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	Comments on: After Florida	</title>
	<atom:link href="https://thenewneo.com/2012/02/01/after-florida/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>https://thenewneo.com/2012/02/01/after-florida/</link>
	<description>A blog about political change, among other things</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Mon, 06 Feb 2012 11:50:55 +0000</lastBuildDate>
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		<title>
		By: ConceptJunkie		</title>
		<link>https://thenewneo.com/2012/02/01/after-florida/#comment-313810</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[ConceptJunkie]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 06 Feb 2012 11:50:55 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://neoneocon.com/?p=13369#comment-313810</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[@Curtis:

I know I missed the party on this discussion, but I wish... _wish_ a Republican would give answers in a debate half as good as what you did.

Of course, it would help if we actually had real debates instead of this retarded &quot;joint press conference&quot; format.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@Curtis:</p>
<p>I know I missed the party on this discussion, but I wish&#8230; _wish_ a Republican would give answers in a debate half as good as what you did.</p>
<p>Of course, it would help if we actually had real debates instead of this retarded &#8220;joint press conference&#8221; format.</p>
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		<title>
		By: neo-neocon		</title>
		<link>https://thenewneo.com/2012/02/01/after-florida/#comment-312646</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[neo-neocon]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 03 Feb 2012 06:31:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://neoneocon.com/?p=13369#comment-312646</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[foxmarks: and of course I must add that in our exchanges on this subject I disagree that &quot;corporate raider&quot; describes Romney&#039;s career at Bain.  No one has dug up any deals that are unequivocally of the type you mention that occurred on his watch, and there are only a few that are even somewhat ambiguous.  I believe that the record exonerates him.  I&#039;m not going to spend more time on this, however, but I refer readers back to conversations that begin &lt;a href=&quot;http://neoneocon.com/2012/01/12/newt-and-the-publics-right-to-know-about-bain-capital/#comment-304907&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;here&lt;/a&gt; and keep going for quite some time (I have quite a few entries there in reponse to foxmarks, as do others).  There&#039;s a bit more in &lt;a href=&quot;http://neoneocon.com/2012/01/12/romney-at-bain-job-creator-or-destroyer/#comment-304851&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;this thread&lt;/a&gt;, and quite a bit &lt;a href=&quot;http://neoneocon.com/2012/01/11/calling-all-newt-supporters/#comment-304555&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;here&lt;/a&gt;.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>foxmarks: and of course I must add that in our exchanges on this subject I disagree that &#8220;corporate raider&#8221; describes Romney&#8217;s career at Bain.  No one has dug up any deals that are unequivocally of the type you mention that occurred on his watch, and there are only a few that are even somewhat ambiguous.  I believe that the record exonerates him.  I&#8217;m not going to spend more time on this, however, but I refer readers back to conversations that begin <a href="http://neoneocon.com/2012/01/12/newt-and-the-publics-right-to-know-about-bain-capital/#comment-304907" rel="nofollow">here</a> and keep going for quite some time (I have quite a few entries there in reponse to foxmarks, as do others).  There&#8217;s a bit more in <a href="http://neoneocon.com/2012/01/12/romney-at-bain-job-creator-or-destroyer/#comment-304851" rel="nofollow">this thread</a>, and quite a bit <a href="http://neoneocon.com/2012/01/11/calling-all-newt-supporters/#comment-304555" rel="nofollow">here</a>.</p>
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		<title>
		By: foxmarks		</title>
		<link>https://thenewneo.com/2012/02/01/after-florida/#comment-312635</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[foxmarks]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 03 Feb 2012 06:18:42 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://neoneocon.com/?p=13369#comment-312635</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[goldby621: neo and I have gone back-and-forth about Romney’s career. At length. Multiple times. Your presumption of my ignorance may be a product of your own lack of understanding.

If people who sound like you took the time to distinguish that Romney had two distinct terms with Bain Capital, you would perhaps begin to see the problems with his puffing capitalism. Mitt wants you to focus on his first term, where he led venture capital deals. I want you to also see his second term, where he led LBOs (under their new term, “private equity”). Romney was both a venture capitalist &lt;b&gt;and&lt;/b&gt; a corporate raider. He abandoned VC to become a vulture.

The inconvenient ugly parts of Mitt’s record are as much of “what he’s all about” as Newt’s philandering and his time on the couch with Pelosi. We see better with both eyes uncovered.

And I wish the chest-thumping simpletons who equate patriotism with capitalism would investigate the last three decades of debt US accumulation, both gov’t and private. Romney capitalized on easy credit that was the result of gov’t policy. Mitt’s money was leverage that he cashed out, not any “amazing” business success.

Remember, too, the Olympics he “saved” lost over $100M. Romney is groomed to be captain of the Titanic.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>goldby621: neo and I have gone back-and-forth about Romney’s career. At length. Multiple times. Your presumption of my ignorance may be a product of your own lack of understanding.</p>
<p>If people who sound like you took the time to distinguish that Romney had two distinct terms with Bain Capital, you would perhaps begin to see the problems with his puffing capitalism. Mitt wants you to focus on his first term, where he led venture capital deals. I want you to also see his second term, where he led LBOs (under their new term, “private equity”). Romney was both a venture capitalist <b>and</b> a corporate raider. He abandoned VC to become a vulture.</p>
<p>The inconvenient ugly parts of Mitt’s record are as much of “what he’s all about” as Newt’s philandering and his time on the couch with Pelosi. We see better with both eyes uncovered.</p>
<p>And I wish the chest-thumping simpletons who equate patriotism with capitalism would investigate the last three decades of debt US accumulation, both gov’t and private. Romney capitalized on easy credit that was the result of gov’t policy. Mitt’s money was leverage that he cashed out, not any “amazing” business success.</p>
<p>Remember, too, the Olympics he “saved” lost over $100M. Romney is groomed to be captain of the Titanic.</p>
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		<title>
		By: rickl		</title>
		<link>https://thenewneo.com/2012/02/01/after-florida/#comment-312607</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[rickl]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 03 Feb 2012 04:32:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://neoneocon.com/?p=13369#comment-312607</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[Clinton &lt;i&gt;should&lt;/i&gt; have impeached for trading military technology to the Chinese Communists in exchange for campaign contributions, but the Congressional Republicans chose to make it about a stupid sex scandal instead.

That&#039;s about the point where I stopped taking the Republican Party seriously.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Clinton <i>should</i> have impeached for trading military technology to the Chinese Communists in exchange for campaign contributions, but the Congressional Republicans chose to make it about a stupid sex scandal instead.</p>
<p>That&#8217;s about the point where I stopped taking the Republican Party seriously.</p>
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		<title>
		By: neo-neocon		</title>
		<link>https://thenewneo.com/2012/02/01/after-florida/#comment-312489</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[neo-neocon]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 02 Feb 2012 21:07:55 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://neoneocon.com/?p=13369#comment-312489</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[gcotharn: actually, I&#039;ve done a lot of research on that, too (somewhere, I&#039;ve got a draft for a post), and while I sort of agree with you I sort of disagree as well.  The summary version of what I found is this: Gingrich was indeed driving the impeachment fight early in the game.  However, if you look at his public utterances, he was very careful to focus on the legal issues of obstruction of justice, and lying in the deposition.  I am relatively sure he did this because of his own extracurricular activities at the time.  But whatever his motive, Gingrich did not go after Clinton for infidelity, but &lt;a href=&quot;http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Impeachment_of_Bill_Clinton#Impeachment_by_House_of_Representatives&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;did go after him&lt;/a&gt; for his behavior in the legal sense during the episode.

Gingrich had had expectations that the Clinton scandal, which had been going on for months by the time of the November 1998 election, would cause the Republicans to gain many seats.  Instead, they lost seats.  He resigned right after those 1998 elections (pressured by his colleagues to do so), and so he was no longer in the House when the actual impeachment proceedings occurred.  But that doesn&#039;t mean he was not a leader earlier in the decisions made; he was, and he also had almost certainly planned to be Speaker when it happened.  But the 1998 election results, and his colleagues who were sick of him, scotched that.
]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>gcotharn: actually, I&#8217;ve done a lot of research on that, too (somewhere, I&#8217;ve got a draft for a post), and while I sort of agree with you I sort of disagree as well.  The summary version of what I found is this: Gingrich was indeed driving the impeachment fight early in the game.  However, if you look at his public utterances, he was very careful to focus on the legal issues of obstruction of justice, and lying in the deposition.  I am relatively sure he did this because of his own extracurricular activities at the time.  But whatever his motive, Gingrich did not go after Clinton for infidelity, but <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Impeachment_of_Bill_Clinton#Impeachment_by_House_of_Representatives" rel="nofollow">did go after him</a> for his behavior in the legal sense during the episode.</p>
<p>Gingrich had had expectations that the Clinton scandal, which had been going on for months by the time of the November 1998 election, would cause the Republicans to gain many seats.  Instead, they lost seats.  He resigned right after those 1998 elections (pressured by his colleagues to do so), and so he was no longer in the House when the actual impeachment proceedings occurred.  But that doesn&#8217;t mean he was not a leader earlier in the decisions made; he was, and he also had almost certainly planned to be Speaker when it happened.  But the 1998 election results, and his colleagues who were sick of him, scotched that.</p>
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		<title>
		By: gcotharn		</title>
		<link>https://thenewneo.com/2012/02/01/after-florida/#comment-312484</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[gcotharn]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 02 Feb 2012 20:44:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://neoneocon.com/?p=13369#comment-312484</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[I have to set the record straight: Newt was not &quot;foaming at the mouth&quot; to impeach Clinton for sex. That is one of those media legends which are not true.

I have, in past, googled through a search for Newt comments re Clinton and sex. There are none. Newt did not run the House Impeachment process. Newt was busy running the Repub effort in the 1998 midterm election.  After the election, Newt was (wrongly? I think so) deemed a failed leader (due to lost seats), and was forced out in early 1999.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I have to set the record straight: Newt was not &#8220;foaming at the mouth&#8221; to impeach Clinton for sex. That is one of those media legends which are not true.</p>
<p>I have, in past, googled through a search for Newt comments re Clinton and sex. There are none. Newt did not run the House Impeachment process. Newt was busy running the Repub effort in the 1998 midterm election.  After the election, Newt was (wrongly? I think so) deemed a failed leader (due to lost seats), and was forced out in early 1999.</p>
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		<title>
		By: newton		</title>
		<link>https://thenewneo.com/2012/02/01/after-florida/#comment-312455</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[newton]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 02 Feb 2012 19:24:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://neoneocon.com/?p=13369#comment-312455</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[&quot;And that is the whole problem with Newt: He may be very bright. He may have a dozen ideas a minute.&quot;

Could there be a possibility that he has a case of undiagnosed ADD?  Anybody with an opinion or a suspicion on it?

His life has been quite erratic, to say the least.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;And that is the whole problem with Newt: He may be very bright. He may have a dozen ideas a minute.&#8221;</p>
<p>Could there be a possibility that he has a case of undiagnosed ADD?  Anybody with an opinion or a suspicion on it?</p>
<p>His life has been quite erratic, to say the least.</p>
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		<title>
		By: Curtis		</title>
		<link>https://thenewneo.com/2012/02/01/after-florida/#comment-312428</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Curtis]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 02 Feb 2012 17:55:16 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://neoneocon.com/?p=13369#comment-312428</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[Very well put, Mr. Gold. I have to agree. The American Spectator has an article today that mirrors your points.

What scares me about Romney, though, is that he is not the man to lead us back to pre New Deal constitutional government. But, I&#039;ll take what he does reform and keep working on the grass roots level.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Very well put, Mr. Gold. I have to agree. The American Spectator has an article today that mirrors your points.</p>
<p>What scares me about Romney, though, is that he is not the man to lead us back to pre New Deal constitutional government. But, I&#8217;ll take what he does reform and keep working on the grass roots level.</p>
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		<title>
		By: NeoConScum		</title>
		<link>https://thenewneo.com/2012/02/01/after-florida/#comment-312426</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[NeoConScum]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 02 Feb 2012 17:49:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://neoneocon.com/?p=13369#comment-312426</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[Curtis...Read goldby621...Got it..?  Gooooood.

Newt&#039;s baggage+more baggage+temperament=??

Wonder how American women will vote for Newt who&#039;s partnered with his Mistress-Wife? Just one of dozens of flies in the ointment.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Curtis&#8230;Read goldby621&#8230;Got it..?  Gooooood.</p>
<p>Newt&#8217;s baggage+more baggage+temperament=??</p>
<p>Wonder how American women will vote for Newt who&#8217;s partnered with his Mistress-Wife? Just one of dozens of flies in the ointment.</p>
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		By: Newt&#039;s Temperamant Problem &#38; Why Romney Really is More Electable - ScrollPost.com		</title>
		<link>https://thenewneo.com/2012/02/01/after-florida/#comment-312421</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Newt&#039;s Temperamant Problem &#38; Why Romney Really is More Electable - ScrollPost.com]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 02 Feb 2012 17:24:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://neoneocon.com/?p=13369#comment-312421</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[[...] Neo-neocon makes the same point:I think a big part of Gingrich’s problem is temperament, and the problem is real. As far as Newt’s supporters are concerned, his anger is one of his strengths and not a problem at all. When it’s directed at the media it seems to work for him, although that may be getting a bit old. When it’s directed at Mitt Romney it has been working less effectively, especially when it features attacks that are from the left and/or hyperbole. [...]]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[&#8230;] Neo-neocon makes the same point:I think a big part of Gingrich’s problem is temperament, and the problem is real. As far as Newt’s supporters are concerned, his anger is one of his strengths and not a problem at all. When it’s directed at the media it seems to work for him, although that may be getting a bit old. When it’s directed at Mitt Romney it has been working less effectively, especially when it features attacks that are from the left and/or hyperbole. [&#8230;]</p>
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