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	Comments on: Independents rising	</title>
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	<link>https://thenewneo.com/2015/01/08/independents-rising/</link>
	<description>A blog about political change, among other things</description>
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		<title>
		By: Matt_SE		</title>
		<link>https://thenewneo.com/2015/01/08/independents-rising/#comment-861253</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Matt_SE]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 10 Jan 2015 00:48:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://neoneocon.com/?p=45725#comment-861253</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[As several have noted, this ought to be a time of resurgence for Republicans, but the statist, entrenched establishment&#039;s antics have been actively driving away voters.
I got involved at the local level, and am now a precinct committeeman. There is an active effort by the GOPe (or at least certain national-level members of it) to purge the ranks of non-supporters and we&#039;re trying to fight back. They are using all of the slimy tactics of the left and have long since gone beyond the pale. This is now a war.
I&#039;m convinced that part of the GOPe&#039;s actions are psyops, meant to dispirit the base and create apathy. That just makes me hate them more. We have an important meeting coming up soon; I&#039;ll give you the juicy details if I&#039;m able.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>As several have noted, this ought to be a time of resurgence for Republicans, but the statist, entrenched establishment&#8217;s antics have been actively driving away voters.<br />
I got involved at the local level, and am now a precinct committeeman. There is an active effort by the GOPe (or at least certain national-level members of it) to purge the ranks of non-supporters and we&#8217;re trying to fight back. They are using all of the slimy tactics of the left and have long since gone beyond the pale. This is now a war.<br />
I&#8217;m convinced that part of the GOPe&#8217;s actions are psyops, meant to dispirit the base and create apathy. That just makes me hate them more. We have an important meeting coming up soon; I&#8217;ll give you the juicy details if I&#8217;m able.</p>
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		<title>
		By: Artfldgr		</title>
		<link>https://thenewneo.com/2015/01/08/independents-rising/#comment-861164</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Artfldgr]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 09 Jan 2015 18:18:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://neoneocon.com/?p=45725#comment-861164</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[but what of the real independents.. the lumbersexuals?

Take one flannel shirt, one Mike Napoli beard circa October 2013, mix in an iPhone 6 and some workboots, then add an overpolished ax and flavor with homebrewed craft beer and you&#039;ve got the latest lifestyle fashion trend for men: the &quot;Lumbersexual.&quot;]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>but what of the real independents.. the lumbersexuals?</p>
<p>Take one flannel shirt, one Mike Napoli beard circa October 2013, mix in an iPhone 6 and some workboots, then add an overpolished ax and flavor with homebrewed craft beer and you&#8217;ve got the latest lifestyle fashion trend for men: the &#8220;Lumbersexual.&#8221;</p>
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		<title>
		By: Artfldgr		</title>
		<link>https://thenewneo.com/2015/01/08/independents-rising/#comment-861144</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Artfldgr]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 09 Jan 2015 15:38:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://neoneocon.com/?p=45725#comment-861144</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[interesting point as to government control of energy, forcing the price to skyrocket in terms of generation. 

the greenies are going to have a fit when the cost of buying power from the power plants that ended 50 gigawats of generating power by 2016. At some point the cost of having the power come from the power company will be lower than the cost of generating your own power using a small 10,000 watt generator (with efficiency inverters). 

right now i just computed the costs, and its potentially cheaper to hook up such a thing and save energy in NY where power is really expensive compared to other areas. 

without artificial taxes raising the prices arbitrarily, the cost of power generation from a power plant would be too expensive to buy... note that the smaller you get in terms of generators, the more pollution you get per unit watt. 

&lt;b&gt;real independents think independently.. &lt;/b&gt;

its possible, if you own your own property, to install a large tank, buy gas when its really cheap, and then use it for power over other sources... 

its interesting to think that if we didnt vote so poorly and the system was allowed to not be bastardized by arbitrary taxes, fees, etc....    how much would actually get to stay in the earners pockets vs the pet projects of the liberals... like making farting a feminist issue... there is a good use of $$$... (not)]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>interesting point as to government control of energy, forcing the price to skyrocket in terms of generation. </p>
<p>the greenies are going to have a fit when the cost of buying power from the power plants that ended 50 gigawats of generating power by 2016. At some point the cost of having the power come from the power company will be lower than the cost of generating your own power using a small 10,000 watt generator (with efficiency inverters). </p>
<p>right now i just computed the costs, and its potentially cheaper to hook up such a thing and save energy in NY where power is really expensive compared to other areas. </p>
<p>without artificial taxes raising the prices arbitrarily, the cost of power generation from a power plant would be too expensive to buy&#8230; note that the smaller you get in terms of generators, the more pollution you get per unit watt. </p>
<p><b>real independents think independently.. </b></p>
<p>its possible, if you own your own property, to install a large tank, buy gas when its really cheap, and then use it for power over other sources&#8230; </p>
<p>its interesting to think that if we didnt vote so poorly and the system was allowed to not be bastardized by arbitrary taxes, fees, etc&#8230;.    how much would actually get to stay in the earners pockets vs the pet projects of the liberals&#8230; like making farting a feminist issue&#8230; there is a good use of $$$&#8230; (not)</p>
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		<title>
		By: physicsguy		</title>
		<link>https://thenewneo.com/2015/01/08/independents-rising/#comment-861131</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[physicsguy]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 09 Jan 2015 14:20:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://neoneocon.com/?p=45725#comment-861131</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[I&#039;m one of those points on that rising Independent curve.  I left the GOP 18 months ago.   I wondered how many on that curve have done the same thing.  Looking at the graph, Ind and GOP were about equal at 33% in &#039;05.  Since then, Inds increased to 43%, and GOP decreased to 26%.  Looks like maybe 6 out of 10 of the rise of Inds comes from GOP defections.

Just came over from reading American Thinker where there&#039;s a great article of how the establishment GOP is clueless about what is going on with the conservative base.   It cites how both Levin and Palin have publicly stated that their association with the GOP is hanging by a thread.  The next few months could be interesting, in a Chinese saying sense.

http://www.americanthinker.com/articles/2015/01/palin_levin_walk_2016_nomination.html]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;m one of those points on that rising Independent curve.  I left the GOP 18 months ago.   I wondered how many on that curve have done the same thing.  Looking at the graph, Ind and GOP were about equal at 33% in &#8217;05.  Since then, Inds increased to 43%, and GOP decreased to 26%.  Looks like maybe 6 out of 10 of the rise of Inds comes from GOP defections.</p>
<p>Just came over from reading American Thinker where there&#8217;s a great article of how the establishment GOP is clueless about what is going on with the conservative base.   It cites how both Levin and Palin have publicly stated that their association with the GOP is hanging by a thread.  The next few months could be interesting, in a Chinese saying sense.</p>
<p><a href="http://www.americanthinker.com/articles/2015/01/palin_levin_walk_2016_nomination.html" rel="nofollow ugc">http://www.americanthinker.com/articles/2015/01/palin_levin_walk_2016_nomination.html</a></p>
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		<title>
		By: Exasperated		</title>
		<link>https://thenewneo.com/2015/01/08/independents-rising/#comment-861127</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Exasperated]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 09 Jan 2015 13:28:19 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://neoneocon.com/?p=45725#comment-861127</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[Sorry GB, this does not compute for me.

Would one of those economic “worn out cliches” by chance be ‘the law of supply and demand’?

The answer is, no, of course not.  My expectation of private sector elected officials, who have a track record of success, is that they have a greater understanding and appreciation of the market and market forces, and that they know that the genius of capitalism is that it harnesses the individual&#039;s impulse for material comfort and security to incentivize innovation for the  benefit of all and  the greater good.    BTW, I&#039;m not referring to the business people who use the revolving door to pop in and out of the executive branch.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Sorry GB, this does not compute for me.</p>
<p>Would one of those economic “worn out cliches” by chance be ‘the law of supply and demand’?</p>
<p>The answer is, no, of course not.  My expectation of private sector elected officials, who have a track record of success, is that they have a greater understanding and appreciation of the market and market forces, and that they know that the genius of capitalism is that it harnesses the individual&#8217;s impulse for material comfort and security to incentivize innovation for the  benefit of all and  the greater good.    BTW, I&#8217;m not referring to the business people who use the revolving door to pop in and out of the executive branch.</p>
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		<title>
		By: G Joubert		</title>
		<link>https://thenewneo.com/2015/01/08/independents-rising/#comment-861075</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[G Joubert]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 09 Jan 2015 08:07:51 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://neoneocon.com/?p=45725#comment-861075</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[The official Republican apparatus is spineless. That&#039;s why many conservatives who would otherwise be Republicans are independents.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The official Republican apparatus is spineless. That&#8217;s why many conservatives who would otherwise be Republicans are independents.</p>
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		<title>
		By: Blacque Jacques Shellacque		</title>
		<link>https://thenewneo.com/2015/01/08/independents-rising/#comment-861074</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Blacque Jacques Shellacque]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 09 Jan 2015 07:57:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://neoneocon.com/?p=45725#comment-861074</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[&lt;i&gt;The number of US citizens who call themselves “Independents” has risen in recent years.&lt;/i&gt;

Well, many of the Republicans haven&#039;t offered much in the way of opposition to Democrats as of late, so it makes no sense to wholeheartedly embrace that brand. At least, not until the establishment types and the phonies are purged from their ranks, if that is to happen.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><i>The number of US citizens who call themselves “Independents” has risen in recent years.</i></p>
<p>Well, many of the Republicans haven&#8217;t offered much in the way of opposition to Democrats as of late, so it makes no sense to wholeheartedly embrace that brand. At least, not until the establishment types and the phonies are purged from their ranks, if that is to happen.</p>
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		<title>
		By: KLSmith		</title>
		<link>https://thenewneo.com/2015/01/08/independents-rising/#comment-861055</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[KLSmith]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 09 Jan 2015 03:55:51 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://neoneocon.com/?p=45725#comment-861055</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[GB : you&#039;re not missing anything, the classification is just too simple. I believe Pew puts out a list of political identification categories that has around 12  groups. It&#039;s pretty interesting. 
A group that includes the working poor could be considered socially conservative but they don&#039;t have a problem with big government. They think govt should do more to help the poor but they also disapprove of welfare cheats.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>GB : you&#8217;re not missing anything, the classification is just too simple. I believe Pew puts out a list of political identification categories that has around 12  groups. It&#8217;s pretty interesting.<br />
A group that includes the working poor could be considered socially conservative but they don&#8217;t have a problem with big government. They think govt should do more to help the poor but they also disapprove of welfare cheats.</p>
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		<title>
		By: J.J.		</title>
		<link>https://thenewneo.com/2015/01/08/independents-rising/#comment-861054</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[J.J.]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 09 Jan 2015 03:52:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://neoneocon.com/?p=45725#comment-861054</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[I think a majority of people in the country are fiscally conservative. In other words they would like to see the government spend less and tax less. They live their lives working hard, paying their bills, and being good neighbors. But many of them are socially liberal. They like libertarian ideas of abortion &quot;choice,&quot; gay rights, women&#039;s rights,  sexual freedom, etc. Many of them may consider themselves independents, but since the dems always make conservative social issue positions the major issues, they are attracted to the dem candidates.  The MSM reinforces this narrative that any conservative candidate wants to repeal Roe v. Wade, take away gay rights/sexual freedom/women&#039;s rights, and act as a censor on porn/internet freedom/drug use/etc.  The social issues always, always are the main narrative in an election. Fiscal conservatism is also waved away as being cruel to the down-trodden underclasses. 

Let&#039;s face it, talking about budgeting, saving money, cutting back, setting priorities, etc. is real snooze material compared with the inflammatory rhetoric that can be used when debating social issues.  Besides, a 100 billion here and a hundred billion there and people cannot envision what it means. All they know is that conservatives have been talking about fiscal sanity for a long time and yet, even with 18 trillion in debt, the ship, USS Government, is still afloat. The day of reckoning seems remote.

That&#039;s the situation in my neighborhood.  The majority are fiscally conservative, but being Puget Sound, many are social liberals. This being Puget Sound they are subjected to a constant narrative of social liberalism and few have ever sat down to think about how economies work, why some countries are richer than others, where wealth comes from or how it&#039;s created. 
Most count themselves as proud independents but vote for the social liberals.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think a majority of people in the country are fiscally conservative. In other words they would like to see the government spend less and tax less. They live their lives working hard, paying their bills, and being good neighbors. But many of them are socially liberal. They like libertarian ideas of abortion &#8220;choice,&#8221; gay rights, women&#8217;s rights,  sexual freedom, etc. Many of them may consider themselves independents, but since the dems always make conservative social issue positions the major issues, they are attracted to the dem candidates.  The MSM reinforces this narrative that any conservative candidate wants to repeal Roe v. Wade, take away gay rights/sexual freedom/women&#8217;s rights, and act as a censor on porn/internet freedom/drug use/etc.  The social issues always, always are the main narrative in an election. Fiscal conservatism is also waved away as being cruel to the down-trodden underclasses. </p>
<p>Let&#8217;s face it, talking about budgeting, saving money, cutting back, setting priorities, etc. is real snooze material compared with the inflammatory rhetoric that can be used when debating social issues.  Besides, a 100 billion here and a hundred billion there and people cannot envision what it means. All they know is that conservatives have been talking about fiscal sanity for a long time and yet, even with 18 trillion in debt, the ship, USS Government, is still afloat. The day of reckoning seems remote.</p>
<p>That&#8217;s the situation in my neighborhood.  The majority are fiscally conservative, but being Puget Sound, many are social liberals. This being Puget Sound they are subjected to a constant narrative of social liberalism and few have ever sat down to think about how economies work, why some countries are richer than others, where wealth comes from or how it&#8217;s created.<br />
Most count themselves as proud independents but vote for the social liberals.</p>
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		<title>
		By: M J R		</title>
		<link>https://thenewneo.com/2015/01/08/independents-rising/#comment-861038</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[M J R]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 09 Jan 2015 02:05:28 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://neoneocon.com/?p=45725#comment-861038</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[Geoffrey Britain, 5:57 pm -- &quot;So, if 38% identify as conservative vs 23% liberal and among independents conservatives lead as well . . . how can democrats have the advantage?&quot;

I know people who *fancy* themselves conservative, and, compared to those with whom I think they generally associate, by golly they *are* (by comparison) conservative.  In some cases, stereotypically speaking here, there are in fact blue-collar no-nonsense type people who are in fact conservative under many variant definitions of the word.

At the same time, there are those who have always been Democrat, whose parents have always been Democrat, whose grandparents have always been Democrat -- dear reader is invited to perpetuate the sequence as far back in time as desired -- and whose *local* politician in fact does a good job of bringing home the bacon and making sure to look after his constituents.  (For example, &quot;blue-collar no-nonsense type people&quot;, anyone?)

So many of them persist in leaning and voting Democrat, partly out of habit, partly out of tribalism, partly out of stasis; particularly towards the bottom of the ballot.  Q.E.D.?]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Geoffrey Britain, 5:57 pm &#8212; &#8220;So, if 38% identify as conservative vs 23% liberal and among independents conservatives lead as well . . . how can democrats have the advantage?&#8221;</p>
<p>I know people who *fancy* themselves conservative, and, compared to those with whom I think they generally associate, by golly they *are* (by comparison) conservative.  In some cases, stereotypically speaking here, there are in fact blue-collar no-nonsense type people who are in fact conservative under many variant definitions of the word.</p>
<p>At the same time, there are those who have always been Democrat, whose parents have always been Democrat, whose grandparents have always been Democrat &#8212; dear reader is invited to perpetuate the sequence as far back in time as desired &#8212; and whose *local* politician in fact does a good job of bringing home the bacon and making sure to look after his constituents.  (For example, &#8220;blue-collar no-nonsense type people&#8221;, anyone?)</p>
<p>So many of them persist in leaning and voting Democrat, partly out of habit, partly out of tribalism, partly out of stasis; particularly towards the bottom of the ballot.  Q.E.D.?</p>
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