“The bigger question is “When is violence against the State justified?” And by whom? That question was satisfactorily answered by Thos. Jefferson and confrers, and we need not look further”

I’m not sure those are the right questions. The question that interests me is what are legitimate targets. I’m thinking youth camp is not one. Bombs to kill civilian government workers, for symbolism, is not either.

So when your government, run by the Muslim Brotherhood in such connections as Hillary Clinton’s staffer, is somehow going to declare war in America’s security interests?

I don’t think it’ll work out as easily as that.

Americans may find that when it comes time to declare war on the enemy, that the enemy is them…

“Now, who would do this and why?”

yeah, it is interesting. I’m not sure it is true, but if so…

“The whole Christian fundamentalist/terrorist thing is astounding to me. My guess is that unless you can create in your mind the a relativistic equivalent to Islamic Terrorism you are required to face facts.”

Yeah, on one side you have a religion and group of authors that either don’t say use violence on one side to saying don’t use violence on the other side… Then with Islam you have a religion that says use it with a bunch of cheerleaders / authors saying ‘ditto’… to be fair; another Islamic groups that don’t say use it.

Soviet Active Measures in the
“Post-Cold War” Era 1988-1991

A Report Prepared at the Request of the
United States House of Representatives
Committee on Appropriations
by the United States Information Agency
June 1992
intellit.muskingum.edu/russia_folder/pcw_era/index.htm#Contents

they have a stupendous reading list..
even for the birthers… 🙂

Agursky, Mikhail. “Soviet Disinformation and Forgeries.” International Journal of World Peace 6, no. 1 (Jan.-Mar. 1989)

The Soviet Cultural Offensive. Princeton, NJ: Princeton University Press, 1960. Barghoorn, Frederick C.

“America was the top target for most KGB operations, but most were dirty tricks that were often as crude as they were farcical…. Among the more successful was an attempt to throw suspicion on the CIA for involvement in the assassination of President Kennedy, the allegation that Martin Luther King was in the pay of President Johnson and the assiduous cultivation of rumours that J. Edgar Hoover … was a closet homosexual and cross-dresser. But there were also numerous attempts to smear American politicians, operations to stir up racial hatred by disseminating forged pamphlets denouncing black people as ‘race monkeys’ and attempts to recruit Zbigniew Brzezinski … as a Soviet agent.”
“US Was Main Target of Dirty Tricks.” Times (London), 13 Sep. 1999 Michael Binyon

The Deception Game: Czechoslovak Intelligence in Soviet Political Warfare. Syracuse, NY: Syracuse University Research Corp., 1972. New York: Ballantine, 1981. Bittman, Ladislav.

.The New Image-Makers: Soviet Propaganda and Disinformation Today. Washington, DC: Permagon-Brassey’s, 1988 Bittman, Ladislav.

Bittman, Ladislav, ed. “The Messages from Moscow 1989.” Propaganda- Disinformation-Persuasion 3, no. 1 (Summer 1990). [Published by Boston University, College of Communication, Program for the Study of Disinformation Papers.]

if you ever want to read and know alot, read ladislav.. lots of books, information, and such… LOTS

Operation INFEKTION: Soviet Bloc Intelligence and Its AIDS Disinformation Campaign / Studies in Intelligence 53, no. 4 (Dec. 2009)

Having effectively harnessed the dynamics of rumors and conspiracy theories, Soviet bloc intelligence had created a monster that has outlived its creators. Boghardt, Thomas.

. “The Peace Movement and the Soviet Union.” Commentary 73, no. 5 (1982) Bukovsky

Moscow’s Words, Western Voices. Washington, DC: Accuracy in Media, 1995.
Campbell “traces how four prominent journalists — I.F. Stone, Alexander Cockburn, Walter Duranty, and Wilfred Burchett — repeated Soviet propaganda themes consistently during their careers.” The author “systematically analyzes their major writings and shows how political orientation skewed the reliability of what was passed off to readers as ‘objective reporting.'”

“Soviet Use of Active Measures.” Current Policy 761 William casey

“The Power of Disinformation: The Lie that Linked CIA to the Kennedy Assassination.” Studies in Intelligence 11 Holland, Max.

Double Lives: Spies and Writers in the Secret Soviet War of Ideas Against the West. New York: Free Press, 1993. Double Lives: Stalin, Willi Mé¼nzenberg and the Seduction of the Intellectuals. London: HarperCollins, 1994. Rev. ed. New York: Enigma Books, 2004. stephen koch

this is the story of the “Soviet secret apparatus that successfully manipulated” Hemingway, Hellman, Dos Passos, Brecht, and others “to work on a propaganda campaign on behalf of the Comintern. One man masterminded the effort — the German communist publisher Willi Munzenberg.” Aldrich, I&NS 11.3, says that Koch “demonstrates effectively the direct Soviet manipulation of … many important figures in the 1930s.”

The Red Millionaire: A Political Biography of Willi Mé¼nzenberg, Moscow’s Secret Propaganda Tsar in the West (New Haven, CT: Yale University Press, 2004). Sean McMeekin

The Bureaucracy of Truth: How Communist Governments Manage the News. London: Burnett, 1981. Lendvai

there is a whole lot more..
which is why if you know the history, you cant just write off things… if you dont, its easy to.

or to put it the way james jesus angleton did
https://www.cia.gov/library/center-for-the-study-of-intelligence/csi-publications/csi-studies/studies/vol53no4/201ccunning-passages-contrived-corridors201d.html

the lore about Angleton is more familiar than his ideas, accomplishments, and true shortcomings because much of the publicly available information about him is highly partisan, generated by a range of intelligence veterans, scholars, journalists, and fiction and film writers who have maligned or embellished his career to the point that much of what is supposedly known of him is a mix of fact and fiction.

Given the Soviets’ record of success at penetration and deception operations going back to the 1920s, and with no current evidence to the contrary, Angleton was justified in presuming CIA also was victimized. However, there was no other source, human or technical, that he could use to guide him on the molehunt – only his favored source, KGB defector Anatoli Golitsyn, and their symbiotic relationship soon became professionally unbalanced as the manipulative and self-promoting defector’s allegations of international treachery grew more fantastical.

except that now a whole lot of what Golitsun claimed has come true, and has been coming true.

http://www.amazon.com/Perestroika-Deception-Memoranda-Central-Intelligence/product-reviews/189979803X

Mr. Golitsyn has a 94% accuracy record of predicting Soviet strategy from his last work, “New Lies for Old.”

from discussing the invention of using planes as a weapon (before 9/11), to the coming financial crisis, the deception of russia which now is becoming more clear, and so forth..

most people would rather not read any of this history stuff, as it makes reality scary…

The Norway mass murder serves practically every U.N. agenda simultaneously. It really is spooky to see how all of this stuff is connected, and you don’t need to dig down very far at all to find these connections

no… you dont… in fact, since its collective action, you can see the relationships, we just deny they mean anything….

notice how you say what he did fits perfect…

well, after reading some more… i noticed some stuff.

can anyone here define a “cut out”?

In espionage parlance, a cutout is a mutually trusted intermediary, method or channel of communication, facilitating the exchange of information between agents.

By definition, a “cutout” does not know the source or destination the information being transmitted, or the identities of any persons involved in the espionage process. Thus, a captured cutout cannot be used to identify members of an espionage cell.

read carefully his own words where and how he did what he did and where he referenced getting stuff and where he ACTUALLY went…

also note that there is an inconvenient mexican group calle templars too.

The Templar Knights, a new drug cartel that was created after it splintered from the La Familia cartel last March, has issued a code-of-conduct booklet for members saying it is fighting a war against tyranny and injustice.

things get weird, and as always, ambiguity protects or obfuscates any real conclusion… (at least direct logic… preponderance over years is another story – which is why the game of hiding and denying… you cant add up things if you dont count them… )

Breivik, was actually a member of Norway’s Grand Lodge
[IF you like masons as the moriarties instead of jews or the illuminati…. sigh]

his works claim he went to a meeting of theirs in 2002 where they discussed re-awakening the Knights Templar… (and defending Rome)

I met with them for the first time in London… the founding session in London, 2002. I was the youngest one there, 23 years old at the time. One of the key founders instructed the rest of the group about several topics related to the goal of the organisation. I believe I scribbled down more than 50 full pages of notes regarding all possible related topics. Much of these notes are forwarded in the book 2083. It was basically a detailed long term plan on how to seize power in Western Europe.

of course this kind of thing matches the same kind of planning revealed by a senatorial aid in Grinding America down, but that was from communists, not masons… (my memory is seldom matched – and the internet makes it have incredible recall detail… hee hee)

but the key comes here:
Breivik explains that he had come into contact with Serbian “cultural conservatives”…

As soon as that was mentioned, there came the cut outs and the “innocents clubs” fronts model… pose as a new organization, get some people to come, equip them, and so on… with these cut out intermediaries setting the willing up to do the thing and take the fall.

one thing i must point out is that Breivik sought out something… believed what he found… and was NOT RESOURCEFUL… that is, and i cant give any details here, he never figured out alternative means rather than connecting, believing then acting…

there is a major difference between capability and ability and action… those with the knowlege and will, tend not to act… those without it and willing to act, tend to want ‘consumables’, and they get advice and are provided… the provisions and such are what affods the providers control… (see cuba, chavez, n korea, etc etc etc)

remember that “vast right wing conspiracy” is the béªte noire of the left just as moriarty is to sherlock holmes…

I WILL point out that the people playing dictatorial games DO NOT want the general public to read Breiviks work.

ALSO… if one needs a reason, besides the obvious repetitive greif and games…

the reason may be this simple:
How do you get a manual of arts into the hands of many many people and get them to read it, and which raises the statistical probability of such information being used over time?

while the paper is saying he is nuts… a WHOLE lot in what he writes is about as nutty as the military colleges and ideas they publish in white papers you can sometimes read (and a lot of the early socialist thinking stuff too).

the coming insurrection was not popular here in the US… nor are things like the handbooks made for ghanna, and south africa, and so on…

his manifesto is MOSTLY historical justification…
the priori of zion was similar and is the longest running active measure…

and then technique, explanations and such… remove the actions he took and clean it up, and its a manual for insurrection and other things.

August and early September 2010, Breivik spent six days in the Czech Republic. it was in prague that he purcahsed the badges for the uniforms he used.

Breivik admits that he visited Belarus and studied the regime of President Alexander Lukashenko in his 1500 page work..
I was in Belarus and I can personally confirm this. I personally spoke with dozens of people who have no choice but to consume irradiated goods. Sixty percent of the radiation fell on the territory of Belarus and the dictatorship continues to intentionally feed its population with irradiated products.

he lists nationalist organizations in europe:
Syarhey Haidukevich’s Liberal Democratic Party of Belarus

Founded in 1989, Vladimir Zhirinovsky’s Liberal Democratic Party of Russia was one of the first potemkin parties founded during the era of glasnost and perestroika in the Soviet Union. There is evidence that Zhirinovsky is a KGB/FSB agent who was tasked with creating a false opposition party to promote the illusion of democracy in the Soviet system.

http://www.muskingum.edu/
specifically
intellit.muskingum.edu/
more specifically

Soviet Active Measures in The
‘Post-Cold War’ Era 1988-1991

Internal Front Groups:
Vladimir Zhirinovsky and
The “Centrist Bloc”
intellit.muskingum.edu/russia_folder/pcw_era/sect_07.htm

but hey! what good is memory if you never knew it in the first place or you forget it? 🙂

[reading the paper would point out so many things that are here in the US now… but we dont know how to identify them, or see them… and if you say anything, well you must be a nutter, and or tin hatter, or conspiracy theorist, etc… none of which address the actuality of anything]

The chairman of the Liberal Democratic Party was Vladimir Zhirinovsky, who, in contrast to the leaders of the other parties, was a political unknown. A journalist familiar with his background termed Zhirinovsky’s appearance on the political scene “an April Fools’ joke.” He wrote in the July 17, 1990 issue of Komsomolets Uzbekistana:

It seems that somebody was desperate to show – following the relevant decisions of the CPSU CC and the USSR Supreme Soviet – how fast political pluralism has developed in the Soviet Union. At the same time, they do not want to advertize the real competitors of the CPSU. Therefore, the bubble of the Liberal Democratic Party was inflated.

hmmmm came out of nowhere… etc..
study history and you will note that people dont come out of nowhere and win without something being up… (see Obadiah – and kathy boudins parents history… hmmmm)

anyway.. Liberal democratic party was a communist front… (and here?)

a polish company sold him the explosive material fertilizer… “He names the 17th century Polish king Jan III Sobieski, who defeated the Ottoman Turks at the gates of Vienna, as one of his heroes Polish media have reported.”

he never visited poland… but he did visit belarus, which borders it..

Norway shooter praises Putin, Nashi
http://www.globalpost.com/dispatches/globalpost-blogs/bric-yard/norway-shooter-praises-putin-nashi

The Pope or Vladimir Putin. Putin seems like a fair and resolute leader worthy of respect. I’m unsure at this point whether he has the potential to be our best friend or our worst enemy though. He’s very hard to psychoanalyze. I wouldn’t want to be his enemy, that’s for sure. Obviously, he has to openly condemn us at this point which is understandable.

the best parallels i can draw is OSWALD…

in which there is connections, ambiguity, and so on… and no way to ever resolve any of it!!!!!!!!!!!

except that they never isolated and kept kacynsky quiet… and oswald never got the chance to be a big mouth. perhaps we will find that he hung himself while in isolation?

it would have been very easy for the services to make a cut out and feed his fantasy that he really connected with something, guide his false reality, and so exploit what comes of it…

dont think so? (then read about how they bombed our embassy and suddenly putin wants back into the presidents seat so he can be the one to go toe to toe with obama… and on and on as that part now is suddenly falling apart. and even china is now threatening with a whole bunch of new equipment out, super fast missles, shikval torpedoes, emp device tested on carnival cruise ship, etc)

he is the other side of the muslim cut out.
the opposite reflection..
just as the poor muslims convinced and supplied (care to check out the kind of explosives found mostly? it isnt C4, its Semtex), by russia..

Semtex is a general-purpose plastic explosive containing RDX and PETN. It is used in commercial blasting, demolition, and in certain military applications. Semtex became notoriously popular with terrorists because it was, until recently, extremely difficult to detect, as in the case of Pan Am Flight 103.

[i wont say the differences with C4 and others]

Semtex was invented in the late 1950s by Stanislav Brebera, a chemist at VCHZ Synthesia, Czechoslovakia. The explosive is named after Semté­n, a suburb of Pardubice in the Czech Republic where the mixture was first manufactured starting in 1964.

its the “Blowfeld fighting fish strategy”

they are trying to start something that then can blow up…

we look to germany… but we seldom look to how a stalin would embolden a hitler to start the game…

who took all the blame despite a partnership to kick things off?

same with palestine and the PLO… read the stuff from the archive.

so… if one is to NOT remove data for arbitrary reasons, the whole of it is more complex than what anyone really is saying…

one cant enter belarus, and just hang out and not be noticed… some states do not operate the same as others.

the whole move to fertilizer and such came after semtex became associated with terrorism all round the world… and since the only maker was the one place…

however, interesting trivia… today commercial semtex has a detection taggant… but this was in 1991 and beyond…

but 700 tons of Semtex were exported to Libya between 1975 and 1981 by Omnipol. and there is nothing stopping them from running off a batch without it for special reasons…

[what does that say about tsa?]

anyway.
in case you havent noticed. the story is dying real fast… and THAT is a sign in itself that someone doesnt want people to look too closely… why? well both ‘sides’ would concure… the side that helped if they helped would want it to die… and the side that noticed that his manifesto is also a methods textbook, may want it to die too.

The contradiction is this. If Islam really is inherently and imperialistically evil, then we really do have a duty to eradicate it, abroad and especially at home. But most anti-Islam bloggers really don’t believe this; while we all know Islam has many villains, the anti-Islam crowd is peaceful, non-violent, non-revolutionary, and really is willing to tolerate others of different beliefs as long as we all follow the same civilized rules.

This means apocalyptic, conspiratorial rhetoric against Islam is irresponsible, because the hardline anti-Islam stance is just a pose for the internetz, and someone might take it seriously.

Two questions:

1. Where there be a full investigation;

2. Will there be the will to force a full investigation?