What’s for sure is that the Repubics never ratchet the Gramscian march back…

Hopefully there’ll be a reaction at the States level or eventually there’ll be some sort of a watering of the Jeffersonian tree …

Hopefully, for I’m not sure.
it’s become the land of the sheeple, home of the docile ….

You’re absolutely right J.J., that IS the result of not voting for the GOP candidate. But you left out the other part that is also true; vote for the GOP and “be content to live under more and more statism with less freedom” as under the current GOP leadership, it’s just a slower march to the gallows.

Proof; “Boehner plans to sideline House conservatives in budget battle”

As for the solution of changing that leadership, that’s a long term goal in a short term game.

Nor am I alone in my assessment of our running out of time. Just a week ago, neo wrote this; “I believe that Obama aspires to dictatorship, and I believe he is much closer than most people think. Remember that dictators can operate through seemingly democratic means. Hitler, for example, got the Reichstag to dissolve itself.”

Whether events might conspire to provide Obama an opportunity to seize dictatorial power is speculative but what is certain is that the Left lusts for such power and is incrementally moving us toward that day. It is also certain that the GOP is doing little to nothing to abort that day’s arrival.

Because they live for power and control. I do not; we do not. And it will always be true that the general tendency will be for power to grow and liberty to recede.

It reminds me of those who say they’re leaving the country because Obama is ruining it. Oh yeah? Where are you going to go? If you’ve got the big bucks and can afford the cost of immigrating to Switzerland or New Zealand, you might be able to escape the descent into a place where we are all equally miserable. But most of us can’t do that.

Well, I’m not going anywhere, and I’m not quitting till they shovel dirt on my old bones. Work for change within the Republican party as if your life depended on it. Because it does!

Is this supposed to be a representation of conservatives’ arguments against RINO positions? Conservatives are pissed at GOP establishment for doing things it does not have to do. No one was forcing the establishment GOP to pass the DHS bill with funds for amnesty. Same goes for the medicare doc fix.

The GOP establishment wants to do these things. No one is forcing them.

I think the big problem is the establishment seems far more willing to fight its own members than putting up any meaningful resistance against the Dems.
They campaigned on stopping Obama’s amnesty. Yet after very brief and clearly token effort quickly caved to give the President what he wanted. And spent most of their effort stopping those who disagreed with them.
I am not unrealistic about what they have the ability to accomplish. But the leadership seems completely unwilling to put any real effort into it. And it seems their agenda is increasingly in line with the Dem minority than with its own base.
If you need any evidence of this just look at what happened after the immigration cave. He was saved by his allies and the minority from any challenge. Its a pattern I think we will be seeing more of in the future. Essentially giving the democrats the majority in all but name

You’re quite right that the political will is greatly insufficient. However reality’s sword will sunder the Gordian knot with which we are faced. The chips will fall where they may. That which is unsustainable will not be sustained. It’s not a matter of if but of when and though temporarily forgotten, the Grecian economic lesson looms before us and the Greek debacle to come, awaits the entire West.
http://www.economist.com/news/europe/21646760-euro-zone-brink-again-neither-childish-squabbles-nor-historical-arguments-are

Frankly, I’ve seen little nit-picking. Nor are calling out violations of major principles nit-picking. Approval of amnesty, a failure to vigorously oppose Obama on ObamaCare and Iran, silence in the face of Obama’s racist rabble rousing, none of these are nit-picks.

There is nothing ‘perceived’ about the Republican “establishment’s” betrayals, they are incontrovertible.

It is appropriate that the anger expressed at duplicitous RINOs is far greater than the anger expressed at Obama and the left because in the long term, those who interfere with effective response to Obama and the left do far more harm than the left, whose positions are clear and therefore can be fought. You can’t fight the knife n the back when you don’t even see it coming.

I have always been an independent (though once a liberal), have become involved and informed since the mid-90s and have never voted for a democrat at the federal level. As a person, I too like Giuliani and am supportive of Walker though his stance on immigration is of some concern. We agree in principle, we disagree on how to fight and we are BOTH right.

I’m not sure that any of us expect to agree with our candidate all the time but I do expect a candidate I support to stay true to basic principles and if they do something with which I disagree, I expect them to have a reasoned rationale for their actions. I get ‘annoyed’ when people piss on my head and tell me it’s raining.

The norm here is not to expect Congressional Republicans to do the impossible but many of us do expect them to do the possible and, they are not.

If I recall correctly, we’ve already agreed here that the Republicans should invoke the nuclear option because the democrats will do so once the opportunity arises again whether the Republicans do so or not. And while the GOP does not have a veto proof majority, it does have the ability to send bill after bill to Obama and when he vetoes them, they will have the proof that they are trying to do something rather than offering nothing. Plus they will have the opportunity to bring an override vote to the floor, which when defeated, will provide proof of those democrats who first voted for it, before they voted against it. Which will help to destroy their credibility with the voters.

The Republicans should use the option of holding back government funding… but cunningly. No big budget bills with Republican cuts of favored democrat programs. Instead submit a bill that solely funds the military. Then submit one that funds cancer research. One that funds farmers. One that funds social security and unemployment. Etc., etc. Let Obama explain why he refuses to fund the military, cancer research, farmers and social security. When Obama objects to piecemeal legislation, simply respond that the GOP is trying to unblock the deadlock by funding what no one could object to and then we can tackle where disagreement lies. Make Obama the bad guy, make him, by his actions and in the eyes of the voters, responsible for any shutdown.

A conservative takeover of the party is certainly needed but will necessarily be slow, unfortunately, we’re running out of time… and anyone who thinks that we’re not close to the edge is in denial. Which is not to say it shouldn’t be pursued vigorously but pursuit of a takeover alone is inadequate as a cure for the patient. The patient has late stage cancer not early onset Parkinson’s.

“I look at things in a more practical way: who agrees the most with me, have they kept their word in the past for the most part, and what can they realistically do if elected?”

That seems reasonable enough but other than perhaps Bush’s War on Terror, when exactly has the GOP “kept their word in the past for the most part”?

I agree, in the near term, a third party will only weaken both wings. Unfortunately, the “establishment” is far more likely to keep the reins of power without massive pressure being brought to bear upon them and the only pressure they recognize is the ballot box. Keep voting for them and they will never willingly release the reins of power.

The party may have a long term trend of becoming more conservative but the GOP’s power brokers are NOT interested in conservatism, they are interested in lining their pockets by serving the interests of their big donors who wish to maintain the financial status quo.

The thing is, you’re right neo about the short term repercussions and we’re right about the long term consequences. And therein lies the conundrum within which we find ourselves.