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	Comments on: More reflections on SCOTUS and Obamacare and the future	</title>
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	<link>https://thenewneo.com/2012/06/30/more-reflections-on-scotus-and-obamacare-and-the-future/</link>
	<description>A blog about political change, among other things</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Mon, 02 Jul 2012 17:05:24 +0000</lastBuildDate>
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		<title>
		By: DNW		</title>
		<link>https://thenewneo.com/2012/06/30/more-reflections-on-scotus-and-obamacare-and-the-future/#comment-378481</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[DNW]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 02 Jul 2012 17:05:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://neoneocon.com/?p=17734#comment-378481</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[Neo:

In the context of my earlier laudatory comments directed at your prescience:  I now see that  my assumption that Wickard V Filburn may have played a role in the reasoning was not well founded. http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-3460_162-57464549/roberts-switched-views-to-uphold-health-care-law/?pageNum=3


Nonetheless, your April comments stand as a valuable reminder as to just how far and for how long historically speaking, we have traveled down the path toward a kind of at least presumptive statism. Most of us just never noticed it while it directly affected the only the few, or the many infrequently.



We have now, with this barely closeted socialist in the WH,  embarked on a new era, when they have satisfied themselves that with the collectivist principles all having been finagled into in place over seventy or more years, the time for ever greater and more intensive and inescapable implementation is at hand.

As a side note, what I find interesting is a change in justificatory language used by collectivists over the years. 


In the old days, at least among the mainstream political class of liberals (if not the admitted Marxists in academia and activists on the political fringe) , there seemed to be at least a cursory nod toward the libertarian limiting principles of our founding, albeit sandwiched between the slabs of supposed necessity and balanced interests.

There seems to be almost none of that anymore. Just the announced will of the progressive to have based on your provision; justified on the on the power of a voting plurality.

I wonder how you reason or negotiate with an appetite that wills what it wills, because it wills to dominate unconditionally and without limit.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Neo:</p>
<p>In the context of my earlier laudatory comments directed at your prescience:  I now see that  my assumption that Wickard V Filburn may have played a role in the reasoning was not well founded. <a href="http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-3460_162-57464549/roberts-switched-views-to-uphold-health-care-law/?pageNum=3" rel="nofollow ugc">http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-3460_162-57464549/roberts-switched-views-to-uphold-health-care-law/?pageNum=3</a></p>
<p>Nonetheless, your April comments stand as a valuable reminder as to just how far and for how long historically speaking, we have traveled down the path toward a kind of at least presumptive statism. Most of us just never noticed it while it directly affected the only the few, or the many infrequently.</p>
<p>We have now, with this barely closeted socialist in the WH,  embarked on a new era, when they have satisfied themselves that with the collectivist principles all having been finagled into in place over seventy or more years, the time for ever greater and more intensive and inescapable implementation is at hand.</p>
<p>As a side note, what I find interesting is a change in justificatory language used by collectivists over the years. </p>
<p>In the old days, at least among the mainstream political class of liberals (if not the admitted Marxists in academia and activists on the political fringe) , there seemed to be at least a cursory nod toward the libertarian limiting principles of our founding, albeit sandwiched between the slabs of supposed necessity and balanced interests.</p>
<p>There seems to be almost none of that anymore. Just the announced will of the progressive to have based on your provision; justified on the on the power of a voting plurality.</p>
<p>I wonder how you reason or negotiate with an appetite that wills what it wills, because it wills to dominate unconditionally and without limit.</p>
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		<title>
		By: Curtis		</title>
		<link>https://thenewneo.com/2012/06/30/more-reflections-on-scotus-and-obamacare-and-the-future/#comment-378465</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Curtis]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 02 Jul 2012 16:39:12 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://neoneocon.com/?p=17734#comment-378465</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[I have to be honest with the facts (if this is indeed a factual finding):

http://www.americanthinker.com/2012/07/forget_immigration_its_big_government_hispanic_voters_want.html

Rather saying this particular bread in the bag isn&#039;t going to toast so well. There is some decrease in the number of guppies per generation, just not as much as one would hope.

I find any look towards government for anything other than national protection (military) so alien and reprehensible that I cannot understand why anyone would make themselves thralls. And there I go making me into everyone else. Which makes me the world&#039;s worst prognosticator.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I have to be honest with the facts (if this is indeed a factual finding):</p>
<p><a href="http://www.americanthinker.com/2012/07/forget_immigration_its_big_government_hispanic_voters_want.html" rel="nofollow ugc">http://www.americanthinker.com/2012/07/forget_immigration_its_big_government_hispanic_voters_want.html</a></p>
<p>Rather saying this particular bread in the bag isn&#8217;t going to toast so well. There is some decrease in the number of guppies per generation, just not as much as one would hope.</p>
<p>I find any look towards government for anything other than national protection (military) so alien and reprehensible that I cannot understand why anyone would make themselves thralls. And there I go making me into everyone else. Which makes me the world&#8217;s worst prognosticator.</p>
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		<title>
		By: Curtis		</title>
		<link>https://thenewneo.com/2012/06/30/more-reflections-on-scotus-and-obamacare-and-the-future/#comment-378433</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Curtis]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 02 Jul 2012 15:27:34 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://neoneocon.com/?p=17734#comment-378433</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[The question is not whether we are toast but if there shall arrive a point at which we must fight. Romney (and Roberts) represents a hope that the good sense of America will prevail and those who mean to fundamentally transform her will be defeated through the cultural and political process. Thus, Romney appeals to our patience; and to those in between he wants to look like the better rational choice. To the occupiers and the rest of the illiberals he offers the rare taken chance to change.  

Roberts (now that it has come to light that he actually changed his vote) did something of the same thing: he believes there is enough goodness left in the illiberals that their opinion is worth something. And why would he think different as he has spent his whole life working with &quot;them.&quot; 

But &quot;we&quot; know &quot;them&quot; and don&#039;t trust them. I believe there are both sides in Romney and that his &quot;appeasement&quot; is somewhat true but so is his fight. He, like Roberts, has worked with &quot;them&quot; as well, but I do not think we are looking at similar responses.

So Obama gets a second term. He will reap what is surely coming. We must pay the price for laziness. And that is the sin, the wrong thinking and action we did as a nation. We let government become our savior. Let government promise prosperity, freedom, luxury, ease . . . healthcare.

So we are toast in that the bread in the toaster got burned and there&#039;s no unburning it. But there&#039;s still bread in the bag waiting for tomorrow&#039;s breakfast.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The question is not whether we are toast but if there shall arrive a point at which we must fight. Romney (and Roberts) represents a hope that the good sense of America will prevail and those who mean to fundamentally transform her will be defeated through the cultural and political process. Thus, Romney appeals to our patience; and to those in between he wants to look like the better rational choice. To the occupiers and the rest of the illiberals he offers the rare taken chance to change.  </p>
<p>Roberts (now that it has come to light that he actually changed his vote) did something of the same thing: he believes there is enough goodness left in the illiberals that their opinion is worth something. And why would he think different as he has spent his whole life working with &#8220;them.&#8221; </p>
<p>But &#8220;we&#8221; know &#8220;them&#8221; and don&#8217;t trust them. I believe there are both sides in Romney and that his &#8220;appeasement&#8221; is somewhat true but so is his fight. He, like Roberts, has worked with &#8220;them&#8221; as well, but I do not think we are looking at similar responses.</p>
<p>So Obama gets a second term. He will reap what is surely coming. We must pay the price for laziness. And that is the sin, the wrong thinking and action we did as a nation. We let government become our savior. Let government promise prosperity, freedom, luxury, ease . . . healthcare.</p>
<p>So we are toast in that the bread in the toaster got burned and there&#8217;s no unburning it. But there&#8217;s still bread in the bag waiting for tomorrow&#8217;s breakfast.</p>
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		<title>
		By: baklava		</title>
		<link>https://thenewneo.com/2012/06/30/more-reflections-on-scotus-and-obamacare-and-the-future/#comment-378423</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[baklava]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 02 Jul 2012 14:58:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://neoneocon.com/?p=17734#comment-378423</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[I agree Steve. The past costs are long replaced due to govt, lawyers, insurance requirements, and technology.

We can&#039;t rewind bit we can sure try to eliminate some costs.

I believe we&#039;ve gained thatsector of irresponsible voters who don&#039;t want to pay the tax or the insurance.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I agree Steve. The past costs are long replaced due to govt, lawyers, insurance requirements, and technology.</p>
<p>We can&#8217;t rewind bit we can sure try to eliminate some costs.</p>
<p>I believe we&#8217;ve gained thatsector of irresponsible voters who don&#8217;t want to pay the tax or the insurance.</p>
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		<title>
		By: Curtis		</title>
		<link>https://thenewneo.com/2012/06/30/more-reflections-on-scotus-and-obamacare-and-the-future/#comment-378417</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Curtis]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 02 Jul 2012 14:46:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://neoneocon.com/?p=17734#comment-378417</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[Well, let&#039;s butter and jam ourselves up for our new overlords. We don&#039;t want to be unnecessarily distasteful.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Well, let&#8217;s butter and jam ourselves up for our new overlords. We don&#8217;t want to be unnecessarily distasteful.</p>
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		<title>
		By: Don Carlos		</title>
		<link>https://thenewneo.com/2012/06/30/more-reflections-on-scotus-and-obamacare-and-the-future/#comment-378396</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Don Carlos]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 02 Jul 2012 13:46:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://neoneocon.com/?p=17734#comment-378396</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[backlava:
Yes indeed, the WSJ editorial board gets it.
We are in the toaster, and we are done for.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>backlava:<br />
Yes indeed, the WSJ editorial board gets it.<br />
We are in the toaster, and we are done for.</p>
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		<title>
		By: SteveH		</title>
		<link>https://thenewneo.com/2012/06/30/more-reflections-on-scotus-and-obamacare-and-the-future/#comment-378337</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[SteveH]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 02 Jul 2012 11:07:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://neoneocon.com/?p=17734#comment-378337</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[&quot;&quot;Why do people believe that health care should be free. You need to buy it&quot;&quot;
baklava

 The issue is the gross deformity in medical cost due to government intervention. I mean, if you break your arm and it cost as much to repair as you make in a year, something is terribly wrong.

 But who am i to be repulsed by such a system? Just pay whatever they demand and prop the whole mess up so my grandkids can enjoy it i guess.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;&#8221;Why do people believe that health care should be free. You need to buy it&#8221;&#8221;<br />
baklava</p>
<p> The issue is the gross deformity in medical cost due to government intervention. I mean, if you break your arm and it cost as much to repair as you make in a year, something is terribly wrong.</p>
<p> But who am i to be repulsed by such a system? Just pay whatever they demand and prop the whole mess up so my grandkids can enjoy it i guess.</p>
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		<title>
		By: baklava		</title>
		<link>https://thenewneo.com/2012/06/30/more-reflections-on-scotus-and-obamacare-and-the-future/#comment-378251</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[baklava]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 02 Jul 2012 05:47:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://neoneocon.com/?p=17734#comment-378251</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052702303561504577496520011395292.html

As does this writer don Carlos]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><a href="http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052702303561504577496520011395292.html" rel="nofollow ugc">http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052702303561504577496520011395292.html</a></p>
<p>As does this writer don Carlos</p>
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		<title>
		By: Don Carlos		</title>
		<link>https://thenewneo.com/2012/06/30/more-reflections-on-scotus-and-obamacare-and-the-future/#comment-378230</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Don Carlos]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 02 Jul 2012 04:17:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://neoneocon.com/?p=17734#comment-378230</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[Neo: I quite agree with your yesterday post, and I accept your counter that it is the placid other that is being sanguine, and stand corrected.
I trust I have made my own thoughts on the Ruling entirely clear.

As an oncologist I have gotten used to anticipating the future clinical course of many malignant diagnoses. When a 50y.o. man has a
first seizure and MRI is consistent with a parietal glioblastoma (thus incompletely resectable) I know he will be dead in a year despite all we can do.
Sometimes in my advanced years I have the same sense of anticipating horrible socio-political develoments.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Neo: I quite agree with your yesterday post, and I accept your counter that it is the placid other that is being sanguine, and stand corrected.<br />
I trust I have made my own thoughts on the Ruling entirely clear.</p>
<p>As an oncologist I have gotten used to anticipating the future clinical course of many malignant diagnoses. When a 50y.o. man has a<br />
first seizure and MRI is consistent with a parietal glioblastoma (thus incompletely resectable) I know he will be dead in a year despite all we can do.<br />
Sometimes in my advanced years I have the same sense of anticipating horrible socio-political develoments.</p>
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		<title>
		By: baklava		</title>
		<link>https://thenewneo.com/2012/06/30/more-reflections-on-scotus-and-obamacare-and-the-future/#comment-378222</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[baklava]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 02 Jul 2012 03:52:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://neoneocon.com/?p=17734#comment-378222</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[75% of obamacare costs fall on those making $120k or less according to wall street journal]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>75% of obamacare costs fall on those making $120k or less according to wall street journal</p>
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