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	Comments on: Facts, judges, and lawyers	</title>
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	<link>https://thenewneo.com/2017/02/14/facts-judges-and-lawyers/</link>
	<description>A blog about political change, among other things</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Wed, 15 Feb 2017 22:59:14 +0000</lastBuildDate>
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		<title>
		By: Big Maq		</title>
		<link>https://thenewneo.com/2017/02/14/facts-judges-and-lawyers/#comment-2175097</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Big Maq]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 15 Feb 2017 22:59:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://neoneocon.com/?p=66718#comment-2175097</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[&lt;em&gt;&quot;What’s the remedy for the willful ignoring of the facts? Is there one? Should there be one?&quot;&lt;/em&gt; - Neo

Seems to me, that is why we have the option to go to SCOTUS.

But, even then, no guarantee.  

We had a Civil War over &quot;interpretation&quot; of laws, and about 100 years of judiciary that ignored what was right, only to go overboard the other way in some cases.

We have an opportunity to balance out the lower courts and keep a conservative majority in SCOTUS.  

About the best possible outcome in this regard.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><em>&#8220;What’s the remedy for the willful ignoring of the facts? Is there one? Should there be one?&#8221;</em> &#8211; Neo</p>
<p>Seems to me, that is why we have the option to go to SCOTUS.</p>
<p>But, even then, no guarantee.  </p>
<p>We had a Civil War over &#8220;interpretation&#8221; of laws, and about 100 years of judiciary that ignored what was right, only to go overboard the other way in some cases.</p>
<p>We have an opportunity to balance out the lower courts and keep a conservative majority in SCOTUS.  </p>
<p>About the best possible outcome in this regard.</p>
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		<title>
		By: AMartel		</title>
		<link>https://thenewneo.com/2017/02/14/facts-judges-and-lawyers/#comment-2174962</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[AMartel]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 15 Feb 2017 15:44:51 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://neoneocon.com/?p=66718#comment-2174962</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[Perhaps the government lawyers here were not privy to classified information or not willing to convey that information in open court to the illustrious judicial foreign policy experts (sacasm quotes implied) at the Washington State District Court and the 9th Circus.  

Jeez.  Us.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Perhaps the government lawyers here were not privy to classified information or not willing to convey that information in open court to the illustrious judicial foreign policy experts (sacasm quotes implied) at the Washington State District Court and the 9th Circus.  </p>
<p>Jeez.  Us.</p>
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		<title>
		By: Frog		</title>
		<link>https://thenewneo.com/2017/02/14/facts-judges-and-lawyers/#comment-2174957</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Frog]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 15 Feb 2017 15:07:23 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://neoneocon.com/?p=66718#comment-2174957</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[Further to our concern about the Deep State is this, as it relates to Gen. Flynn&#039;s forced resignation:
http://freebeacon.com/national-security/former-obama-officials-loyalists-waged-campaign-oust-flynn/?utm_source=Freedom+Mail&#038;utm_campaign=d5949a659c-EMAIL_CAMPAIGN_2017_02_14&#038;utm_medium=email&#038;utm_term=0_b5e6e0e9ea-d5949a659c-46066129

This is a domestic security crisis of the first magnitude, radical Democrats who have seized the reins of power from within, cannot be identified or fired because of Civil Service rules promulgated in the late 1800s, and who work to undermine the new Administration&#039;s positions...as I suggested the &quot;government lawyer&quot; pleading the defense of Trump&#039;s ExecOrder did by being intentionally underprepared, phonily ignorant.

The Deep State is our Death Star.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Further to our concern about the Deep State is this, as it relates to Gen. Flynn&#8217;s forced resignation:<br />
<a href="http://freebeacon.com/national-security/former-obama-officials-loyalists-waged-campaign-oust-flynn/?utm_source=Freedom+Mail&#038;utm_campaign=d5949a659c-EMAIL_CAMPAIGN_2017_02_14&#038;utm_medium=email&#038;utm_term=0_b5e6e0e9ea-d5949a659c-46066129" rel="nofollow ugc">http://freebeacon.com/national-security/former-obama-officials-loyalists-waged-campaign-oust-flynn/?utm_source=Freedom+Mail&#038;utm_campaign=d5949a659c-EMAIL_CAMPAIGN_2017_02_14&#038;utm_medium=email&#038;utm_term=0_b5e6e0e9ea-d5949a659c-46066129</a></p>
<p>This is a domestic security crisis of the first magnitude, radical Democrats who have seized the reins of power from within, cannot be identified or fired because of Civil Service rules promulgated in the late 1800s, and who work to undermine the new Administration&#8217;s positions&#8230;as I suggested the &#8220;government lawyer&#8221; pleading the defense of Trump&#8217;s ExecOrder did by being intentionally underprepared, phonily ignorant.</p>
<p>The Deep State is our Death Star.</p>
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		<title>
		By: TommyJay		</title>
		<link>https://thenewneo.com/2017/02/14/facts-judges-and-lawyers/#comment-2174828</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[TommyJay]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 15 Feb 2017 04:51:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://neoneocon.com/?p=66718#comment-2174828</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[I just finished jury duty on a trial with 12 lower level criminal counts.  We (the jury) almost didn&#039;t convict on 1 or 2 counts because we asked &quot;Where was the fingerprint evidence?&quot;  Then there was the count where we did acquit because the prosecution presented a highly detailed photo that undercut the prosecution&#039;s case.  So yes, there can be too much evidence or too little.

The whole point (assuming there is any legitimate legal justification) of the hearings are: does Washington state have standing, and is there a constitutionality question (e.g. religion establishment or disestablishment)?

Judge Robart has absolutely no authority to assume or weigh Presidential executive decisions.  He is essentially saying &quot;I don&#039;t like the President&#039;s national security decisions, so I&#039;m going to decide for the President for awhile.&quot;

I hope Trump didn&#039;t use an attorney with questionable loyalties, and maybe the attorney should have presented a long laundry list of refugee crimes, but I do think the latter issue is a grandmaster level choice.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I just finished jury duty on a trial with 12 lower level criminal counts.  We (the jury) almost didn&#8217;t convict on 1 or 2 counts because we asked &#8220;Where was the fingerprint evidence?&#8221;  Then there was the count where we did acquit because the prosecution presented a highly detailed photo that undercut the prosecution&#8217;s case.  So yes, there can be too much evidence or too little.</p>
<p>The whole point (assuming there is any legitimate legal justification) of the hearings are: does Washington state have standing, and is there a constitutionality question (e.g. religion establishment or disestablishment)?</p>
<p>Judge Robart has absolutely no authority to assume or weigh Presidential executive decisions.  He is essentially saying &#8220;I don&#8217;t like the President&#8217;s national security decisions, so I&#8217;m going to decide for the President for awhile.&#8221;</p>
<p>I hope Trump didn&#8217;t use an attorney with questionable loyalties, and maybe the attorney should have presented a long laundry list of refugee crimes, but I do think the latter issue is a grandmaster level choice.</p>
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		<title>
		By: AesopFan		</title>
		<link>https://thenewneo.com/2017/02/14/facts-judges-and-lawyers/#comment-2174823</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[AesopFan]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 15 Feb 2017 04:35:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://neoneocon.com/?p=66718#comment-2174823</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[SLR Says: 
February 14th, 2017 at 10:42 pm
I think the gov lawyer may have been thrown for a loop. The judge wanted to debate making foreign policy. Not the law.
* * *
Kind of like Romney discovering that Candy Crowley was a player for the Dems, rather than an impartial moderator.
However, every lawyer I know about prepares for &lt;em&gt;everything&lt;/em&gt; the judge MIGHT throw out, and that was an obvious question in this case.

IIRC, the lawyer here was the third-string, the upper echelon having recused themselves for various reasons, and late in the game (it was a short game to start with); maybe he just didn&#039;t have time to prepare adequately.
Not excusing the failure, but things happen like that all the time.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>SLR Says:<br />
February 14th, 2017 at 10:42 pm<br />
I think the gov lawyer may have been thrown for a loop. The judge wanted to debate making foreign policy. Not the law.<br />
* * *<br />
Kind of like Romney discovering that Candy Crowley was a player for the Dems, rather than an impartial moderator.<br />
However, every lawyer I know about prepares for <em>everything</em> the judge MIGHT throw out, and that was an obvious question in this case.</p>
<p>IIRC, the lawyer here was the third-string, the upper echelon having recused themselves for various reasons, and late in the game (it was a short game to start with); maybe he just didn&#8217;t have time to prepare adequately.<br />
Not excusing the failure, but things happen like that all the time.</p>
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		<title>
		By: parker		</title>
		<link>https://thenewneo.com/2017/02/14/facts-judges-and-lawyers/#comment-2174819</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[parker]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 15 Feb 2017 04:25:23 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://neoneocon.com/?p=66718#comment-2174819</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[Conspiracy theories are difficult to believe, but coordination between the dnc, msm, and bho holdovers in the bureaucracy is easy to believe.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Conspiracy theories are difficult to believe, but coordination between the dnc, msm, and bho holdovers in the bureaucracy is easy to believe.</p>
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		<title>
		By: SLR		</title>
		<link>https://thenewneo.com/2017/02/14/facts-judges-and-lawyers/#comment-2174810</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[SLR]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 15 Feb 2017 03:42:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://neoneocon.com/?p=66718#comment-2174810</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[I think the gov lawyer may have been thrown for a loop. The judge wanted to debate making foreign policy. Not the law.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think the gov lawyer may have been thrown for a loop. The judge wanted to debate making foreign policy. Not the law.</p>
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		<title>
		By: neo-neocon		</title>
		<link>https://thenewneo.com/2017/02/14/facts-judges-and-lawyers/#comment-2174804</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[neo-neocon]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 15 Feb 2017 02:59:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://neoneocon.com/?p=66718#comment-2174804</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[OM:

I don&#039;t know the answer about what&#039;s going on with Kristol. Wish I knew.  All I know is he doesn&#039;t sound like himself, or at least the self with which I&#039;m familiar.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>OM:</p>
<p>I don&#8217;t know the answer about what&#8217;s going on with Kristol. Wish I knew.  All I know is he doesn&#8217;t sound like himself, or at least the self with which I&#8217;m familiar.</p>
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		<title>
		By: OM		</title>
		<link>https://thenewneo.com/2017/02/14/facts-judges-and-lawyers/#comment-2174796</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[OM]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 15 Feb 2017 02:31:50 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://neoneocon.com/?p=66718#comment-2174796</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[Neo:

Has Kristol fallen into Trump Derangement Syndrome?  If so he has lots of company, but mostly on the left.  Critics of Trump at RedState.com haven&#039;t gone &quot;Kristol.&quot;  Like OldFlyer said, Trump&#039;s team is on the defensive, masks are off regarding the seriousness of the opposition in the Deep State and their allies, the media.  There was an article in Warontherocks.com concening the &quot;War of the Generals;&quot; the 4-stars (Mathis and another) vs NSC (Kelley and another).  That would be internal squabbling compared to POTUS vs the Deep Staters.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Neo:</p>
<p>Has Kristol fallen into Trump Derangement Syndrome?  If so he has lots of company, but mostly on the left.  Critics of Trump at RedState.com haven&#8217;t gone &#8220;Kristol.&#8221;  Like OldFlyer said, Trump&#8217;s team is on the defensive, masks are off regarding the seriousness of the opposition in the Deep State and their allies, the media.  There was an article in Warontherocks.com concening the &#8220;War of the Generals;&#8221; the 4-stars (Mathis and another) vs NSC (Kelley and another).  That would be internal squabbling compared to POTUS vs the Deep Staters.</p>
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		<title>
		By: neo-neocon		</title>
		<link>https://thenewneo.com/2017/02/14/facts-judges-and-lawyers/#comment-2174790</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[neo-neocon]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 15 Feb 2017 02:06:16 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://neoneocon.com/?p=66718#comment-2174790</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[Oldflyer:

Yes, I saw that tweet of Kristol&#039;s (Ace wrote about it).  Kristol actually wrote &quot;Trump state,&quot; by the way, not &quot;Trump regime.&quot; Since he didn&#039;t specify what he meant by &quot;Trump state,&quot; it&#039;s hard to know if there&#039;s any difference.

Kristol always seemed like a pretty reasonable, measured person to me, prior to the Trump business.  I didn&#039;t always agree with him, but I often did, and I never thought he went off the deep end on anything. With the advent of Trump he seemed to become more extreme (and in some ways impractical, such as his thinking David French could be a presidential candidate).  But until today I never saw anything from Kristol that seemed to go against his own basic principles.  But that tweet seemed to do so.

It&#039;s partly Twitter I think, because Twitter encourages people to be brief, snarky, and extreme.  That&#039;s not an excuse of course, but it still is a fact.  In a column, Kristol would certainly explain what he meant.  In a tweet, he doesn&#039;t, and he goes for the catchy phrase---deep state vs. Trump state.  What does it mean? Does it mean that he prefers behind-the-scene machinations from shadowy, unnamed, unelected powerful movers and shakers, with access to information gained by tapping phones and the like, spilling information as they please to friendly MSM reporters with an agenda in order to bring down someone they don&#039;t like and he doesn&#039;t like, someone who was elected by the American people?  He prefers that to Trump being president?  Is a Trump presidency a &quot;Trump state&quot;?  Or by &quot;Trump state&quot; does he mean the prospect of a Trump dictatorship?  Does he think Trump has become a dictator already? Does he think he will inevitably become one, and if so why?]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Oldflyer:</p>
<p>Yes, I saw that tweet of Kristol&#8217;s (Ace wrote about it).  Kristol actually wrote &#8220;Trump state,&#8221; by the way, not &#8220;Trump regime.&#8221; Since he didn&#8217;t specify what he meant by &#8220;Trump state,&#8221; it&#8217;s hard to know if there&#8217;s any difference.</p>
<p>Kristol always seemed like a pretty reasonable, measured person to me, prior to the Trump business.  I didn&#8217;t always agree with him, but I often did, and I never thought he went off the deep end on anything. With the advent of Trump he seemed to become more extreme (and in some ways impractical, such as his thinking David French could be a presidential candidate).  But until today I never saw anything from Kristol that seemed to go against his own basic principles.  But that tweet seemed to do so.</p>
<p>It&#8217;s partly Twitter I think, because Twitter encourages people to be brief, snarky, and extreme.  That&#8217;s not an excuse of course, but it still is a fact.  In a column, Kristol would certainly explain what he meant.  In a tweet, he doesn&#8217;t, and he goes for the catchy phrase&#8212;deep state vs. Trump state.  What does it mean? Does it mean that he prefers behind-the-scene machinations from shadowy, unnamed, unelected powerful movers and shakers, with access to information gained by tapping phones and the like, spilling information as they please to friendly MSM reporters with an agenda in order to bring down someone they don&#8217;t like and he doesn&#8217;t like, someone who was elected by the American people?  He prefers that to Trump being president?  Is a Trump presidency a &#8220;Trump state&#8221;?  Or by &#8220;Trump state&#8221; does he mean the prospect of a Trump dictatorship?  Does he think Trump has become a dictator already? Does he think he will inevitably become one, and if so why?</p>
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