Comments on: The salon de refuses of publishing

By: Caedmon

Caedmon — Mon, 11 Mar 2013 15:13:53 +0000

I must say that one of the things self-publishing has taught me is that publishing is not as easy as it looks to writers.

By: vanderleun

vanderleun — Sun, 10 Mar 2013 03:46:28 +0000

What can I say? Springtime for self-publishing. Have at it. Pack a lunch. Take a blanket.

By: Sgt. Mom

Sgt. Mom — Sun, 10 Mar 2013 00:29:23 +0000

What ziontruth said … look, I won’t deny that a lot of indy-published stuff is absolute drek, and that a fully-functioning trad publisher likely spared the reading public great mountains of absolute drek bound between covers and inflicted on the public. But there was a dreadful line being drawn by trad publishers between what is good, and which some portion of the reading public would find interesting/readable/amusing, and that which trad publishers see as potentially hugely profitable. I’ve read a good few indy books as a reviewer – and some of them are just amazing. Like Neo and James Herriot – I can’t see how an acquisitions editor could have given a pass, even if dazed to a coma by the mountains of bad manuscripts.

In my own case, Vanderleun – I had a nice-sized pool of readers who wanted my first book in print, and the opinion of some hardened publishing professionals who had a good opinion of it to go on. But … under the old way of doing things, I would never have had a chance. And so do a lot of other indy-published books who have a chance for readers to judge for themselves. The Amazon ‘look inside’ feature allows readers the same facility to check out a couple of pages and chapters – just about what I was asked to provide when I was pitching my MS to publishers and agents five or six years ago.
The word is among indy-author circles, is that now savvy publishers are looking at indy-books and authors which have good but unspectacular sales records. Now the screening mechanism isn’t the slush pile, or the agencies … it’s actual sales performance.

By: ziontruth

ziontruth — Sat, 09 Mar 2013 23:05:17 +0000

vanderleun,

“People who would be ‘authors’ seldom understand just how bad they are.”

That may be true, but that’s not for a single person with the title of “Editor” to determine. The only time a writer ought to come to the conclusion that he doesn’t have it is when the public has gotten hold of his stuff and rejected it. The whole problem with having a single point of access is that it takes the judgment away from the public. In matters of taste, your judgment has the same worth as mine.

“…submissions that we rightfully sent down to the pit.”

You didn’t. Only the public can rightfully do that. Thank God for the expanded possibilities of self-publishing, meaning authors can now deliver their books to public judgment as they should be, instead of having to pass single middlemen like you. Your old job was never justified at all, it was only a material necessity of older, pre-Internet times.

By: vanderleun

vanderleun — Sat, 09 Mar 2013 19:21:39 +0000

“Nevertheless it is very odd that so many good ones ARE missed.”

Not odd at all when you know the level of quality of those that must still dive into the slush pile.

By: vanderleun

vanderleun — Sat, 09 Mar 2013 18:39:11 +0000

Again, the ratio of hits to misses is very high.

By: neo-neocon

neo-neocon — Sat, 09 Mar 2013 18:36:50 +0000

vanderleun: well, of course there are tons of bad ones to every good one, and to every good one missed.

Nevertheless it is very odd that so many good ones ARE missed. I cannot imagine, for example, reading James Herriot’s work and not grabbing it forthwith. And there are many many more examples of good books passed on than that article mentioned. That book I owned had about a hundred of them, as I recall, very famous ones (and A Confederacy of Dunces didn’t appear there, because I think my book was older than that).

By: vanderleun

vanderleun — Sat, 09 Mar 2013 18:06:07 +0000

As a man who was once a senior editor (200+ books on all subjects) and director of trade paperback publishing (a number more of reprints, etc.) at Houghton Mifflin company….. as well as a man whé¸ worked many years as the fiction and senior editor and European publisher of Penthouse and Omni magazines…. I am always deeply touched and at the same time amused by lists such as thé¸se on Cracked. They’ve got five. And five to ten titles is pretty much what these lists always run to. And guess what? Confederacy of Effing Dunces is always on these lists.

And I always think….. “Hey, for better or worse the publishing industry goes through tens upon tens of thousands of submissions every year and these bozos always come back to Confederacy of Effing Dunces. And I say, so…every now and then we miss one. So EFFING WHAT!?”

Trust me when I say that for every hidden gem you or he or she wrote that we “missed” there was a long, long freight trained jammed to the walls of really crappy, stupid, awful, and revolting submissions that we rightfully sent down to the pit.

And yes there are a lot of BAAAAAAAD books published, but that’s a whole other story.

People who would be “authors” seldom understand just how bad they are. After all, your mom read it and loved it, right? Right.

By: Sgt. Mom

Sgt. Mom — Sat, 09 Mar 2013 15:05:13 +0000

Oh, yes – I went through the submissions drill in and around 2004-2006, only my chore was trying to find an agent who would take me on, on the strength of a historical novel which I had also posted chapters to on the milblog SSDB. I actually got as far as having two or three of them read it entire, and say very nice and flattering things about it … but that it just wasn’t ‘marketable’. (Whaaaaattt?) I raised some funds through readers and fans, and published it POD, on the advice of a book-blogger called Grumpy Old Bookman, who had decades of experience in English publishing. That first book is still my best-seller, although I hardly do any marketing for it (mostly because I wrote and released five more historicals since then.)
But it really was horribly discouraging there for a while – it almost ruined my enjoyment of bookstores. Here were all these celebrity authors, and these genre writers writing the same book for the 20th time … and THEY could get an agent, and a publishing deal! Then I got together with some other indy authors and compared notes, and figured out how the traditional publishing world was collapsing in onto itself, and I didn’t feel so slighted. Apparently as some guy pointed out – none of us knew the right people in publishing. It has turned out, though – many of us have worked up a nice readership for our books anyway. Before e-readers and before the POD printing method and Amazon – we wouldn’t have gotten anywhere. Because of all that, there are some fantastically good books out there … although I’m afraid a lot of indy-published stuff is every bit as bad as trad publishing puts out there.
(JJ …. pssst … a secret. Writing the book is only half the job. Marketing it is the other half. 200 copies sold is not half-bad, actually. That’s about what the average book in print sells. Really.)

By: JJ formerly Jimmy J.

JJ formerly Jimmy J. — Sat, 09 Mar 2013 03:56:57 +0000

There are probably many frustrated writers reading and commenting here. neo hosts a blog that encourages reasoned debate and there are many good thinkers and writers here.

I’m one of the frustrated writers. Got the rejection slips to prove I have no writing ability. So, I published a book myself. It didn’t cost much – $1000. I figured I would sell at least a 1000 copies. (Dream on!) It was listed on Amazon, had a decent cover, and I went to all the book stores in my area offering the book on consignment. Even made some presentations at book stores that had author nights to promote their books. Just sit back and wait for the sales to kick in. Yeah, right. It sold about 200 books. (Sob!) Might have known. A book about a conservative and the life events that shaped his philosophy and values was not going to sell in the People’s Republic of Puget Sound. Unfortunately, few noticed it on Amazon either.

I’m now exploring doing it as 99 cent e-book on Amazon. It’s not as easy as just putting it in the word processor and sending it off to Amazon. But I don’t think there are too many technical issues I can’t figure out. At least it might catch on and it’s already written. Just make a few updates and edits, then off to the huge market that is Amazon e-books. Well, I can dream can’t I?