With all due respect, I believe the fact that a government operates as a terrorist government demonstrates a situation of “extreme need.” On saving lives: If the US had retaliated appropriately in ’79 after the embassy takeover 9/11 might never have happened. But all the Middle East observed, noted and surely acted on the basis of those observations. The Iranians are directly responsible for many American deaths since ’79 through the utilization of terrorists and terrorist groups. Furthermore, by committing an act of war(the embassy takeover) and sponsoring terrorism over the ensuing years with impunity, demonstrating America’s almost total inability to respond to a variety of aggressive acts of war, Iran is thus indirectly responsible for many more deaths, perhaps even “many thousands.”
 

I don’t know what gets your goat, Justin, but this to me is pretty funny.

What happened to the duel for debate, Justin, where you win and he loses, but he gets to try and kill you anyways?

It’s a good piece of internet stored news, Ariel, that is true. However as good and hearty a picture the account portrays, you can now see with clear 20/20 hindsight that there was a mass movement to raise the morale of people who supported the war, then through careful negative stereotyping, plummet us to the depths of despair. I can’t give too much credit to the media, they aren’t competent enough to plan such a coup, but the propaganda apparatus of various terroist organizations are. They were the ones who took advantage of the gift, the media gave when they painted such luscious images of liberation and freedom and joy. The road to hell is paved with good intentions, and lined with the bodies of those who sought to protect the weak.

The lesson is clear: Never negotiate with terrorist states. Always crush terrorist governments without mercy.

I don’t favor crushing terroist governments. I’m in favor something more subtle.

That’s a pretty good precept, sergey. I’m not a believer in manifest destiny or revealed religion, but I’ve come to much the same conclusions as you. Except about the start of the British Empire, that I’ll have to look into more.

All these multiple comments of mine? Just think of them as recouping several of the comments I haven’t made here.

you know neo, whoever is around to blame, gets it. Target of convenience. Such is human nature, and prone to propaganda ploys.

Being nice to your true allies, and smiting your foes, is a lot better than overthrowing your friends and being nice to your enemies.

Unfortunately, liberation becomes occupation. I don’t doubt the Iraqis want us gone, but I do doubt that they want us gone before the government is stable and somewhat firmly in control. Distinctions the “reality-based” crowd often seem unable to grasp.

“The scenes in the Iraqi capital were chaotic. Jubilant Iraqis welcomed advancing US forces in Baghdad while rampaging looters attacked symbols of Saddam Hussein’s power.

Residents threw flowers at the armoured column as it swept past, just three kilometres east of the central Jumhuriyya Bridge over the Tigris river. Joy at the apparent removal of Saddam Hussein was tangible, with one man beating a canvas portrait of him with his slipper.

Crowds threw flowers at the Marines as they drove past the Martyrs’ Monument, just three km (two miles) east of the central Jumhuriya Bridge over the river Tigris.

“No more Saddam Hussein,” chanted one group, waving to troops as they passed. “We love you, we love you.” One young man ran alongside a Marine armoured personnel carrier trying to hand over a heavy belt of ammunition. An older man made a wild kicking gesture with his foot, saying “Goodbye Saddam”.

Women waved from balconies, girls threw flower petals at young Marines leaning across gun turrets. One woman held her baby aloft. Tank crews picked the flowers from the tops of their fighting machines, smelt them and grinned. Crowds of Shia men beat their chests in the streets.

Other signs of a breakdown were also apparent. Journalists at the Palestine Hotel confirmed that their minders had disappeared.”

http://www.ccmep.org/2003_articles/Iraq/041003_us_stops_short_of_announcing_vic.htm
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