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	Comments on: Jews and politics	</title>
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	<link>https://thenewneo.com/2015/02/12/jews-and-politics/</link>
	<description>A blog about political change, among other things</description>
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		<title>
		By: Mitch H.		</title>
		<link>https://thenewneo.com/2015/02/12/jews-and-politics/#comment-873600</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Mitch H.]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 16 Feb 2015 21:53:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://neoneocon.com/?p=46548#comment-873600</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[I have been reading Paul Johnson&#039;s &lt;i&gt;History of the Jews&lt;/i&gt;, which makes a sustained, coherent argument that the culture and inclinations underlying modern &quot;cultural&quot; Judaism is very old, very entrenched, and a traditional part of Jewish identity.  He notes the centuries-old practice of welfare-state-style policies, ghetto communalism, statist sympathies, the duty of wealth to subsidize intellectual study, a certain suspicion of the mob and democratic polities, and a general tendency towards urban life throughout the diaspora centuries.  I haven&#039;t finished the book yet, but he also touches on the social-democratic nature of the Zionist project, and the very conflicted relationship between the Ashkenazi masses and capitalism.

In short, Jews vote the way they do because of millennia of tradition and cultural inclination, for many of the same reasons that Kansans vote Republican.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I have been reading Paul Johnson&#8217;s <i>History of the Jews</i>, which makes a sustained, coherent argument that the culture and inclinations underlying modern &#8220;cultural&#8221; Judaism is very old, very entrenched, and a traditional part of Jewish identity.  He notes the centuries-old practice of welfare-state-style policies, ghetto communalism, statist sympathies, the duty of wealth to subsidize intellectual study, a certain suspicion of the mob and democratic polities, and a general tendency towards urban life throughout the diaspora centuries.  I haven&#8217;t finished the book yet, but he also touches on the social-democratic nature of the Zionist project, and the very conflicted relationship between the Ashkenazi masses and capitalism.</p>
<p>In short, Jews vote the way they do because of millennia of tradition and cultural inclination, for many of the same reasons that Kansans vote Republican.</p>
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		<title>
		By: JP		</title>
		<link>https://thenewneo.com/2015/02/12/jews-and-politics/#comment-873570</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[JP]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 16 Feb 2015 20:03:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://neoneocon.com/?p=46548#comment-873570</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[Interesting. Many thanks, neo-neocon.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Interesting. Many thanks, neo-neocon.</p>
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		<title>
		By: neo-neocon		</title>
		<link>https://thenewneo.com/2015/02/12/jews-and-politics/#comment-873546</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[neo-neocon]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 16 Feb 2015 18:38:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://neoneocon.com/?p=46548#comment-873546</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[JP:

I don&#039;t know whether Orthodox Jews vote less frequently, but I&#039;ve never read anything that indicates that.  The ones I know are very, very political.

As for the demographics, you &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.haaretz.com/jewish-world/jewish-world-opinions/1.609097&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;are correct&lt;/a&gt;:
&lt;blockquote&gt;...the factor most likely to push Jews towards the GOP is not Israel but demographics – Orthodox Jews vote Republican at a much higher rate than non-Orthodox Jews and are also growing at a much faster clip than any other portion of the Jewish population. (I would, however, quibble with his point about intermarriage – studies have indicated that intermarried, unaffiliated Jews vote just as Democratic as other non-Orthodox Jews.)

So someday, Jews may indeed start to vote more Republican. But if that happens, it probably won’t be Israel that drives the shift. And it probably won’t become apparent for many years to come. &lt;/blockquote&gt;]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>JP:</p>
<p>I don&#8217;t know whether Orthodox Jews vote less frequently, but I&#8217;ve never read anything that indicates that.  The ones I know are very, very political.</p>
<p>As for the demographics, you <a href="http://www.haaretz.com/jewish-world/jewish-world-opinions/1.609097" rel="nofollow">are correct</a>:</p>
<blockquote><p>&#8230;the factor most likely to push Jews towards the GOP is not Israel but demographics – Orthodox Jews vote Republican at a much higher rate than non-Orthodox Jews and are also growing at a much faster clip than any other portion of the Jewish population. (I would, however, quibble with his point about intermarriage – studies have indicated that intermarried, unaffiliated Jews vote just as Democratic as other non-Orthodox Jews.)</p>
<p>So someday, Jews may indeed start to vote more Republican. But if that happens, it probably won’t be Israel that drives the shift. And it probably won’t become apparent for many years to come. </p></blockquote>
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		<title>
		By: panpipes		</title>
		<link>https://thenewneo.com/2015/02/12/jews-and-politics/#comment-873518</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[panpipes]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 16 Feb 2015 16:32:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://neoneocon.com/?p=46548#comment-873518</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[Jews in countries outside of Israel support any political movement that undermines nationalism, they also fully support mass immigration to further water down borders and institutions.  This is a defensive measure as nationalists have issues with jews, they have for thousands of years.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Jews in countries outside of Israel support any political movement that undermines nationalism, they also fully support mass immigration to further water down borders and institutions.  This is a defensive measure as nationalists have issues with jews, they have for thousands of years.</p>
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		<title>
		By: JP		</title>
		<link>https://thenewneo.com/2015/02/12/jews-and-politics/#comment-873483</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[JP]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 16 Feb 2015 13:50:28 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://neoneocon.com/?p=46548#comment-873483</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[Questions from the goyim:

Is there any long-term demographic significance to the above statistics? I would hazard a guess that Orthodox and (for lack of a better term) quasi-Orthodox Jews who refer to themselves as Orthodox have more children than other American Jews, with the notable exception of ultra-Orthodox folks (see below). Assuming that their children absorb much of their politics, is it a stretch to think that a growing minority of American Jews might turn more conservative in the next few decades?

Apropos demographics but largely unrelated to conservative-liberal ethnoreligious splits, do ultra-Orthodox Jews participate much in the electoral process on a national level? I have a vague recollection that many in the largest cities vote or lobby (or both) for local district pols and officials, but also that others shun the political process entirely, and very few are particularly enamored of federal politics. Is this way off in (pun not intended) left field?]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Questions from the goyim:</p>
<p>Is there any long-term demographic significance to the above statistics? I would hazard a guess that Orthodox and (for lack of a better term) quasi-Orthodox Jews who refer to themselves as Orthodox have more children than other American Jews, with the notable exception of ultra-Orthodox folks (see below). Assuming that their children absorb much of their politics, is it a stretch to think that a growing minority of American Jews might turn more conservative in the next few decades?</p>
<p>Apropos demographics but largely unrelated to conservative-liberal ethnoreligious splits, do ultra-Orthodox Jews participate much in the electoral process on a national level? I have a vague recollection that many in the largest cities vote or lobby (or both) for local district pols and officials, but also that others shun the political process entirely, and very few are particularly enamored of federal politics. Is this way off in (pun not intended) left field?</p>
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		<title>
		By: MHJ		</title>
		<link>https://thenewneo.com/2015/02/12/jews-and-politics/#comment-873442</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[MHJ]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 16 Feb 2015 07:05:51 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://neoneocon.com/?p=46548#comment-873442</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[Simply put, many, maybe most Jews who left Europe did so to escape clerical-driven anti-Semitism, and their sympathies were for obvious and self-interested reasons with the liberal or left side of European politics (the right being monarchies and clericalism).  I&#039;m talking about after the failed revolutions of 1848 and fleeing the Tsarist pogroms in Russian Poland, Ukraine and Belorussia around the turn of the 20th century.  This left them prone to sympathize with every leftist idea that came down the pike (e.g., New Deal, Bolshevism) that wasn&#039;t overtly anti-Semitic (e.g., Naziism).

This became the way most reform and Conservative Jews defined themselves and their associative groups.

the tragedy is that as the world has changed and the old European monarchical-clerical Right has disappeared and the Left is now the great threat to Jews, they are so self- and group-identified with teh Left, they refuse to see it.  They see evangelical Christians as a threat, which is absurd, and don&#039;t take the lesson of leftists marching in support of Palestinian jihad.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Simply put, many, maybe most Jews who left Europe did so to escape clerical-driven anti-Semitism, and their sympathies were for obvious and self-interested reasons with the liberal or left side of European politics (the right being monarchies and clericalism).  I&#8217;m talking about after the failed revolutions of 1848 and fleeing the Tsarist pogroms in Russian Poland, Ukraine and Belorussia around the turn of the 20th century.  This left them prone to sympathize with every leftist idea that came down the pike (e.g., New Deal, Bolshevism) that wasn&#8217;t overtly anti-Semitic (e.g., Naziism).</p>
<p>This became the way most reform and Conservative Jews defined themselves and their associative groups.</p>
<p>the tragedy is that as the world has changed and the old European monarchical-clerical Right has disappeared and the Left is now the great threat to Jews, they are so self- and group-identified with teh Left, they refuse to see it.  They see evangelical Christians as a threat, which is absurd, and don&#8217;t take the lesson of leftists marching in support of Palestinian jihad.</p>
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		<title>
		By: FrancisChalk		</title>
		<link>https://thenewneo.com/2015/02/12/jews-and-politics/#comment-873434</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[FrancisChalk]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 16 Feb 2015 06:21:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://neoneocon.com/?p=46548#comment-873434</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[Collectivism and its modern equivalent, Marxism, have always enjoyed strong support among Jews. The Kibbutz is a unique Jewish construction that is as close to idealized communism as you can get. The Jews were a socialist minded people long before they ever set foot in New York, Chicago or Los Angeles.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Collectivism and its modern equivalent, Marxism, have always enjoyed strong support among Jews. The Kibbutz is a unique Jewish construction that is as close to idealized communism as you can get. The Jews were a socialist minded people long before they ever set foot in New York, Chicago or Los Angeles.</p>
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		<title>
		By: neo-neocon		</title>
		<link>https://thenewneo.com/2015/02/12/jews-and-politics/#comment-873424</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[neo-neocon]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 16 Feb 2015 05:53:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://neoneocon.com/?p=46548#comment-873424</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[Darren L:

What about the lives and attitudes of Sephardic Jews, who lived in Arab countries for millennia?   Or the Jews of pre-Czarist nineteenth century Ukraine in shtetls, who tended to be very poor?  I&#039;m not at all sure they had any sort of superior attitude; the shtetl Jews in particular were for the most part fairly downtrodden.

Isn&#039;t Jewish humor quite self-deprecating?  And the &quot;chosen people&quot; concept is often very misunderstood to mean a sense of superiority, which &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.aish.com/jl/jnj/jm/48931302.html&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;it does not mean&lt;/a&gt;.

However, for a number of reasons that are not well understood (but about which people have many theories), once Jews are given the opportunity to enter all professions, they often excel in certain professions (for example, look at &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org/jsource/Judaism/nobels.html&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;science and Nobel Prizes&lt;/a&gt;). This isn&#039;t about a sense of superiority, this is about actual achievement outside what would be expected for their numbers.  In and of itself, that can cause resentment.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Darren L:</p>
<p>What about the lives and attitudes of Sephardic Jews, who lived in Arab countries for millennia?   Or the Jews of pre-Czarist nineteenth century Ukraine in shtetls, who tended to be very poor?  I&#8217;m not at all sure they had any sort of superior attitude; the shtetl Jews in particular were for the most part fairly downtrodden.</p>
<p>Isn&#8217;t Jewish humor quite self-deprecating?  And the &#8220;chosen people&#8221; concept is often very misunderstood to mean a sense of superiority, which <a href="http://www.aish.com/jl/jnj/jm/48931302.html" rel="nofollow">it does not mean</a>.</p>
<p>However, for a number of reasons that are not well understood (but about which people have many theories), once Jews are given the opportunity to enter all professions, they often excel in certain professions (for example, look at <a href="http://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org/jsource/Judaism/nobels.html" rel="nofollow">science and Nobel Prizes</a>). This isn&#8217;t about a sense of superiority, this is about actual achievement outside what would be expected for their numbers.  In and of itself, that can cause resentment.</p>
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		<title>
		By: Darren L		</title>
		<link>https://thenewneo.com/2015/02/12/jews-and-politics/#comment-873422</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Darren L]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 16 Feb 2015 05:39:09 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://neoneocon.com/?p=46548#comment-873422</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[I have long admired Jewish intellectual capacity and work ethic, which is second to none.  I have also noticed a cyclicality to Jewish existence over hundreds of years.  They seem to wear out their welcome after a certain time.  Much of this I&#039;m sure is due to jealously and sour grapes from the majority population in the area they inhabit.

But I do believe there is some self inflicted damage.  Discourse has never been a Jewish strong suit.  One of the negative products of their success is a level of righteousness that almost borders on professing a predestined racial superiority.

Of course, in being a minority population wherever they&#039;ve settled...this has not served them well.  Many say that this brash lack of discourse is the result of years of oppression.  I believe that argument to be very much similar to the chicken and the egg.

I continue to support Israel&#039;s right to exist....as to me...it is a civilized oasis surrounded by ignorance and barbarism.

My hope is that the Jewish people see the warning signs around them...and are not blinded by the light of their own perceived greatness.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I have long admired Jewish intellectual capacity and work ethic, which is second to none.  I have also noticed a cyclicality to Jewish existence over hundreds of years.  They seem to wear out their welcome after a certain time.  Much of this I&#8217;m sure is due to jealously and sour grapes from the majority population in the area they inhabit.</p>
<p>But I do believe there is some self inflicted damage.  Discourse has never been a Jewish strong suit.  One of the negative products of their success is a level of righteousness that almost borders on professing a predestined racial superiority.</p>
<p>Of course, in being a minority population wherever they&#8217;ve settled&#8230;this has not served them well.  Many say that this brash lack of discourse is the result of years of oppression.  I believe that argument to be very much similar to the chicken and the egg.</p>
<p>I continue to support Israel&#8217;s right to exist&#8230;.as to me&#8230;it is a civilized oasis surrounded by ignorance and barbarism.</p>
<p>My hope is that the Jewish people see the warning signs around them&#8230;and are not blinded by the light of their own perceived greatness.</p>
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		<title>
		By: Bob From Virginia		</title>
		<link>https://thenewneo.com/2015/02/12/jews-and-politics/#comment-873413</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Bob From Virginia]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 16 Feb 2015 04:21:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://neoneocon.com/?p=46548#comment-873413</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[The fact that so many &quot;Jews&quot; believe a Palestinian state could co-exist with Israel (or anyone else for that matter) may say it all.  Such an opinion reflects a naive belief rather than a knowledge based on reality.  It arises as a result of isolation from the real world brought about by years of peace and prosperity; the very definition of the liberal worldview. 
Most Jews are liberals because they are wealthy enough to live in a fantasyland.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The fact that so many &#8220;Jews&#8221; believe a Palestinian state could co-exist with Israel (or anyone else for that matter) may say it all.  Such an opinion reflects a naive belief rather than a knowledge based on reality.  It arises as a result of isolation from the real world brought about by years of peace and prosperity; the very definition of the liberal worldview.<br />
Most Jews are liberals because they are wealthy enough to live in a fantasyland.</p>
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