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	Comments on: Looking at election statistics	</title>
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	<link>https://thenewneo.com/2020/11/11/looking-at-election-statistics/</link>
	<description>A blog about political change, among other things</description>
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		<title>
		By: Bryan Lovely		</title>
		<link>https://thenewneo.com/2020/11/11/looking-at-election-statistics/#comment-2524708</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Bryan Lovely]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 13 Nov 2020 09:12:34 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://www.thenewneo.com/?p=101426#comment-2524708</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[Nobody has responded to my comment on the video.

The only reason a Trump voter would request a &quot;choice&quot; ballot would be if they wanted to vote for a Democrat down-ticket. Otherwise they would take a straight-ticket ballot.

In a heavily-R district, wouldn&#039;t it make sense that it would be more likely that a voter would want to vote a straight ticket? And therefore there would be fewer choice ballots in that district.

Also, the null hypothesis is that in the absence of fraud the choice ballots would be roughly equal to the straight ticket ballots, but he doesn&#039;t show us any examples, so as far as I can tell that&#039;s pure speculation.

I think there was fraud, but I don&#039;t think this is it.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Nobody has responded to my comment on the video.</p>
<p>The only reason a Trump voter would request a &#8220;choice&#8221; ballot would be if they wanted to vote for a Democrat down-ticket. Otherwise they would take a straight-ticket ballot.</p>
<p>In a heavily-R district, wouldn&#8217;t it make sense that it would be more likely that a voter would want to vote a straight ticket? And therefore there would be fewer choice ballots in that district.</p>
<p>Also, the null hypothesis is that in the absence of fraud the choice ballots would be roughly equal to the straight ticket ballots, but he doesn&#8217;t show us any examples, so as far as I can tell that&#8217;s pure speculation.</p>
<p>I think there was fraud, but I don&#8217;t think this is it.</p>
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		<title>
		By: huxley		</title>
		<link>https://thenewneo.com/2020/11/11/looking-at-election-statistics/#comment-2524586</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[huxley]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 12 Nov 2020 20:24:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://www.thenewneo.com/?p=101426#comment-2524586</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[Ymarsakar: Typing my full login name, as I chose it and now request it, should not be a hardship. It&#039;s common courtesy. Perhaps you&#039;ve heard of it. 

My emotions are none of your business. I have no interest in your advice or analysis.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Ymarsakar: Typing my full login name, as I chose it and now request it, should not be a hardship. It&#8217;s common courtesy. Perhaps you&#8217;ve heard of it. </p>
<p>My emotions are none of your business. I have no interest in your advice or analysis.</p>
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		<title>
		By: ymarsakar		</title>
		<link>https://thenewneo.com/2020/11/11/looking-at-election-statistics/#comment-2524581</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[ymarsakar]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 12 Nov 2020 19:57:49 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://www.thenewneo.com/?p=101426#comment-2524581</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[H, that is the strongest emotional reaction i have detected from you in some time.

The name huxley belongs to the novels of ald huxley, as you seem to be a fan of. I wonder why you are so attached to this name, that is not yours. I use 3 letters because it is faster to type and not mispell on galaxy 10. Even the prez of usa, i shorted to 4 letter, trum.

I even short my own to 4 letters. 3 is certainly friendly enough, so where does the negative emotion come from?]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>H, that is the strongest emotional reaction i have detected from you in some time.</p>
<p>The name huxley belongs to the novels of ald huxley, as you seem to be a fan of. I wonder why you are so attached to this name, that is not yours. I use 3 letters because it is faster to type and not mispell on galaxy 10. Even the prez of usa, i shorted to 4 letter, trum.</p>
<p>I even short my own to 4 letters. 3 is certainly friendly enough, so where does the negative emotion come from?</p>
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		<title>
		By: W Krebs		</title>
		<link>https://thenewneo.com/2020/11/11/looking-at-election-statistics/#comment-2524578</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[W Krebs]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 12 Nov 2020 19:43:41 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://www.thenewneo.com/?p=101426#comment-2524578</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[After wasting much scratch paper and more time, I have convinced myself that the situation described in the video can happen if votes are counted correctly.  This can occur if the frequency of voters who vote straight ticket is large enough so that virtually all ticket splitting Republicans are anti-Trump voters.

Of course, this does not rule out chicanery, and, in the situation I have described, there are restrictions on the slope of the linear part.

It would help to know something about the proportion of ticket splitters in this dataset.  If that proportion is low, then this result looks much more like the software problem described in the video.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>After wasting much scratch paper and more time, I have convinced myself that the situation described in the video can happen if votes are counted correctly.  This can occur if the frequency of voters who vote straight ticket is large enough so that virtually all ticket splitting Republicans are anti-Trump voters.</p>
<p>Of course, this does not rule out chicanery, and, in the situation I have described, there are restrictions on the slope of the linear part.</p>
<p>It would help to know something about the proportion of ticket splitters in this dataset.  If that proportion is low, then this result looks much more like the software problem described in the video.</p>
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		<title>
		By: W Krebs		</title>
		<link>https://thenewneo.com/2020/11/11/looking-at-election-statistics/#comment-2524576</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[W Krebs]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 12 Nov 2020 18:59:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://www.thenewneo.com/?p=101426#comment-2524576</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[Off the cuff responses to a couple of the comments above:

First, I believe you can get the corresponding graphic for Biden voters by suitably reflecting the X and Y axes of Dr. Shiva&#039;s plots.

Second, looking at the plots, I&#039;d say the correlation of Shiva&#039;s X and Y variables has to be better than -0.9.  This is just an impression based on a lot of time in data analysis.

Third, we did have a report of a Republican county where 6000 votes were shifted to Biden.  That anecdote would be consistent with this analysis.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Off the cuff responses to a couple of the comments above:</p>
<p>First, I believe you can get the corresponding graphic for Biden voters by suitably reflecting the X and Y axes of Dr. Shiva&#8217;s plots.</p>
<p>Second, looking at the plots, I&#8217;d say the correlation of Shiva&#8217;s X and Y variables has to be better than -0.9.  This is just an impression based on a lot of time in data analysis.</p>
<p>Third, we did have a report of a Republican county where 6000 votes were shifted to Biden.  That anecdote would be consistent with this analysis.</p>
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		<title>
		By: huxley		</title>
		<link>https://thenewneo.com/2020/11/11/looking-at-election-statistics/#comment-2524555</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[huxley]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 12 Nov 2020 16:32:35 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://www.thenewneo.com/?p=101426#comment-2524555</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[Re: Ayyadurai ...

Yann: You are more lenient than I am. Here&#039;s a summary from SIGCIS (Special Interest Group for Computing, Information) on the matter. It&#039;s pretty brutal. 
__________________________________________________

&lt;i&gt;V.A. Shiva Ayyadurai is not a member of the MIT faculty and did not invent email. &lt;b&gt;In 1980 he created a small-scale electronic mail system used within University of Medicine and Dentistry of New Jersey, but this could not send messages outside the university and included no important features missing from earlier systems. The details of Ayyadurai’s program were never published, it was never commercialized, and it had no apparent influence on any further work in the field.&lt;/b&gt; He does not “hold the patent for email” or have a copyright on the word email, though in 1982 he did register a copyright claim covering the exact text of a program called &quot;EMAIL.&quot;  The U.S. Government has not recognized him as the inventor of email and he did not win the Westinghouse Science Talent Search for his program. Electronic mail services were widely used in the 1960s and 1970s and were commercially available long before 1980. To substantiate his claim to be the &quot;inventor of email&quot; Ayyadurai would have to show that no electronic mail system was produced prior to 1980, and so he has recently created an absurdly specific and historically inaccurate definition of electronic mail designed to exclude earlier systems.  Ayyadurai has not even been able to show that he was the first to contract “electronic mail” to “email” or “e-mail” – his first documented use is in 1981 whereas the Oxford English Dictionary shows a newspaper usage in 1979. Despite Ayyadurai’s energetic public relations campaign, which presents him as the victim of a racist conspiracy financed by corporate interests, he has not received support from any credible experts in email technology or the history of information technology. His claims have been widely debunked by technology bloggers and articles based on them have been retracted by the Washington Post and the Huffington Post.

--&quot;Did V.A. Shiva Ayyadurai Invent Email? A Computer Historian Responds&quot;
https://www.sigcis.org/Ayyadurai&lt;/i&gt;
__________________________________________________

SIGs (Special Interest Group) have been a primary vehicle for sharing information and discussion about computing since 1961 under the umbrella of the ACM (Association for Computing Machinery). Not fringe.

Sadly, Ayyadurai has been waging a campaign to justify his email claim which includes accusations of racism. From his own blog:

--&quot;Yes, A “Darkie” Invented Email. Get Over It.&quot;
https://vashiva.com/yes-a-darkie-invented-email-get-over-it/]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Re: Ayyadurai &#8230;</p>
<p>Yann: You are more lenient than I am. Here&#8217;s a summary from SIGCIS (Special Interest Group for Computing, Information) on the matter. It&#8217;s pretty brutal.<br />
__________________________________________________</p>
<p><i>V.A. Shiva Ayyadurai is not a member of the MIT faculty and did not invent email. <b>In 1980 he created a small-scale electronic mail system used within University of Medicine and Dentistry of New Jersey, but this could not send messages outside the university and included no important features missing from earlier systems. The details of Ayyadurai’s program were never published, it was never commercialized, and it had no apparent influence on any further work in the field.</b> He does not “hold the patent for email” or have a copyright on the word email, though in 1982 he did register a copyright claim covering the exact text of a program called &#8220;EMAIL.&#8221;  The U.S. Government has not recognized him as the inventor of email and he did not win the Westinghouse Science Talent Search for his program. Electronic mail services were widely used in the 1960s and 1970s and were commercially available long before 1980. To substantiate his claim to be the &#8220;inventor of email&#8221; Ayyadurai would have to show that no electronic mail system was produced prior to 1980, and so he has recently created an absurdly specific and historically inaccurate definition of electronic mail designed to exclude earlier systems.  Ayyadurai has not even been able to show that he was the first to contract “electronic mail” to “email” or “e-mail” – his first documented use is in 1981 whereas the Oxford English Dictionary shows a newspaper usage in 1979. Despite Ayyadurai’s energetic public relations campaign, which presents him as the victim of a racist conspiracy financed by corporate interests, he has not received support from any credible experts in email technology or the history of information technology. His claims have been widely debunked by technology bloggers and articles based on them have been retracted by the Washington Post and the Huffington Post.</p>
<p>&#8211;&#8220;Did V.A. Shiva Ayyadurai Invent Email? A Computer Historian Responds&#8221;<br />
<a href="https://www.sigcis.org/Ayyadurai" rel="nofollow ugc">https://www.sigcis.org/Ayyadurai</a></i><br />
__________________________________________________</p>
<p>SIGs (Special Interest Group) have been a primary vehicle for sharing information and discussion about computing since 1961 under the umbrella of the ACM (Association for Computing Machinery). Not fringe.</p>
<p>Sadly, Ayyadurai has been waging a campaign to justify his email claim which includes accusations of racism. From his own blog:</p>
<p>&#8211;&#8220;Yes, A “Darkie” Invented Email. Get Over It.&#8221;<br />
<a href="https://vashiva.com/yes-a-darkie-invented-email-get-over-it/" rel="nofollow ugc">https://vashiva.com/yes-a-darkie-invented-email-get-over-it/</a></p>
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		<title>
		By: huxley		</title>
		<link>https://thenewneo.com/2020/11/11/looking-at-election-statistics/#comment-2524552</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[huxley]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 12 Nov 2020 16:01:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://www.thenewneo.com/?p=101426#comment-2524552</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[Good overview of where the EV numbers are today:
________________________________________________

&lt;i&gt;The facts are, as of Monday, a full week after election day, Biden is behind President Donald Trump in the undisputed electoral count — &lt;b&gt;Biden’s 226 to Trump’s 232&lt;/b&gt; (assuming Trump wins North Carolina) —&lt;b&gt; with a full 80 outstanding electoral votes in seven states still in a legal fog&lt;/b&gt; and unlikely to be determined much before the December 14 state deadlines to report the count to Congress.

https://issuesinsights.com/2020/11/12/look-closely-trump-still-has-a-good-shot-at-winning-reelection/&lt;/i&gt;
________________________________________________

I remain unclear on how the audits/recounts, lawsuits and state legislatures work together and send electors to the Electoral College. Is it different in each state? Probably...

I could use a flowchart or a cute cartoon like this:

--&quot;Schoolhouse Rock- How a Bill Becomes a Law&quot;
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Otbml6WIQPo]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Good overview of where the EV numbers are today:<br />
________________________________________________</p>
<p><i>The facts are, as of Monday, a full week after election day, Biden is behind President Donald Trump in the undisputed electoral count — <b>Biden’s 226 to Trump’s 232</b> (assuming Trump wins North Carolina) —<b> with a full 80 outstanding electoral votes in seven states still in a legal fog</b> and unlikely to be determined much before the December 14 state deadlines to report the count to Congress.</p>
<p><a href="https://issuesinsights.com/2020/11/12/look-closely-trump-still-has-a-good-shot-at-winning-reelection/" rel="nofollow ugc">https://issuesinsights.com/2020/11/12/look-closely-trump-still-has-a-good-shot-at-winning-reelection/</a></i><br />
________________________________________________</p>
<p>I remain unclear on how the audits/recounts, lawsuits and state legislatures work together and send electors to the Electoral College. Is it different in each state? Probably&#8230;</p>
<p>I could use a flowchart or a cute cartoon like this:</p>
<p>&#8211;&#8220;Schoolhouse Rock- How a Bill Becomes a Law&#8221;<br />
<a href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Otbml6WIQPo" rel="nofollow ugc">https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Otbml6WIQPo</a></p>
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		<title>
		By: Ymarsakar		</title>
		<link>https://thenewneo.com/2020/11/11/looking-at-election-statistics/#comment-2524538</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Ymarsakar]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 12 Nov 2020 14:11:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://www.thenewneo.com/?p=101426#comment-2524538</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[&lt;b&gt;“Individual candidate” voters in this case refers to those who vote, but not straight party vote. In a state that offers a straight party option, you can just check one box and that means you are voting for every single candidate that party offers.&lt;/b&gt;

But those are not relevant to what people are analyzing. They only need the small segment that only voted for one candidate per election, and left the rest blank. These are outliers that should be easy to isolate, if officials had not deleted the records and ballot pictures.

Even if we can&#039;t get Nixon on crime, we can get him on the cover up. IT&#039;s the cover up, so to speak. Al Capone, taxes, not the other stuff.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><b>“Individual candidate” voters in this case refers to those who vote, but not straight party vote. In a state that offers a straight party option, you can just check one box and that means you are voting for every single candidate that party offers.</b></p>
<p>But those are not relevant to what people are analyzing. They only need the small segment that only voted for one candidate per election, and left the rest blank. These are outliers that should be easy to isolate, if officials had not deleted the records and ballot pictures.</p>
<p>Even if we can&#8217;t get Nixon on crime, we can get him on the cover up. IT&#8217;s the cover up, so to speak. Al Capone, taxes, not the other stuff.</p>
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		<title>
		By: Yann		</title>
		<link>https://thenewneo.com/2020/11/11/looking-at-election-statistics/#comment-2524515</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Yann]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 12 Nov 2020 08:16:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://www.thenewneo.com/?p=101426#comment-2524515</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[Regarding the &quot;email&quot; controversy: I used 10 minutes to follow the links and get some idea about the controversy.

He didn&#039;t invent email, obviously. email had been already invented a few years before. But he coined the term and created the first program that managed email in the way they do nowadays. I&#039;m talking about email clients like Outlook or Thunderbird.

In a nutshell, he didn&#039;t invent email, but he created the first email client. The proper credit should be &quot;contributor&quot;.

His claim that he invented email is unfortunate. On the other hand, having created the first email client is a contribution that should be (at least) credited, for example, in the wikipedia &#039;history of email&#039; page, which it&#039;s not.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Regarding the &#8220;email&#8221; controversy: I used 10 minutes to follow the links and get some idea about the controversy.</p>
<p>He didn&#8217;t invent email, obviously. email had been already invented a few years before. But he coined the term and created the first program that managed email in the way they do nowadays. I&#8217;m talking about email clients like Outlook or Thunderbird.</p>
<p>In a nutshell, he didn&#8217;t invent email, but he created the first email client. The proper credit should be &#8220;contributor&#8221;.</p>
<p>His claim that he invented email is unfortunate. On the other hand, having created the first email client is a contribution that should be (at least) credited, for example, in the wikipedia &#8216;history of email&#8217; page, which it&#8217;s not.</p>
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		<title>
		By: Liebling Schatz		</title>
		<link>https://thenewneo.com/2020/11/11/looking-at-election-statistics/#comment-2524511</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Liebling Schatz]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 12 Nov 2020 06:09:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://www.thenewneo.com/?p=101426#comment-2524511</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[Regarding the &quot;straight lines mean it&#039;s not natural&quot; idea -- Their later plots each include TWO straight lines, one nearly horizontal and one very steep.  Two lines could indicate either (a) some algorithm that&#039;s only enabled when enough Rep voters are detected, or (b) some honest data that doesn&#039;t form such a straight line after all.

Regarding straight lines in general -- There&#039;s always a best fit line for any real world data.  However, that doesn&#039;t mean the best fit is any good at all.  For example, see their Wayne County plot at 38:00.  They show the best fit line, but the fit looks awful.  We need to know the correlation coefficients to judge how good the fits are.

All in all, I think their claims are interesting and worth pursuing.  Maybe with more work they could make this into a &quot;full&quot; red flag.  Right now, I say it&#039;s worth &quot;half&quot; a red flag.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Regarding the &#8220;straight lines mean it&#8217;s not natural&#8221; idea &#8212; Their later plots each include TWO straight lines, one nearly horizontal and one very steep.  Two lines could indicate either (a) some algorithm that&#8217;s only enabled when enough Rep voters are detected, or (b) some honest data that doesn&#8217;t form such a straight line after all.</p>
<p>Regarding straight lines in general &#8212; There&#8217;s always a best fit line for any real world data.  However, that doesn&#8217;t mean the best fit is any good at all.  For example, see their Wayne County plot at 38:00.  They show the best fit line, but the fit looks awful.  We need to know the correlation coefficients to judge how good the fits are.</p>
<p>All in all, I think their claims are interesting and worth pursuing.  Maybe with more work they could make this into a &#8220;full&#8221; red flag.  Right now, I say it&#8217;s worth &#8220;half&#8221; a red flag.</p>
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