
But those problems are also policy failures of a different sort.</p>
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		By: Zaphod		</title>
		<link>https://thenewneo.com/2021/10/19/open-thread-10-19-21/#comment-2583808</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Zaphod]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 20 Oct 2021 02:04:45 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://www.thenewneo.com/?p=111447#comment-2583808</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[Those Damn Chinese copied your Quantum Cryptography $%^&#038;… Is there no level to which those Chinks won’t stoop?

Oh wait… They nutted it out themselves?  You don’t have this particular capability? Jumping Jehoshaphat! That’s not what it said on the Cope-ium box. Oh well… best get those Wise Latinas and Black Tranny Quantum Physicists on the job. Can only be Structural Racism holding the West back from defeating those nefarious Orientals.

https://asiatimes.com/2021/10/china-pushes-quauntum-comms-to-a-new-level/

As I keep repeating.. All a peer-level competitor has to be is less stupid and distracted than the USA. How hard is that these days? A dollar here.. a dollar there…]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Those Damn Chinese copied your Quantum Cryptography $%^&amp;… Is there no level to which those Chinks won’t stoop?</p>
<p>Oh wait… They nutted it out themselves?  You don’t have this particular capability? Jumping Jehoshaphat! That’s not what it said on the Cope-ium box. Oh well… best get those Wise Latinas and Black Tranny Quantum Physicists on the job. Can only be Structural Racism holding the West back from defeating those nefarious Orientals.</p>
<p><a href="https://asiatimes.com/2021/10/china-pushes-quauntum-comms-to-a-new-level/" rel="nofollow ugc">https://asiatimes.com/2021/10/china-pushes-quauntum-comms-to-a-new-level/</a></p>
<p>As I keep repeating.. All a peer-level competitor has to be is less stupid and distracted than the USA. How hard is that these days? A dollar here.. a dollar there…</p>
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		<title>
		By: stan		</title>
		<link>https://thenewneo.com/2021/10/19/open-thread-10-19-21/#comment-2583790</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[stan]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 20 Oct 2021 00:20:01 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://www.thenewneo.com/?p=111447#comment-2583790</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[Serious issues with those studies, too. But hey, the medical and national health establishments have lied relentlessly and shamelessly for the last two years. In addition to censorship and unprecedented bullying to eliminate any dissent by other medical researchers. And we&#039;ve known that the vast majority of science studies are flawed for many years. So I&#039;m sure it would be wise to assume that the grossly incompetent and corrupt establishments are being totally honest and competent with us on this topic.  

You think?]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Serious issues with those studies, too. But hey, the medical and national health establishments have lied relentlessly and shamelessly for the last two years. In addition to censorship and unprecedented bullying to eliminate any dissent by other medical researchers. And we&#8217;ve known that the vast majority of science studies are flawed for many years. So I&#8217;m sure it would be wise to assume that the grossly incompetent and corrupt establishments are being totally honest and competent with us on this topic.  </p>
<p>You think?</p>
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		<title>
		By: neo		</title>
		<link>https://thenewneo.com/2021/10/19/open-thread-10-19-21/#comment-2583784</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[neo]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 19 Oct 2021 23:25:20 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://www.thenewneo.com/?p=111447#comment-2583784</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[stan:

There is no evidence that infection &lt;i&gt;rates&lt;/i&gt; are higher in vaccinated people. And although vaccination certainly doesn&#039;t stop infections, it makes them far less serious and decreases the death rate very significantly.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>stan:</p>
<p>There is no evidence that infection <i>rates</i> are higher in vaccinated people. And although vaccination certainly doesn&#8217;t stop infections, it makes them far less serious and decreases the death rate very significantly.</p>
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		<title>
		By: neo		</title>
		<link>https://thenewneo.com/2021/10/19/open-thread-10-19-21/#comment-2583779</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[neo]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 19 Oct 2021 23:02:12 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://www.thenewneo.com/?p=111447#comment-2583779</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[stan:

You can&#039;t compare country to country like that study does, because highly vaccinated countries tend to have had higher COVID rates anyway, even prior to vaccination.  What you need to do is to compare the COVID rates in vaccinated people in a certain country to the COVID rates in unvaccinated people in that same country, matched for race and weight and co-morbidities (that&#039;s rates and not sheer numbers, by the way). The studies I have read that do that have found that unvaccinated people have significantly higher rates of both infection and death.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>stan:</p>
<p>You can&#8217;t compare country to country like that study does, because highly vaccinated countries tend to have had higher COVID rates anyway, even prior to vaccination.  What you need to do is to compare the COVID rates in vaccinated people in a certain country to the COVID rates in unvaccinated people in that same country, matched for race and weight and co-morbidities (that&#8217;s rates and not sheer numbers, by the way). The studies I have read that do that have found that unvaccinated people have significantly higher rates of both infection and death.</p>
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		<title>
		By: stan		</title>
		<link>https://thenewneo.com/2021/10/19/open-thread-10-19-21/#comment-2583766</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[stan]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 19 Oct 2021 21:47:53 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://www.thenewneo.com/?p=111447#comment-2583766</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[https://nationalfile.com/study-published-on-nih-website-finds-no-discernable-relationship-between-vaccine-status-and-covid-cases-says-infection-rate-may-be-higher-among-fully-vaccinated/

“At the country-level, there appears to be no discernable relationship between percentage of population fully vaccinated and new COVID-19 cases in the last 7 days,” the report states. “In fact, the trend line suggests a marginally positive association such that countries with higher percentage of population fully vaccinated have higher COVID-19 cases per 1 million people. Notably, Israel with over 60% of their population fully vaccinated had the highest COVID-19 cases per 1 million people in the last 7 days.”]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><a href="https://nationalfile.com/study-published-on-nih-website-finds-no-discernable-relationship-between-vaccine-status-and-covid-cases-says-infection-rate-may-be-higher-among-fully-vaccinated/" rel="nofollow ugc">https://nationalfile.com/study-published-on-nih-website-finds-no-discernable-relationship-between-vaccine-status-and-covid-cases-says-infection-rate-may-be-higher-among-fully-vaccinated/</a></p>
<p>“At the country-level, there appears to be no discernable relationship between percentage of population fully vaccinated and new COVID-19 cases in the last 7 days,” the report states. “In fact, the trend line suggests a marginally positive association such that countries with higher percentage of population fully vaccinated have higher COVID-19 cases per 1 million people. Notably, Israel with over 60% of their population fully vaccinated had the highest COVID-19 cases per 1 million people in the last 7 days.”</p>
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		By: stan		</title>
		<link>https://thenewneo.com/2021/10/19/open-thread-10-19-21/#comment-2583761</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[stan]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 19 Oct 2021 21:41:06 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://www.thenewneo.com/?p=111447#comment-2583761</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[Someone above made a comment which seems to assume that the covid jab actually has some efficacy in stopping infections. The science is piling up as high as a mountain that this is just plain wrong. In fact, the jab appears to make the spread of infections slightly more likely.

I realize that the dominant narrative is pushing the jab and that people desperately want to believe that it actually works like a vaccine. But we have enough evidence now that this just ain&#039;t so. It isn&#039;t a vaccine. It doesn&#039;t work like a vaccine. In fact, it doesn&#039;t work at all. 

All that mass jabbing accomplishes is making herd immunity harder. There are several of the world&#039;s most experienced doctors who have been banging this drum for over a year. Jabbing everyone just forces the variants to emerge.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Someone above made a comment which seems to assume that the covid jab actually has some efficacy in stopping infections. The science is piling up as high as a mountain that this is just plain wrong. In fact, the jab appears to make the spread of infections slightly more likely.</p>
<p>I realize that the dominant narrative is pushing the jab and that people desperately want to believe that it actually works like a vaccine. But we have enough evidence now that this just ain&#8217;t so. It isn&#8217;t a vaccine. It doesn&#8217;t work like a vaccine. In fact, it doesn&#8217;t work at all. </p>
<p>All that mass jabbing accomplishes is making herd immunity harder. There are several of the world&#8217;s most experienced doctors who have been banging this drum for over a year. Jabbing everyone just forces the variants to emerge.</p>
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		By: Yawrate		</title>
		<link>https://thenewneo.com/2021/10/19/open-thread-10-19-21/#comment-2583755</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Yawrate]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 19 Oct 2021 21:36:01 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://www.thenewneo.com/?p=111447#comment-2583755</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[physicsguy

Great comment. I think there will be a covid surge in the northern tier of states this winter but it will much smaller and mostly among those vaccinated as many people have natural (acquired) immunity.

The response from the various states involved will be pervasive masking requirements despite masks being demonstrably ineffective. Because lock downs have serious side effects and masking is the only thing they can do without further impoverishing their domains.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>physicsguy</p>
<p>Great comment. I think there will be a covid surge in the northern tier of states this winter but it will much smaller and mostly among those vaccinated as many people have natural (acquired) immunity.</p>
<p>The response from the various states involved will be pervasive masking requirements despite masks being demonstrably ineffective. Because lock downs have serious side effects and masking is the only thing they can do without further impoverishing their domains.</p>
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